The Coronavirus Pandemic

[PenguinHunter]

What does it matter. He was already impeached and half the country loves him.

He said, "Where I could stand in the middle of Fifth Avenue and shoot somebody and I wouldn’t lose any voters, okay? It’s like incredible,"

And it's absolutely true. His base is a cult.

Is it a cult or is it the typical political choice of the lesser of two evils? Sure there a cult followings of both political sides. And then those in the middle have to decide between the Devil and Lucifer.

[lucafen4]

What does it matter. He was already impeached and half the country loves him.

He said, "Where I could stand in the middle of Fifth Avenue and shoot somebody and I wouldn’t lose any voters, okay? It’s like incredible,"

And it's absolutely true. His base is a cult that owns all the guns.

Finished your sentence for you

[ericdaoust]

All this back and forth over "stuff" yet look at the results.

[2014olympicgold]

With Trumps conflict of interest situation, it really just brings up the thought, "how often does this happen, it's just Trump is too cocky to hide it well?". I'm sure he's not the first to have a conflict like this, but he is a first to be the one to try and push a subject for the benefit of his own interest.

A smart person would have it leaked to the media this drug works, or should be looked at. Not go out and say it to the media. It's like having an NHL GM tell someone to tell someone to tell a reporter a player of his wants too much money to have the media say it's an outrageous contract demand. The GM doesn't come out and say it.

[PenguinHunter]

and what was a better solution to humans standing on train tracks? run them over? mass arrests?

Anything involving First Nations is a very sensitive area in Canada. Government dealings with First Nations are under a microscope... and rightfully so.
An immediate physical removal of these protests would have led to a much larger issue for the government.

I think you over simplify the fragility of some of these situations and the steps that are required to minimize damage to relations with First Nations people in this country.

You can't snap fingers and resolve everything without there being serious repercussions -- that would no undoubtedly be worse than taking a couple of weeks and properly negotiating a settlement.

I'm not pumping Trudeau's tires purposely... but I'm looking at the larger picture. What happens if the RCMP arrived on day one of protests and put everyone in handcuffs? Or on day 3? Sure he ends the protest. But now he has a much larger issue on his hands - marginalizing First Nations... again. Human Rights complaints... and on it goes.
If you notice. every time Trump has played hardball with Canada - Canada walked out with what it needed and wanted.

Is breaking the law not breaking the law? If a First Nations person kills someone while drinking and driving... do you let them off the hook?

If there are laws against protests (which I am pretty sure Trudeau has shut down other protesters with other causes) then what precedent are you setting? All Trudeau had to do was apply the same laws that he has for other protests. But no.. he allowed it to go on and then it got out of hand. And then people who didn't even have the slightest idea about what they were protesting were out there protesting and making it worse.

Yes, the history of government with First Nations is not the best... but that doesn't mean you bend the other way and allow them to be above the law.

Let me ask you this... how quick would a protest on the railways be shut down if it was Christians on the railways protesting abortion?? Or if it was Muslims protesting their right to celebrate Ramadan? Or women protesting their right for equality?

[GretzkysMullet]

With Trumps conflict of interest situation, it really just brings up the thought, "how often does this happen, it's just Trump is too cocky to hide it well?". I'm sure he's not the first to have a conflict like this, but he is a first to be the one to try and push a subject for the benefit of his own interest.

A smart person would have it leaked to the media this drug works, or should be looked at. Not go out and say it to the media. It's like having an NHL GM tell someone to tell someone to tell a reporter a player of his wants too much money to have the media say it's an outrageous contract demand. The GM doesn't come out and say it.

A media report wouldn't have had anywhere near the kind of impact mentioning it over and over in presidential briefings has. Hell, he didn't even just mention, or straight up tell people to take it, his government ordered it to be distributed without proof it works for COVID-19. Tax payers are literally paying to inflate the value of the holdings of Trump and his political allies. It's unreal. A politician in any other country that did something this flagrant would be forced to resign, I mean even in the US there have been resignations over much less than this.

[lucafen4]

With Trumps conflict of interest situation, it really just brings up the thought, "how often does this happen, it's just Trump is too cocky to hide it well?". I'm sure he's not the first to have a conflict like this, but he is a first to be the one to try and push a subject for the benefit of his own interest.

A smart person would have it leaked to the media this drug works, or should be looked at. Not go out and say it to the media. It's like having an NHL GM tell someone to tell someone to tell a reporter a player of his wants too much money to have the media say it's an outrageous contract demand. The GM doesn't come out and say it.

Nope.

Dick Cheney was former Board of Governors of Halliburton - he held millions in shares with them. Then Halliburton was awarded multi-billion dollar private contract after multi-billion dollar private contract during the 2nd Iraq occupation.

In March 2003, Kellogg Brown & Root, Halliburton's construction and engineering subsidiary, received from the Pentagon what is called a sole-source contract, meaning it was awarded without bidding, to restore and operate Iraqi oil wells. The contract, which was classified when it was awarded just before the invasion of Iraq, could be worth as much as $7 billion.

The company was given $39.5 billion in Iraq-related contracts over the past decade, with many of the deals given without any bidding from competing firms,

I don't have the time to dig for the sources that lay out how much Cheney made directly but I'm recalling it being in the hundreds of millions.

[lucafen4]

Is breaking the law not breaking the law? If a First Nations person kills someone while drinking and driving... do you let them off the hook?

If there are laws against protests (which I am pretty sure Trudeau has shut down other protesters with other causes) then what precedent are you setting? All Trudeau had to do was apply the same laws that he has for other protests. But no.. he allowed it to go on and then it got out of hand. And then people who didn't even have the slightest idea about what they were protesting were out there protesting and making it worse.

Yes, the history of government with First Nations is not the best... but that doesn't mean you bend the other way and allow them to be above the law.

