Stanley Cup Final - Chicago vs. Philadelphia

[The Comish]

Hopefully you're not looking for more, because you won't be getting it.

I'm always looking for more, that's why I'm single and won't be "getting it" anytime soon!

[mister_mcgoo]

Well I'll man up and admit that I was wrong about the Flyers, I thought the Hawks would blow thru them in 4 games (or 5 at the most) and instead they played a tough series and never gave up. Frankly I'm scared to be stuck in the same conference with them with the way that team is built, when you can get scoring across 3 lines, physical play from the whole team and shut down D you're gonna have a lot of success. Kudos for their great run this year.

But again, the orange colored glasses are clouding some visions here I think. The Hawks simply outplayed the Flyers for the better part of the series and dominated when it mattered most and that's why they're the Stanley Cup champions. You guys can make whatever arguments you want for why the Flyers 'shoulda' won but you're not convincing anyone but yourselves I don't think...and that's totally fine, its impossible to be unbiased when you passionately live and die by a team. To this day I STILL think the Habs shoulda beaten the Flames in '89 but it doesn't change the end result, the Habs lost in 6, just like this series.

To borrow a little from boxing I'll score the series like a boxing match:

Game 1: Hawks 10 - 9
Game 2: Hawks 10 - 8
Game 3: Flyers 10 - 9
Game 4: Flyers 10 - 8
Game 5: Hawks 10 - 7
Game 6: Hawks 10 - 8

Hawks 57 - Flyers 52

[Bomm Bastic]

Philly played out of their minds, and made the 'Hawks earn it....which is great for hockey. But in the end The 'Hawks took everything Philly was able to throw at them, and still won the series.

The 'Hawks were the superior team.

[AJB86]

The thing is there is not a Flyer's fan on here trying to say the Flyers were the better team or that they should have won. Everyone agrees the Hawks were the better team. All the Flyer's fans are saying and have been saying is that the difference was not nearly as big as it was made out to be and I think that was proved by a very tight series.

I take issue with Mcgoo's posts more than any other poster on here but he gains mad respect from me for stepping up and admitting he was wrong about the Flyer's.

For another poster, maybe if you don't want to be quoted you should admit when you grossly underestimated a team and continued to throughout the entire series. Go ahead and quote me good luck finding a single post that was egriegously wrong as several of yours.

[doulos]

Like I said, I don't play that game.

I prefer Halo 3 and Chess.

[AJB86]

Like I said, I don't play that game.

I prefer Halo 3 and Chess.

Haha, not the least bit surprised.

[Big Ev]

Why wasn't he allowed to say that, in his opinion, he thought the Hawks dominated? That's HIS opinion, and it's not farfetched in the slightest.

[Atomic Wedgy]

I like the boxing analogy. Doulos' opinion is a good one. He's earned my respect over the years. Sometime I disagree with the opinion of others, but that does make me right or them wrong. Its a friggin opinion!

I'm still quite bitter over losing tho and I suspect that wont go away for many weeks.

[AJB86]

I like the boxing analogy. Doulos' opinion is a good one. He's earned my respect over the years. Sometime I disagree with the opinion of others, but that does make me right or them wrong. Its a friggin opinion!

I'm still quite bitter over losing tho and I suspect that wont go away for many weeks.

Again, in 6 games Hawks 25- Flyers 22. In MY FRIGGIN OPINION that's far from dominance. You can't argue with stats. Unless your going to tell me that Leighton far out played Niemi.

State your opinon and spout off all you want but when you are wrong be man enought to admit it.

[mister_mcgoo]

Again, in 6 games Hawks 25- Flyers 22. In MY FRIGGIN OPINION that's far from dominance. You can't argue with stats. Unless your going to tell me that Leighton far out played Niemi.

State your opinon and spout off all you want but when you are wrong be man enought to admit it.

ummmm, you realize AW is a Flyers fan too right? lmao, why are you getting so wound up here?

pointing only to how many goals were scored as your point of reference is sort of stupid IMO too, it completely ignores the dynamic of the games, the flow, the big plays, penalties, soft goals etc. For example, game 3 and 4 in Philly were the games where the Flyers really played their best (esp game 4) and really took it to the Hawks, but the scores in those games certainly don't reflect that (i.e. two one-goal victories (I don't count Carter's empty netter as indicative of jack shit)). You might be able to focus solely on stats in the fantasy world, but in the real world you're much better off watching the game and forming an objective opinion on the games.

I dunno why you are so bent out of shape with people expressing their opinions on the series...you think it was a close series, good for you but the majority of us see it otherwise, most of us just didn't think it was that close but still feel the Flyers put up a helluva fight, take that for what it is...or leave it...either way dude

[Atomic Wedgy]

I'm not sure why you are quoting me... but you win and are the Champion of everything.

[AJB86]

ummmm, you realize AW is a Flyers fan too right? lmao, why are you getting so wound up here?

pointing only to how many goals were scored as your point of reference is sort of stupid IMO too, it completely ignores the dynamic of the games, the flow, the big plays, penalties, soft goals etc. For example, game 3 and 4 in Philly were the games where the Flyers really played their best (esp game 4) and really took it to the Hawks, but the scores in those games certainly don't reflect that (i.e. two one-goal victories (I don't count Carter's empty netter as indicative of jack shit)). You might be able to focus solely on stats in the fantasy world, but in the real world you're much better off watching the game and forming an objective opinion on the games.

