Stamkos... How long?

[doulos]

Fungchen,

If/when Stamkos hits even 100+ points this season then I think he needs to be talked about in the same way the others are - never trade type players.

[fungchen3]

Sure, Stamkos could finish with 98 points. I guess anything COULD happen. Injuries, slumps, trades, etc. could all play a part in anything.

But doulos, let me ask you one simple question:

If an organization promised to give you $10,000,000 in cash if you were able to exactly predict the amount of goals AND points Stamkos would have at the end of the year, what would your honest guess be?

How many goals and points will he finish with this year?

[Big Ev]

It's amazing what not even a quarter of the season can do to people's opinions around here. Everybody just shoves Malkin under the rug after an injury-plagued season and annoints Stamkos as the new #3 because of 19 games. If Malkin was Canadian, nobody would be even thinking about saying he isn't one of the Top 3 fantasy players in the league. Also, now people are saying his shot is better than Ovechkin's? No. I'm not an Ovie fan at all, but his shot is still the best in the league.

Everyone has long hot streaks, this could very well be Stamkos' this season. He is 20 years old; players his age can still endure long cold streaks as well. Remember that Tampa Bay isn't the greatest team either, so a cold streak for Tampa might equal a semi-cold streak for Stamkos.

No disrespect to Stamkos' fantasy or real life value (he's an amazing player) but he isn't this good. He won't finish with 146 points and 70 goals or whatever he's projected for. Also, Vinny will steal some of his points when he comes back from injury, remember that.

Whoever mentioned Kopitar, that's a great example. I remember people saying Kopitar was guaranteed for over 100 last year with his amazing start.

[doulos]

Sure, Stamkos could finish with 98 points. I guess anything COULD happen. Injuries, slumps, trades, etc. could all play a part in anything.

But doulos, let me ask you one simple question:

If an organization promised to give you $10,000,000 in cash if you were able to exactly predict the amount of goals AND points Stamkos would have at the end of the year, what would your honest guess be?

How many goals and points will he finish with this year?

Mahaha, I have no freaking idea. I've been involved with fantasy hockey long enough to know that my predictive abilities are not that good.

I think 100+ points is very realistic this year for Stamkos though.

[fungchen3]

Ev,

Were you on the moon last season when Stamkos finished with 95 points and tied Crosby for the Rocket as a 19 year old?? I mean, come on, bro!! Stamkos did not pop out of a genie lamp a month ago!! His meteor was rising since the beginning of last year.

No one is shoving Malkin under the rug. The day someone says Rick Nash is better than Malkin, he is being thrown under the rug. Saying Stamkos is a better fantasy option is not a direct diss on Malkin, it is evaluating stats going back to October of last year.

All excuses aside, has Malkin delivered like a member of the Big 3 last season and so far this season? Conversely, has Stamkos?

[sakic19]

Absolute awesome debate going on here. I could read these types of opinions forever.

And really only time will tell. I dont think anyone is wrong here thus far.

Ovechkin and Stamkos have equally good shots I must say. Stamkos more of the pure finisher(brett hull) and Ovechkin as the dazzler and can make you look foolish(lemieux).

Points only league, give Thornton his due. Not many in the last decade have done with Thornton has done in points only leagues.

Stamkos will reach 105 this year barring injury. But don't count Malkin out. He proved to us a few nights back what he can do and what he HAS ALREADY done.

Give Stamkos his time in the spotlight now and when the smoke clears, at worst, Malkin = Stamkos. I highly doubt Stamkos will ever be considered better than Malkin over a 82 game season, let alone playoffs.

[Big Ev]

Just to add, I think this Big 3 thing was BS to begin with. I think it's just Crosby and Ovechkin and all the others.

Also, I don't think anyone will ever score more than 140 points in a season. It's hard to get 100 nowadays.

[Big Ev]

Ev,

Were you on the moon last season when Stamkos finished with 95 points and tied Crosby for the Rocket as a 19 year old*?? I mean, come on, bro!! Stamkos did not pop out of a genie lamp a month ago!! His meteor was rising since the beginning of last year.

*Because of empty netters.

