That was a goal!!

[Qube]

The NHL organization is incompetent. To me, that was clearly a goal. The puck passed the goal line.. Lundquist\'s pad was angled in a way that the would have to be in.

[hoopej2]

I agree that it \"would have to be in\" but since it wasn\'t clearly visible that it was in, the ref\'s initial call, which was no goal, stands. Had the ref called it a goal originally, it would have been a goal because they couldn\'t prove that it didn\'t go in.

JR had a great idea on the post game wrap. Why can\'t little cameras be put into the net to see things like this? Cost? It can\'t be that expensive for the little camera\'s. I\'ve heard that the HD camera\'s they want to put at each end of the rink would cost $5M, but that\'s not what I\'m talking about. The problem with the current camera that is above the net is that it\'s angled to shoot forward so the cross bar doesn\'t get in the way. Because of that angle, we can\'t see exactly when the puck crosses the line.

NHL, get this camera fiasco fixed. It might have cost Buffalo the game last night and it might cost a team the Cup down the road.

Post edited by: hoopej2, at: 2007/05/02 09:26

[lanky522]

That it would have to be in

Well that\'s the criteria all professional sports should use in their video reviews to overturn questionable events...

Here\'s the thing... it certainly looked like a goal to us, as I\'m sure it looked like it was a goal to the video reviewers, but unless there is CONCLUSIVE evidence that it was, they have to go with the call on the ice which was no goal.

If you cannot see the puck because it\'s under a pad or a glove or a body, you cannot make a CONCLUSIVE decision (by definition of the word conclusive).

It sure looked like a goal, but you can\'t overturn a call without VIDEO PROOF that it was indeed a goal. They didn\'t have video proof. Sucks for sabres fans, but that\'s the way it is (and the way it has been all season long).

Anyways, all they had to do was score a goal the real way and it wouldn\'t be an issue. I mean seriously, even vancouver put up more than one goal last night...

In my opinion, you can\'t complain about an official\'s call near the end of the game, when you had 50+ minutes to bust your ass and put the game so far out of reach that no call has a game changing effect.

[lanky522]

Camera\'s are expensive... if they were in the net, players would destroy them every other game with their shots...

what they should do is put some sort of transmiter of some sort in the rubber of the puck that a camera can pick up. That way even if it is under a player or a pad or a glove, you can see exactly where it is...

This is also a rather expensive/possibly infeasible option, so people will just have to deal with the human error in the system. The nhl existed for many years before using cameras for video review, and they got along just fine...

[hoopej2]

I really don\'t like the \"We\'ve gotten along just fine without it until now, why change?\" argument. McDonalds was a great burger joint in the 50\'s and they only had one kind of burger, do you think they\'d be the company they are today if they had not adapted? The puck and the players have never been faster than they are now. To say that the league has been fine up until now is silly. As more and more plays like this happen, fans will get disenchanted with the sport and move on to something else. I\'m not talking about the die hards like you and me, I\'m talking about the casual observer that the NHL needs to enjoy the game in order for it to flourish south of the Canada/US border.

[lanky522]

I\'m not saying don\'t try and change it... change is good. I\'m just saying that fans should be happy that a video review even exists.

But then I suppose fans will always have something to complain about... be it the officiating, the video review, or any number of other issues. No matter how perfect they can get the calls, there will always be complaints from the fans...

Thats just the way sports are...

[repenttokyo]

lanky522 wrote:

Camera\'s are expensive... if they were in the net, players would destroy them every other game with their shots...

last i checked, pretty much every net in the playoffs has a camera in it.

[goose191919]

im not a fan of taking away human error in the game. i think it makes sports better in that people can argue and hate each other over such (bad) calls. last nights \"goal\" was inconclusive through video. so what. get over it. buffalo gets screwed? how about the goals that were reversed against them that probably shouldnt have? it goes both ways and will balance itself out. human error is always going to be there, and trying to eliminate it would ruin the sport, and slow it down.

anyone watch an NFL game? it is SOOOOOOO boring when they go to a video review. it slows down the game, especially when the coaches challenge the plays. i think when you rely on such techniques, the refs will get worse and worse, because they dont mind if they get a call wrong - there is always a video replay.

anyways, a bit of a tangent. my point is that human error is a good thing, it keeps us humble and will ALWAYS have debates, such as this.

i always hate when people blame things on referees. they are not there to screw a team over, they really dont care who wins. unless things are fixed (ie italian soccer) calm down and be mad at your team for waiting until 20 seconds left in the game to tie it up. this game will NOT make them lose the cup. if they were as good as you say/think they are, then they will overcome this.

[Zorro]

you can also ask why didn\'t briere throw that puck up where grandpa hides the porno\'s??? If that shot would have tickled the twine we \'might\' be sitting here today saying 3-1 series lead for BUF. If its that close give it to the GOALIE. Like tie goes to the runner in baseball...

NYR deserve\'s a few breaks. Now Jagr will break his leg.

[lanky522]

repenttokyo, I was responding to hoopej2\'s post:

JR had a great idea on the post game wrap. Why can\'t little cameras be put into the net to see things like this? Cost? It can\'t be that expensive for the little camera\'s

I think he was talking about putting small camera\'s in the mesh of the net (whereas right now, there\'s just one in the back-top of the net).

I was saying that any cameras in the main part of the net would get trashed much more quickly than the one that is in the top of the back of the net (it\'s much more out of the way back there).

[repenttokyo]

I think they should probably try to put either more than 1 camera in the net, or better cameras directly above. Another interesting option would be to have high mounted cameras focused directly i front of the goal line.

If we are going to use video replays, which I have no issue with, then we should attempt to use the best technology available. And if the technology varies from rink to rink....well that\'s really not an acceptable system.

[lanky522]

I like the idea of trying to put a camera on each post, shooting directly across the line. Half the time they could get their vision blocked by a leg or a pad or something, but it could be a crucial angle to have in some of the closer decisions.

[Qube]

im not a fan of taking away human error in the game.

You can have human errors for the officiating, but when it comes to goals.. The NHL have to have it right.

If we are going to use video replays, which I have no issue with, then we should attempt to use the best technology available. And if the technology varies from rink to rink....well that\'s really not an acceptable system.

I absolutely agree with you repenttokyo.
There has to be a standard for rinks in the NHL.
There are talks of the NHL possibly expending to Europe... Let\'s fix the game here first.

[hoopej2]

From Lanky:

I think he was talking about putting small camera\'s in the mesh of the net (whereas right now, there\'s just one in the back-top of the net).

JR was talking about drilling holes into the goal posts and inserting small cameras. I saw your subsequent post about having the cameras on the goal line and this is close to what he mentioned. I think they should have them along the goal line at the side, but also from the top, directly down instead of angled from a camera up on the ceiling.

[lanky522]

Ah.

Yeah, yeah that is a tremendous idea... why not drill into the goalposts...? There\'s no reason I can think of that would make this a bad idea.