How would you dog yourself out of this hole (Rebuild Strategy)

[AutomaJon]

Hey there, thanks on advance for the help. I'm brand new to hockey and fantasy hockey with this season and have completely fallen obsessed with both. Unfortunately, in my newness, I've dug myself into a bit of a hole in my first year keeper league. As a lurker here since I started, I finally registered an account to ask for some advice, pointers, and strategy to help me learn what I should be looking for in future decisions!

League is 20 teams. 15 keepers per team. Roster is 2C, 2LW, 2RW, 3F, 6D, 2G, 6BN, 2IR, and 2NA. Rotisserie categories are: G, A, P, +/-, PPP, FW, HIT, BLK, W, SHO, GAA, SV%

I've dig myself into a pit and realized I needed to rebuild, then bungled it a bit from there. Here is my current roster (in no particular order)

Ryan Nugent-Hopkins
Ty Dellandrea
Connor Garland
Joel Farabee
Owen Tippett
Alex Tuch
Brock Nelson
Liam Foudy
Kaiser Yamamoto
K'andre Miller
Bowen Byram
Pierre-Olivier Joseph
Justin Hill
Ian Mitchell
Noah Juulsen
Maxime Comtois
Ryan Donato
Joel Eriksonn-Ek
Nikita Gusev
Vaisilevsky
Carter Hart
Jake oettinger
Alex Nedeljikovic
(IR) Joel Kiviranta
(IR) Connor Ingram
(NA) Jamie Drysdale
(NA) Connor McMichael

For draft picks, we have eight rounds (23 players - 15 keepers). I have a 1, 2, 2, 3, 3, 3, 5, 8.

What steps would you take to dig yourself out of this pit? I have a lot tied up in rookies, so I know I'm trying to look a couple years down the line. It's a 20 team deep league so there's not many options on the waiver wire. I've exhausted the resources I can think of to improve my situation, and would love some more veteran insight. How would you approach this?

Thanks in advance!

[J0e Th0rnton]

Hey there, thanks on advance for the help. I'm brand new to hockey and fantasy hockey with this season and have completely fallen obsessed with both. Unfortunately, in my newness, I've dug myself into a bit of a hole in my first year keeper league. As a lurker here since I started, I finally registered an account to ask for some advice, pointers, and strategy to help me learn what I should be looking for in future decisions!

League is 20 teams. 15 keepers per team. Roster is 2C, 2LW, 2RW, 3F, 6D, 2G, 6BN, 2IR, and 2NA. Rotisserie categories are: G, A, P, +/-, PPP, FW, HIT, BLK, W, SHO, GAA, SV%

I've dig myself into a pit and realized I needed to rebuild, then bungled it a bit from there. Here is my current roster (in no particular order)

Ryan Nugent-Hopkins
Ty Dellandrea
Connor Garland
Joel Farabee
Owen Tippett
Alex Tuch
Brock Nelson
Liam Foudy
Kaiser Yamamoto
K'andre Miller
Bowen Byram
Pierre-Olivier Joseph
Justin Hill
Ian Mitchell
Noah Juulsen
Maxime Comtois
Ryan Donato
Joel Eriksonn-Ek
Nikita Gusev
Vaisilevsky
Carter Hart
Jake oettinger
Alex Nedeljikovic
(IR) Joel Kiviranta
(IR) Connor Ingram
(NA) Jamie Drysdale
(NA) Connor McMichael

For draft picks, we have eight rounds (23 players - 15 keepers). I have a 1, 2, 2, 3, 3, 3, 5, 8.

What steps would you take to dig yourself out of this pit? I have a lot tied up in rookies, so I know I'm trying to look a couple years down the line. It's a 20 team deep league so there's not many options on the waiver wire. I've exhausted the resources I can think of to improve my situation, and would love some more veteran insight. How would you approach this?

Thanks in advance!

A league with 20 teams and 15 keepers and you have Vasilievsky AND Carter Hart?
First things first. 4 of 12 categories, fully a third of the league's categories are tied up in goaltending. You have a good pair there. Do not sell them under any circumstances other than Conor McDavid or they offer you 2+ top 5 Keeper caliber players +

You have some kids that we will need to wait and see with this year.
Ty Dellandrea, Owen Tippett, Bowen Byram, Pierre-Olivier Joseph, Noah Juulsen, Jamie Drysdale, Connor McMichael
Who the hell is Liam foudy, Ian Mitchell, Joel Kiviranta, Connor Ingram and Justin Hill? lol

To your actual players.
RNH should score nice with McDavid. But he is softer than my cats fur so don't count on too many hits/BKS
Garland is looking great. but personally I do not expect him to keep up this pace. i'd look to see if you can trade him for a cold player before that cold player heats up.
Farabee is looking very good.
Alex Tuch is disappointing me again.
Brock nelson is what he is at this point
Gusev seems to suck this year so far.
Donato and Comtois should get plenty of opportunities on the bad teams they are on. Shame their ceilings are so low.
Eriksson Ek is tantalizing. They finally started playing him top 6 before COVID struck.