Everyone knows Stamkos was amazing, so I don't think anyone should have been too surprised by his season last year.

Was veryone else on the moon and forgot about Malkin's ~400 points in 328 games? Or that his rookie season was much much better than Stamkos'? Or that he has back-to-back 100 point campaigns? Or that he's scored 150 goals in 4.25 seasons? Or that he is a guy who likes to rack up PIM's (for a winger)? Or that he won 2 playoff series by himself? Or that we won a Conn Smythe at the age of 22? Or that he is very much like Jaromir Jagr in the way he can dominate games?

Malkin reminds me of General Motors the way he's being talked about!

[fungchen3]

Just to add, I think this Big 3 thing was BS to begin with. I think it's just Crosby and Ovechkin and all the others.

Also, I don't think anyone will ever score more than 140 points in a season. It's hard to get 100 nowadays.

Well, I will say this Ev:

A few years ago it did seem like there was a Big 3. But then it became obvious there really was a Big 2 like you said. Crosby and Ovechkin just proved to be more consistent and reliable than Malkin.

But then Stamkos jumped onto the scene last season, Backstrom took the next step, Henrik won the Art Ross, and Malkin stumbled a bit. That opened it up, but Sid and Ovechkin were still 1-2 and steady.

This season Stamkos is simply wowing people and making a case for his inclusion among Crosby and Ovechkin IF he can continue to play at this level. So it comes down to people either believing he will do it or not.

But, you are bang on with the 140 stuff. Scoring 110 is very hard, 120 is a big feat. Netting 140 today would be a unheard of. Scoring 160 is impossible even if Ovechkin-Crosby-Malkin played on the same team and line.

[Big Ev]

and I'm not saying EN goals are totally cheap, but you do have to factor them into the equation, IMO.

[SirKnight]

This thread is AWESOME!

The best way for me to explain how great Stamkos is, is this: Last year at this time we were still talking about who would be the better player, Steven Stamkos or John Tavares. I remember the doubt Dobber cast in a thread about who would score more goals in the 09-10 season. Dobber argued Tavares would win being he is the best player from the hash marks to the net, I think the prediction was a 36 for Taveres to 23 for Stamkos. We all know how that one worked out. Now Dobber argues Malkin is better than Stamkos. The point is, we are all talking about Stamkos being a member of the elite four fantasy hockey players one year after he was predicted to score fewer goals than a rookie on the lowly Islanders.

Stamkos has arrived, and as long as he keeps scoring, he'll have to continue to climb Dobbers rankings and as long as Malkin keeps showing up for only 75% of his games he'll continue to descend in the rankings. I do find it ironic we are comparing the current scoring leader to the current 35th best player in the league... I look forward to next year at this time when we are comparing the two Canadian kids and trying to decide if Crosby is actually better than Stamkos.

[blunas]

Stamkos is ahead of him NOW !!!!

Agreed, I know Malkin is an elite player but Stamkos has him beat. Although I guess you could call it the big 4, instead of saying Stamkos is replacing him in the big 3.

[fulcrum]

and I'm not saying EN goals are totally cheap, but you do have to factor them into the equation, IMO.

This is a real question, no sarcasm intended.

How many empty net goals did Stamkos have compared to Crosby? I didn't realize that it was that big of a factor in the race last year?

[Carcillo]

This is a real question, no sarcasm intended.

How many empty net goals did Stamkos have compared to Crosby? I didn't realize that it was that big of a factor in the race last year?

Stamkos had 3 and Crosby had 1 (and Ovechkin had 5). It's only a big factor to some people because Stamkos's 51st goal was an empty-netter in the last game of the season and it tied him with Crosby.

[fulcrum]

Stamkos had 3 and Crosby had 1 (and Ovechkin had 5). It's only a big factor to some people because Stamkos's 51st goal was an empty-netter in the last game of the season and it tied him with Crosby.

I knew his last one was an empty netter but 3-1 is not a factor as far as I am concerned.

There is no team in the league that wouldn't have been trying to get that last goal for one of their players if it meant him winning / tieing the scoring race......so before that night it was only 2-1.