[Trade] PLD to Kings

[Axeman33]

I usually agree to 99% of your posts, but I have to disagree on this one.

Habs aren't a PLD away from being a Cup Contender. Dealing away a Guhle + Dach for Dubois isn't what they need. Also, Dubois isn't Tier 0 (McDavid) and not a Tier 1 either (Matthews, MacKinnon, etc.). He's probably in the same tier as Suzuki, but a different style of player.

Also, I'd be very surprised if PLD earns less than 8M. He's represented by Brisson and he's not one to give gifts for his clients. From 8 to 10M is the type of money these guys get paid.

Dubois to MTL has been a bad idea since it started last year. Dubois as a UFA? Yes. Giving assets for him? Nope.

Fair enough. If there's one thing clear about Habs fans is that they typically overvalue their players. I'd say you're right on queue.

You are right when you say they aren't a PLD away from competing for a Cup but I'm not sure Dach/Guhle puts them any closer.

[2014olympicgold]

If I'm a GM trading for Dubois and extending him, I am not including a large NTC into the contract. No way am I going to get stuck with a complacent Dubois who wants out if things go sideways.

But in reality, I'm not touching Dubois unless I'm Montreal. And even then, I'm not going out of my way to obtain him, it would be "here's a small trade piece Winnipeg, Dubois, if you want to come here in free agency, this is what we likely will give you. If you don't want to come here, oh well goodluck".

[forsbergfan]

I don't think it's so much whether the Habs are a PLD away from contending or not. More that they have Suzuki and Caulfield at under 8mil and I don't think they want to go higher than that for anyone, let alone someone like PLD who as mentioned is not a tier 0-1 center.
If the Jets could get Vilardi and Iaffalo as rumored, I think that's the best case scenario for everyone. Jets won't do better than that with any other team, and Kings become instant contenders with Dubois. They need a goalie too, but they'll get to that this offseason.

[FinnishFlash]

I wonder if there is a scenario here where LA can kill 2 birds with one stone and get PLD and Hellebyuck in the same deal. I have not worked out and $'s on that, so have no idea if it is even plausible given each teams situation, but that would eb a blockbuster.

[random-d]

I've never bothered to follow Montreal much but I have to know the answer to this;

Do they have an inexplicably arbitrary boner for players with French names or do French named players have an inexplicable bias towards Montreal? Both?

[2014olympicgold]

I wonder if there is a scenario here where LA can kill 2 birds with one stone and get PLD and Hellebyuck in the same deal. I have not worked out and $'s on that, so have no idea if it is even plausible given each teams situation, but that would eb a blockbuster.

I feel like if they have a trade that's like Byfield ($894k), Vilardi (RFA), and Arvidsson ($4.25m), they can get Helly ($6.166m) and Dubois (RFA). Then the extensions would be dependent on Kopitar's next contract. I don't think it's a smart path to go down though.

I think they need a goalie more than they need Dubois anyways. Continue to develop Byfield to become your #1C, Danault is paid to be your #2, and go out and try and find a bargain #3 if yuo don't think Lizotte is the guy.

[lusshouse]

Fair enough. If there's one thing clear about Habs fans is that they typically overvalue their players. I'd say you're right on queue.

You are right when you say they aren't a PLD away from competing for a Cup but I'm not sure Dach/Guhle puts them any closer.

Maybe.

Maybe it's being burnt by Drouin for Sergachev, by McDonaugh for Gomez. These shortcuts for 1B centers/wingers haven't led us to anything. And my evaluation of PLD is that he's not a star about to explode. He's a solid C2.

By the way, just to show you the 'hype' here in Montreal, he's been called by a former Vezina-trophy-winner-turned-columnist a '106 point guy we must acquire, our future Vincent Damphousse', only to realize a few days later he messed up the POINTS and PIM columns.

I'd say MTL media is 50-50 on this, those saying the price asked will be too high, and those thinking he's must be acquired whatever the price.

There's a big 'he's a Francophone' crowd too, thinking Habs should roster mostly French Canadians. A lot of noise by these people politically and 'sport'-ally recently.

[lusshouse]

I've never bothered to follow Montreal much but I have to know the answer to this;

Do they have an inexplicably arbitrary boner for players with French names or do French named players have an inexplicable bias towards Montreal? Both?

You have to be from here to understand I guess.