Let me ask you this... how quick would a protest on the railways be shut down if it was Christians on the railways protesting abortion?? Or if it was Muslims protesting their right to celebrate Ramadan? Or women protesting their right for equality?

Christians - pretty quick... because they should not be on the railway. There's no connection. They have been able to peacefully demonstrate outside abortion clinics while RCMP are present. They were not disbanded on site.

Muslims can celebrate Ramadon in Canada - it's in the Charter as a protected freedom.

They are totally different.

With the Christian example - more appropriately would be a government demand they perform abortions in a Christian church. -- that's as close of an example I can give to digging trenches through the middle of First Nations territory without permission.

We have a Nation within a Nation. Legislated Acts to protect First Nations land.

It's one of the most complicated relationships of any nation in the world.

Again, you ask Trudeau to snap his fingers and resolve it.
It over simplifies the issue.

That is not how you build trusting relationships with other governments within your country.

[GretzkysMullet]

Is breaking the law not breaking the law? If a First Nations person kills someone while drinking and driving... do you let them off the hook?

If there are laws against protests (which I am pretty sure Trudeau has shut down other protesters with other causes) then what precedent are you setting? All Trudeau had to do was apply the same laws that he has for other protests. But no.. he allowed it to go on and then it got out of hand. And then people who didn't even have the slightest idea about what they were protesting were out there protesting and making it worse.

Yes, the history of government with First Nations is not the best... but that doesn't mean you bend the other way and allow them to be above the law.

Canadians have a right to peaceful protest. While there are limits, it is often not clear cut as to where the line is drawn, and intervention can be challenged in courts. So it's not a clear case of people breaking the law and being let off the hook as you have suggested, and there are legal and political consequences to strong-arming people who are protesting peacefully. What other protests are you referring to, by the way? Or are you just assuming that happened without looking anything up?

[doulos]

Finished your sentence for you

True enough.

[lucafen4]

Is breaking the law not breaking the law? If a First Nations person kills someone while drinking and driving... do you let them off the hook?

If there are laws against protests (which I am pretty sure Trudeau has shut down other protesters with other causes) then what precedent are you setting? All Trudeau had to do was apply the same laws that he has for other protests. But no.. he allowed it to go on and then it got out of hand. And then people who didn't even have the slightest idea about what they were protesting were out there protesting and making it worse.

Yes, the history of government with First Nations is not the best... but that doesn't mean you bend the other way and allow them to be above the law.

Let me ask you this... how quick would a protest on the railways be shut down if it was Christians on the railways protesting abortion?? Or if it was Muslims protesting their right to celebrate Ramadan? Or women protesting their right for equality?

The government tried force once before... we remember it for that reason:

1990 - Oka in Quebec lasted 78 days. Brian Mulroney - Conservative PM & Robert Bourassa Liberal Premier

A police officer was shot & killed in the raid during the firefight that followed.

I think this gets mentioned when discussing using force to end protests. There are better PEACEFUL solutions

[doulos]

Christians - pretty quick... because they should not be on the railway. There's no connection. They have been able to peacefully demonstrate outside abortion clinics while RCMP are present. They were not disbanded on site.

Muslims can celebrate Ramadon in Canada - it's in the Charter as a protected freedom.

They are totally different.

With the Christian example - more appropriately would be a government demand they perform abortions in a Christian church. -- that's as close of an example I can give to digging trenches through the middle of First Nations territory without permission.

We have a Nation within a Nation. Legislated Acts to protect First Nations land.

It's one of the most complicated relationships of any nation in the world.

Again, you ask Trudeau to snap his fingers and resolve it.
It over simplifies the issue.

That is not how you build trusting relationships with other governments within your country.

I've given up even trying to understand how to possibly respond to first nations issues in Canada. It's impossibly complex and way beyond my ability to give good insight into. Glad other smarter people than myself have to deal with it.

[rataylor22]

Yeah, you'd think there would be more safeguards in place to prevent abuse of power at an institutional level though.

There is. They just completely break down when partisanship reaches "party over state"

[PenguinHunter]

Christians - pretty quick... because they should not be on the railway. There's no connection. They have been able to peacefully demonstrate outside abortion clinics while RCMP are present. They were not disbanded on site.

Muslims can celebrate Ramadon in Canada - it's in the Charter as a protected freedom.

They are totally different.

With the Christian example - more appropriately would be a government demand they perform abortions in a Christian church. -- that's as close of an example I can give to digging trenches through the middle of First Nations territory without permission.

We have a Nation within a Nation. Legislated Acts to protect First Nations land.

It's one of the most complicated relationships of any nation in the world.

Again, you ask Trudeau to snap his fingers and resolve it.
It over simplifies the issue.

That is not how you build trusting relationships with other governments within your country.

I am aware of Muslims being able to. I couldn't think of anything they would protest...but I didn't want to be accused of only proving the Christian example. I should have used the wearing the hijab.,.. that would have been a better example.

So there is a double standard?

And I don't expect him to snap his fingers and resolve it. I expect him to uphold the law and not punish business and citizens at the hands of protesters.

And is there not a new law that Christian ministries cannot hold any function within a certain distance of an abortion clinic? So there is law specific against that.... and there is a law against unlawful protests.

s breaking the law not breaking the law? If a First Nations person kills someone while drinking and driving... do you let them off the hook?

[lucafen4]

I've given up even trying to understand how to possibly respond to first nations issues in Canada. It's impossibly complex and way beyond my ability to give good insight into. Glad other smarter people than myself have to deal with it.

Every province has their own treaties (other than BC - but that creates its own quagmire of issues) As well as treaties with the Federal government respecting First Nations rights as well as land rights.

there's a reason universities offer a 4 year degree on First Nations Studies. It is that complicated.