What would i do? if waivers are picked clean, probably not much other than try to make moves while some players are on hot streaks and buy cold ones. Depends on your GM's and how experienced they are.

[AutomaJon]

Yeah I got lucky with that-- slammed them as my first picks, but my scoring hasn't been up to snuff enough to support top goalies in rotisserie. Definite keepers, I just wasn't sure on how to proceed around them (especially with a handful of rookies, low upside players, and to be crass, "draft chaff" if you will. Anchors I think is the term?)

Good advice on the sell hot-- with trades, would you be targeting draft picks, or looking to trade batches for upgrades?

[Terministo125]

Your pool is very deep so I'll comment on what I can but there are a number of guys there that I've never even heard of.

Main thing is to know your league and to me it seems that goalies are valuable since there are so many teams in your league and a decent amount of categories. Hart and Vas are your two main players and as the poster above said, do not trade them unless you get a superstar in return. The other thing that I notice is that you start as many defence as forwards, which means that defence men are also super valuable. Make sure that you don't get fleeced for some of your top dmen prospects. Also, since there are so many keepers, draft picks outside the first two or three overall aren't overwhelmingly valuable so I would prioritize players over the picks.

Looking at your team, you don't have much to compete with this season. If I were you I would make a list of guys that you want to build upon (your untouchables for trades). As far as the rest of the players, you should sort them into players that would be good for a rebuilding team, and ones that would be good for a competing team. Try to trade them off to the appropriate teams and start to build a decent roster of guys. Harder than it sounds.

Your main squad to build around:
RNH
Vas
Hart
Byram
Farabee
Garland
Yamamoto
Eriksonn-Ek
Tuch

Think about trading to a win now team:
Brock Nelson

Top Dmen prospects:
K'andre Miller
Pierre-Oliver Joseph
Drysdale

As I said, I don't know a ton about the prospects but the guys mentioned about are 12 of your 15 keepers so you have a lot of prospects that may be good years from now but are doing nothing for you now. Pick a few that you believe in (more value on the guys playing right now like Comtois) and just trade the rest of them for guys that will be actually playing.

I know I said earlier that I wouldn't trade one of your goalies but I think it would be worth it to tell the league you're considering trading Vas if you get the right package. Since goalies are scarce you may get a really good package for him. At minimum you would want a top dman, forward, and some downgrade at goalie. Good luck to you. Just being on the forum and paying attention to what's going on, you'll be fine.

[AutomaJon]

That is extremely helpful and detailed, thanks so much! I'm glad to hear about the forum, haha. I went in not expecting to succeed this year while I learned, and this site has been a valuable resource. To clarify, it's 9 forwards and 6 defense (the extra three are in a "F" category), but I still have a weak blueline. It's an interesting thought about possibly shopping Vaisilevsky-- out of curiosity, what caliber players would you say would make up the right package? Like what level of players should I be looking for in that package?

[Axeman33]

Welcome to the forums.

Is this a team you drafted or one you took over? You say it's a first year keeper so I am assuming you drafted this team??

[AutomaJon]

It was a team I drafted, then made some weird/bad trades with, then got rookie-obsessed with and shuffled a bunch around. That's how I dug myself into the hole, and also when I woke up and realized it might help to ask for some advice! I went into this year knowing it was going to be a learning experience.

[Axeman33]

It was a team I drafted, then made some weird/bad trades with, then got rookie-obsessed with and shuffled a bunch around. That's how I dug myself into the hole, and also when I woke up and realized it might help to ask for some advice! I went into this year knowing it was going to be a learning experience.

Gotcha.

First off, as mentioned, you've got two of the better goalies in the league so hold on to them like gold.

It's going to be hard to do much out of the gate. You've drafted young so you might as well play the slow card and let it grow. I doubt you will get many willing to trade for your youth and give back much worth taking anyway. You've got no legit superstars or top players other than your goalies so you are better off continuing to build through the draft. That's the direction you've decided you wanted to take so you might as well stick with it.

Just remember, age doesn't count in fantasy hockey leagues when it comes to categories for victory.

[AutomaJon]

Makes sense! It's not about the age, it's about the production-- for sure! Thanks for the insight

[Axeman33]

Makes sense! It's not about the age, it's about the production-- for sure! Thanks for the insight

A lot of people draft young and are willing to accept that they wont be competitive for a bit and simply hope it pays off for them in time. You just have to know your strategy going into your draft. I recently did a new league draft from scratch like you and drafted middle to older guys because I was hoping to compete out of the gate. I drafted a couple younger kids later in the draft but that wasn't my focus. It is what it is.