For a long period of time, it wasn't such as left-wing vs right-wing debates in our politics : it was 'separatism' vs 'Canada'. Political parties, columnists, etc. The province was split mostly in half (the last referendum to get out of Canada was 51-49%).

The debate then became obsolete after the 1995 'loss/victory', until recently. With the mass of migrants coming from around the world, political debates are more and more around nationalism, just like everywhere, except here, it brings back sovereignty discussions.

One of the most influencial media outlet here is... the main broadcaster of NHL (TVASports) and potential future owner of the Nordiques if they ever come back.

You'll understand that it's the reason why, year after year, we hear complains about lack of French Canadian players on the Habs, blaming it on Molson (a true Canadian), hoping a Nordique return (owned by French Canadians) would reignite national pride about our French players, etc.

It's more complex than that, and I hope I did my best to summarize a complex situation.

[senryu]

I've never bothered to follow Montreal much but I have to know the answer to this;

Do they have an inexplicably arbitrary boner for players with French names or do French named players have an inexplicable bias towards Montreal? Both?

My understanding is that there is something in the air whereby Montreal fans/media or whomever would generally prefer their coaches, gms, and players to be Quebec natives or from that one town in Ontario where Claude Giroux is from. There's also that undercurrent of Quebec separatism that comes up every so often. And it is probably a selling point where you can have a hometown guy be a face of the franchise. People keep talking about how great it would be if Auston Matthews played for the Coyotes. If only Mario Lemieux had played for Les Habitants...

In a way it is like how the University of Minnesota men's hockey team had an unofficial policy that it would only recruit Minnesota high school players on the unspoken assumption that as the "State of Hockey", their players were a cut above those from any other state or province. At least Minnesota felt that way until they had a stretch of poor performance, so they went out and got Thomas Vanek to help them win an NCAA title.

EDIT: listen to lusshouse above, that is a better explanation.

[kovalchuk17]

Dubois should fetch a haul with an extension, he's a 25-year old second line centre. I doubt the Habs have a huge issue with the dollars, but the assets they have to give up to get him. I dont necessarily blame him for his lethergic attitude towards Columbus and Winnipeg.

Kent Hughes seems like a smart dude so if the Habs are re-engaging I imagine hes working the phones to get a 3-way trade going if he can get assets for guys like Dvorak to help offset the cost.

As for the francophone thing, yes it is definitely a weird nationalism thing. For many years NHL players were regionally allocated so almost all the Habs were francophones. I dont think it would be as much of an issue if there were a higher proportion of francophones in the league but since they are somewhat limited having a star francophone player on the Habs is a big deal. Jonathan Drouin was supposed to be that guy but that did not work out to say the least and may have been a detriment to his career

[Belexus75]

I've never bothered to follow Montreal much but I have to know the answer to this;

Do they have an inexplicably arbitrary boner for players with French names or do French named players have an inexplicable bias towards Montreal? Both?

probably a bit of both but hard to say, i do know however that up until recently they would not hire a coach who does not speak French..i think that changed a bit but i remember it being big deal

[havanablast21]

I'll just be thrilled if PLD ends up in a City that is NOT Montreal... Long Term. So much for the "worst kept secret" that eventually never happens.

Make this happen Kings and Jets.

[rataylor22]

I'm not sure LA is a better team next year with Vilardi and Iafallo out and Dubois in. The might be a better team because other young players keep improving, but they lose on this swap.

[Axeman33]

I'm not sure LA is a better team next year with Vilardi and Iafallo out and Dubois in. The might be a better team because other young players keep improving, but they lose on this swap.

Agreed. Whats worse will be his new contract.

[lusshouse]

probably a bit of both but hard to say, i do know however that up until recently they would not hire a coach who does not speak French..i think that changed a bit but i remember it being big deal

It's still a big deal.

When Gorton was hired as President of Hockey Ops, French Twitter went crazy about the fact he couldn't speak French.
Then, he went and hired Kent Hughes -- who speaks probably better French than St-Louis, growing in the English-speaking part of Montreal.
But on the day of the presser, people were more interested in hearing him speak French (was it as fluent as advertised?) or if it felt as if he was a puppet of Gorton (who COULDN'T be GM because he doesn't speak French).

Coach must be French too.

It will remain the same for as long as generations of fans believe it's relevant it is. For my dad's generation (65+), it's a big deal. For me at 40, it's not, but some people my age believe it is. Many younger fans don't care.