I dunno why you are so bent out of shape with people expressing their opinions on the series...you think it was a close series, good for you but the majority of us see it otherwise, most of us just didn't think it was that close but still feel the Flyers put up a helluva fight, take that for what it is...or leave it...either way dude

Yah the Flyer's logo in his sig kinda tipped me off.

What got me wound upwas what I percieved was a bunchof bandwagon "fans" who formed an opinion on the series and then refused to alter it no matter what actually happened. I saw no "objective" opinions just an utter lack of respect from start to finish.

Even the whole "It wasn't even close" "The Flyers put up a helluva a fight" seems to be talking out both sides of your mouth much the same way as the "Philly was dominant" "Philly barely beat a half-assed Montreal team" was in the Flyers-Habs series.

Those are my opinions but apparently you have to have over 7000 posts before you can express them so I'll stop now. I've already been apppointed the "Champion of the everything". I thought the Conn Smythe woulda put Toews over the top for that one but whatever that's just my opinion so I'll take he award as long as it comes with 1.3 mill.

[mister_mcgoo]

What got me wound upwas what I percieved was a bunchof bandwagon "fans" who formed an opinion on the series and then refused to alter it no matter what actually happened. I saw no "objective" opinions just an utter lack of respect from start to finish.

Even the whole "It wasn't even close" "The Flyers put up a helluva a fight" seems to be talking out both sides of your mouth much the same way as the "Philly was dominant" "Philly barely beat a half-assed Montreal team" was in the Flyers-Habs series.

Well I hope you don't see me as a 'bandwagon' fan, the Hawks are my favorite orig 6 team outside the Habs and I really like the players on this latest incarnation (Toews, Keith, etc) so I was happy to cheer for them and see them win. But as to the other stuff remember you're seeing this thru Flyers eyes so what you perceive as a 'lack of respect' is simply non-fans seeing it perhaps a bit more dispassionately and objectively. I looked at this matchup as the Flyers being big underdogs for serveral reasons (though as I've noted, they played much better than I ever expected), I thought end to end CHI was just a better team on every dimension, I thought Philly played weaker teams to get to the finals, I didn't trust their goalies, they had a couple key injuries and most of all they were a 7th seed and 15th overall

That last point was of particular interest to me, especially in light of all the bravado so I crunched all the numbers and laid a small wager with my sportsbook. Since the league began sending 16 teams to the playoffs in 1980 there has NEVER been a 7th seed win, in fact:

-the lowest seed to ever to win the Cup was in 1995 - NJ (6th in conference, 10th overall). Though I put a big asterix next to that since it was the half-season lockout that year.
-after that the breakdown is pretty clear cut:

5th seeds - 1
4th seeds - 5
3rd seeds - 3
2nd seeds - 8
1st seeds - 12

in fact the average conference seed for a Cup winner is 2.26, the average overall seed for a Cup winner is 3.53. Teams that finish near the bottom of the pack in the regular season might make it to the finals, but they never win, at least not in the first 30 years.

Those are my opinions but apparently you have to have over 7000 posts before you can express them so I'll stop now. I've already been apppointed the "Champion of the everything". I thought the Conn Smythe woulda put Toews over the top for that one but whatever that's just my opinion so I'll take he award as long as it comes with 1.3 mill.

Not at all, you're entitled to whatever opinion you wish to advance, I just don't understand what you are trying to accomplish at this point? The outcome is clear, its over and you're still bent outta shape with us because you feel we didn't show your team enough 'love' or something? I dunno what more you expect but most of the posts I've read in this thread have given credit where due for how well Philly did play but it doesn't follow that we're all going to recant our original positions that CHI was the superior team, esp as the writing is now on the wall and the Hawks have been crowned champs

[AJB86]

Not at all, you're entitled to whatever opinion you wish to advance, I just don't understand what you are trying to accomplish at this point? The outcome is clear, its over and you're still bent outta shape with us because you feel we didn't show your team enough 'love' or something? I dunno what more you expect but most of the posts I've read in this thread have given credit where due for how well Philly did play but it doesn't follow that we're all going to recant our original positions that CHI was the superior team, esp as the writing is now on the wall and the Hawks have been crowned champs

Just for the record if the Hawks had been playing anyone else I would have been cheering for them. They are my 2nd favorite team as I've stated before. I used to think Burish was hilarious untill he had to come down from the press box to put his gear on and then come out on the ice and pretens like he was actually playing beak Pronger after the series is already over. I love Toews, Keith, and Seabrook. When Kane has it going there is none bettter to watch although it drives me nuts that he can look like a 12-yr old and dominate in ways that most people could never dream of. They were the supieror team as many people expected. I have never disputed that.

I guess I just got fed up before the series hearing how "it wasn't even going to be close" "the west is so much better" "the real SCF was played against the Sharks" "It's going to be ugly". In all honesty I gave the Hawks probably a 60-40 shot at winning the series so I was just waiting eagerly for all those comments to be wrong even if the Hawks did win.

I never gave your Habs a snowballs chance against the Caps or Pens and I fully admit I was dead wrong.

[mister_mcgoo]

I guess I just got fed up before the series hearing how "it wasn't even going to be close" "the west is so much better" "the real SCF was played against the Sharks" "It's going to be ugly". In all honesty I gave the Hawks probably a 60-40 shot at winning the series so I was just waiting eagerly for all those comments to be wrong even if the Hawks did win.

and I believe you have been vindicated, it definitely wasn't ugly (well cept for that winning goal maybe)