[jer_33]

If you are not competitive in keeper leagues, spend the season working on your keepers and planning for the draft.

Look for under-performing or injured star players, not only will you likely be able to trade for them at a discount - but they will help you drop in the standings and increase the value of your picks.

Start planning for the draft. This will be your best opportunity to add to your keepers going forward.

Good luck.

[J0e Th0rnton]

If you are not competitive in keeper leagues, spend the season working on your keepers and planning for the draft.

Look for under-performing or injured star players, not only will you likely be able to trade for them at a discount - but they will help you drop in the standings and increase the value of your picks.

Start planning for the draft. This will be your best opportunity to add to your keepers going forward.

Good luck.

Good advise. Also, is it a snake draft? One thing i always try to hammer into people's heads in Snake drafts is, top teams 2nd rounders are nearly as high as their first rounders, and bad teams 2nd rounders are basically 3rd round picks in snake drafts. if it is a new league, people do not always pay attention to that little detail

[lucafen4]

Ryan Nugent-Hopkins
Ty Dellandrea
Connor Garland
Joel Farabee
Owen Tippett
Alex Tuch
Brock Nelson
Liam Foudy
Kaiser Yamamoto
K'andre Miller
Bowen Byram
Pierre-Olivier Joseph
Justin Hill
Ian Mitchell
Noah Juulsen
Maxime Comtois
Ryan Donato
Joel Eriksonn-Ek
Nikita Gusev
Vaisilevsky
Carter Hart
Jake oettinger
Alex Nedeljikovic
(IR) Joel Kiviranta
(IR) Connor Ingram
(NA) Jamie Drysdale
(NA) Connor McMichael

Two of the top 5 keeper league goalies, but you lack a top 50 forward (Garland's not there yet... RNH perhaps)

I agree with shipping out Nelson - but not until he's packing points - same with Gusev. Zero point trying to move either right now. Time to hold tight.
I've bolded guys you need to keep. Excluding the NA players assuming they're free holds.
I've italicized the few that have upside to keep.
With a league this size - 20 teams - and the age of you roster you're about 2 years from really making a push. The goal should be to load up on picks, high end talent. And then in 2yrs turn some of those prospects into vets you can acquire cheap.

(IE: I finished 12/16 teams last year with a real young team & some injuries to top players. Ended up with 6 picks 1st two rounds, traded down a couple times & then post-draft traded some prospects to acquire vets (Wheeler, Radulov, Hayes, Pavelski) and now I am a top 4 team.

Smart trading is better than volume trading IE: I traded Rakell, 4th & 5th last year during a hot stretch for Garland, Dube, 2nd & Ingram --I targeted Garland & Dube based on upside but neither had yet taken off.

Best advise - get to know the other 19 rosters better than your own. Identify under the radar/undervalued players to target.

you've got room to move Nelson for multiple pieces. it's hard to identify 15 legit keeper options. Nelson gets hot you should be able to get a good prospect/kid & a good draft pick at a minimum.

[AutomaJon]

Some fantastic points of advice above-- thanks everyone! Sounds like I have a clear path still that aligns with my compete in a couple years idea. Perfect! Thanks for all the detailed responses, advice, and all that-- I really appreciate it! Also great points on watching the draft. I have no idea if we're snake drafting or not, so I'll go find out and plan accordingly. Cheers!

[stevegamer]

Welcome to the forums. I'd recommend cleaning up any roster posts inthe future to group things by F/D/G, at least. Keeping 15 out of 23 isn't quite full dynasty, but you can build year-to-year with that.

Goalie: Things are very good. Your worst goalie is a reasonably well-liked prospect. I think all 4 are reasonable keepers, and that's sort of bad, as it means your skaters aren't that good. Ingram is trade bait/drop as a 5th goalie with the 4 you have is really a waste of a roster spot. If there's a chance he has value, deal him for somebody else who is injured.

Defense: You have a double issue here. One you're carrying 6 D in a start 6 D league with Hits & Blocks, so you fall behind in those cats some. Also, your keeper types are mostly offense - I'm not including Juulsen here as a keeper type. Miller is solid with the grit cats, and P-O Joseph & Byram seem to be light there. Normally you can find those cats on the wire, and I'd be very willing to move on from Holl to try and use him and a forward to get somebody who will maybe be a keeper for you you, or a pick. I'd want to roster 7 D here.

Forward: Some decent players, but not a lot of high-end talent. Nelson is useful, but if you're not a contender, he's better off being dealt. Same with Gusev if he gets going.