Moving Necas

[Fighting_Emu]

Dude you instantly went on the defense when I thought Belexus’ response was fine. You are justifying your trade offer angrily. as a Necas owner who tends to overvalue his own players even I still think it’s a big lowball. I definitely wouldn’t accept.

Yea I did- poor decorum on my part- a bit of history there but yup blew a gasket- not cool.

But here's the thing...

Maybe you're not underestimating necas. Honest question- my dumb rant aside- where does necas get drafted in fantasy next year?

Sorry to belexus i had the gall to post his stats (?!) On a fantasy forum (lol) but you know what they are as an owner- where do you draft a guy like that?? A ppg player- top ten in sogs for a C in a very very sof heavy league?Cause a lot of guys who just go with the flow out there still think he's a 55 point player- he's just an underpeforming forward until a credible source says "actually no hes a legit top 20 center now..." where do you draft him? And then ask where you draft beniers?? Thats literally all I meant. There needs to be a price for that difference.

Apparently the price is NOT seider and thats fine with me- i jumped off that ship a looooooonnnng time ago. I enjoy reading- I've got no issues spending way too much time reading scouts opinions/synopses/reports and here's the thing- Seider was never projected to be a strong offensive option EVEN by his fans. There is a very real chance his regular season to season contribution is closer to 35 than it is to 65. So ill admit maybe I underestumated on seiders value- fair enough- I have no issue passing on that player. But to me the idea that necas for beniers and a reasonable us at D is NOT insulting. Thats all I meant.

As a necas owner- you said even you think its a lot. I just traded gauddreau for holyz and tippett in this league and had to drop tippett cause he aged off my farm awhile ago- I got holts for gaudreau. Now imagine you're considering this. Is it crazy to think beniers takes two or three years to hit his peak? So for two to three years you're taking a real hit on your roster- beniers produces about half what necas does- he is very clearly a bench guy and in fact outproduced by the top waiver options- necas would be his top C by a wide margin (assuming you put stock in you know... prodyction)- Isn't it at least fair to ask for something for the trouble? Otherwise why bother right?

The premise holds and tbh if seider tops out as a 40-45 guy you probably lose. You give up 3 years for no real reason as thise types of dman are ultimately replaceable. You're ahead by about the same as a savvy waiver add would get you and it cost a three years of a top forward to do it. Also now Beniers has to break even or you're losing value there even. There are people saying they wouldn't do beniera alone or seider alone- have fun losing. The guys in third with a monstrous hole at center. Leveraging upside for production is not my idea, its not even a new idea, its the price you pay of you want to win. You want to have a fanboy crush on the blue chippers you drafted go ahead- but these are the types of trades you need to make if you want to win. Its a fact some gms aren't playing to win and if thats the case by all means enjoy your prospect. But don't get mad at me for assuming you want to win one year?? Thats ridiculous. Dobber just posted a trade on the main page where he gave up a shit ton of youth to win. Some guys can't do it- sucks to be you- lol! Doesn't make the offer insulting though...

When you're trading the NOW value you need to cover your bases. I get Seider is a bridge too far for some- good enough I didn't see it but sure it makes sense. The thing is though- i promise you I would not accept less. I have in the past my roster is still suffering...

[E63Wagon]

I got holts for gaudreau

have fun losing.
sucks to be you- lol!

my roster is still suffering...

Honestly, I feel pretty bad for you. As harsh as it sounds, I can almost guarantee the randoms in your league keep you around for their benefit. There is no way this is a friend league because no friend would ever even consider offering you Tippett and HoltZ for Gaudreau. The fact that no one else in the league even vetoed that trade confirms it has to be a bunch of randoms.

I'm pretty sure they are going to coming knocking on the door for Hughes with offers like Kravtsov + Quinn for J. Hughes if they haven't already.

[DangerCat]

I understand what you’re saying. But aren’t you in a rebuild and last time you were going to trade Necas for a prospect??? Dude I believe in Necas. I think he’s a ppg for the foreseeable future. I don’t think he has another gear but ppg players don’t grow on trees so I get it. But Beniers is a legit stud. He’s already nearly at the same ppg pace as Necas albeit 4 years younger on a team with a lot less talent. I agree with other guys I wouldn’t trade Beniers for Necas. Then you throw a guy who is going to be a perennial Norris candidate im assuming the third player was M. Savoie (?) who is still a high first round pick and a second for Necas and a banger d-man with maybe 30 point upside? I mean yeah I can see why that GM would be choked!

Also I want to understand why you so undervalue Seider after one half a bad sophomore season (as he’s picked up the second half) after dominating in his rookie year. Seider is a stud. Yet you rank Kuzmenko an undrafted 27 year old with one season of pretty good production and no draft pedigree or history as If he was a phenom? I just want to understand that reasoning? I’m sorry to bring Kuzmenko up but I know how high you are on him and yet you’d so undervalue a guy who is going to be a genuine stud in Beniers and Seider? Just food for thought. I guess I hope I can help you to see why that GM was choked. I don’t let fantasy hockey get me angry but I know some guys do.

[Fighting_Emu]

I've been low on seider offensively from the start. They played the bejesus out of him out of necessity and he twacked up an awful lot of points because of it but all the scouts said the same thing- his upside was predicated on a safe, all around defensive game. Hes got the IQ to cash in on scoring when he is in that role but he actually shines and does thing at an elite level in a more defensive role. Now you "throw in" edvinsson who is a legit roamer/gambler. Hes a bit of a question mark himself but again many scouts say if he develops right he could bebthat big shot roamer type who always felt to me like he would be better suited there. Its just a mix of a guy over stepping what he'll probably be doing offensively in his first year paired with the fact that they literally have a guy better suited to that in the wings (puns!!). There are two ides to this debate and im admitting i can be wrong here but I hate investing my highest quality asset on a guy that "might" be leaned on offensively. Maybe I end up wrong AND there's a chance he thrives as well in adore limited role and can get 50+ with great peripherals. I'm just saying there's a very real possibility (and one many scouts still project) where hes closer to a 40ish point guy for the next several years. I'm losing three years with Beniers and I "might" get an above average dman out of it. I didn't (and don't) think there's a high probability hes a stud offensively but maybe I'm wrong. The reason I think that is a lot of hours listening to scouching, pdocast and reading oodles upon oodles of reports from scouts well known and obscure. I can't promise im right but I can promise I've invested time and energy into my opinions.

Beniers- i like very much but I just don't think he's an elite guy. Maybe he ends up being that but even that year the guys with the eyeballs on the ice said if you want the guy who can regularly hit 90+ (but may also struggle to be a 50 point guy) draft kent johnson- if you want the reliable ppg stud who plays every situation you take Beniers. I believe he can be as good as Necas but that it will take a couple years to get there- hell necas took a couple years to be necas. I want "something" for the wait- I thought seider was enough of a gamble but I guess not. If I invested a high pick and watched him explode (like.kuzmenko) maybe id be stubborn too- i get that. But as an unbiased observer I think realistically they have very similar upsides but you have to give up two to three years

Lastly I never mentioned this in the main "argumebt" (lol)- but there is a chance necas has some more to give too. They're just starting to lean on him and hes rewarded them heavily. People gave up on him when he regressed last year but if you have time read the articles in 2021 when he was braking out- article after article saying the cane did it again and found a star. Also he did it with TONS of competition- i love me some beniers but he wa spoon fed his primo minutes. Things might not be so cut and dry when wright comes up.

The bottom line is this- I think the premise was sound- maybe the exact pieces were wrong. Beniers IS a downgrade- a substantial kne- right this second. Also right this second seider isn't even outscoring wifi who i was sending back. I literally HAVE made much wore trades than that to secure a win or a strong shot at a win. If he doesn't want to leverage his future thats fine but he did ask what the price was. In a rebuild im not in a rush to move necas either. If the price makes sense id consider it- but he's not a "must move" situation. I get why it was insulting but like I said a) I would never consider less (because that IS how you get stuck in a never ending rebuild and b) ina couple years this has the potential to look like a comically bad pass. Never-ending insulting- if he's ousted in the second round because he started cirelli youlitetally passed on a championship for a divisive young dman. His wings are INSANE- in our format they're like a cheat code, his D is solid if not spectacular but anchored down by a behemoth in Dahlin at the top of his rotation- and his goalies are fine (for now). This is literally the only hole on his team and it gets compounded with ages as benn and Pavelka are holding down key spots. IF I was contending and had a key hole on my roster- I'd be trying my damndest to fill it. Realistically necas is an absolutely ideal candidate (imho anyways) and if the price is steep thats the entry fee to the dance. He really shouldn't be available in our format. By getting insulted by this and my other "spam" offers hes just got one less trade partner and those are hard to find in this league. Getting emotional had no upside here imho...

[Fighting_Emu]

As a side note- I've been in many leagues and this i th first one I've been in where people get offended by multiple trade offers lol! There's one other guy who said the same thing and I just put them on there no offer list but I really feel like for some of these guys saving face or not looking dumb far gar exceeds the value of winning a championship. I traded draisaitl in year one- i got jim cause I was the worst team in an 18 team league when I started... and that same year I traded him for an admittedly poor return... and won!! Lmao I looked dumber than sin but I won the title in year one as basically the worst team haha! I get lots of trades done and I don't always win them either! I traded Morrissey AND Hronel for... (gulp)... petersen last year!! A couple gms are annoyed I send out so many bad offers but realistically the only reason you'd be nnoyed is cause you can't find a way to get value or lack confidence that way. A team like mine- rw-building, riverboat gambler for a gm, and prone to wild swings on upside- would be a fish on most leagues. In this one they'd rather get annoyed. Whatever floats your boat i guess...

[tweetdrivr]

TLDR

[Fighting_Emu]

Wow seider just went 2nd in my new draft- a ten teamer!! Fair enough- jebus...

[E63Wagon]

Who tf and what kind of potato league are you in to be doing a draft now?

You legit must be a troll.

[Fighting_Emu]

So you're gonna pretend this is your main account. 6 posts in a row all taking stabs at me and nothing else?? Wow I made quite the impression haha! At least I post under one account dipshit- but what would you expect from someone who thinks mental health issues are "hilarious".

For sure ignored- you keep playing for those laughs.... that aren't coming and the rest of us will pretend you're being this cocky at 200 posts makes any sense whatsoever. Why hide who you are though?? Herm....