[Re-signed] Jusse Saros

[Doug Glatt]

I think the main takeaway here hasn't really been highlighted.Rinne's perceived value is currently much lower than his actual value. There is a window open for a smart move. As long as the uninformed are still thinking this is Rinne's swan song you can snap him up for peanuts.

[Moses]

This is how I feel as well. I hope he proves me wrong but his name value seems too high for me.

Do you think he has NHL starting goalie in him or is he a tweener based solely on size? I assume you have seen a fair bit more of him than I have.

[Jouko-Pouko]

Do you think he has NHL starting goalie in him or is he a tweener based solely on size? I assume you have seen a fair bit more of him than I have.

His size means he has to work harder in net compared to bigger goalies, and therefore it's difficult to see him being able to do that for 55-60 games per season - and then the real games start after that. Great talent but the NHL schedule is brutal for smaller goalies.

[Axeman33]

His size means he has to work harder in net compared to bigger goalies, and therefore it's difficult to see him being able to do that for 55-60 games per season - and then the real games start after that. Great talent but the NHL schedule is brutal for smaller goalies.

I don't normally say this to you too often, but you are so wrong on this. Being smaller doesn't mean he has to work harder at all. I am a goalie, and I have been a goalie for over 35 years of my life, playing at various levels through out those years. I am 5'8" and in my late 40s and I still play in a competitive league. I dont work harder then other goalies who are bigger. I work smarter. I have no doubt that Saros does the same thing. He knows he's not as big so he has to be smarter at his positioning. It's all about his angles.

There is no reason that Saros cannot be a number one starting goalie, playing just as many games as the other number one goalies in the league. His size won't hold him back from playing that many games; his Coach will be the only thing that holds him back. As long as he's stopping the puck, something he does very well because he's a smart goalie, he shouldn't have any issues proving many wrong.

[donpaulo]

I was a little surprised at the term and amount of the deal but then he is sitting behind PR and only has 48 career game played.

I remember coming out of the gate this season Juuse was really struggling and had some very ugly numbers. However he sorted himself out and with some proper coaching and practice got back to his game which was 26GP and a .925%. Those are very good numbers for any goalie.

He also got into 4 playoff games after Rinne fumbled it putting up a .952% in 114 minutes of game time. Also noteworthy as his first 57 minutes of playoff hockey in 16-17 season showed an .824% so the kid has dramatically improved his focus and thrived under pressure vs the jets. The predators needed him to come in and play a solid game and he did exactly that. Huge for the team and the kid too.

Juuse is still only 23 years old and it was only his 2nd season in the NHL.

I don't buy the size argument but unlike axeman I am not a goalie so I will defer to his opinion in this regard.

I do know that with the new equipment and the reduction on stick/glove slashing with a preference to shooting off the rush or redirecting pucks towards the net it appears to this fan that playing the angles and staying on ones skates is what separates the wheat from the chaff so to speak. Saros is usually in very good position and rarely gets beaten once he establishes himself there and he has a very solid defense in front of him. I think we see a repeat performance with perhaps a few more games played, say 30-35.

He is exactly what nashville needs and just made millions of dollars playing backup goalie for a top NHL club.

Congrats to him

[Jouko-Pouko]

I don't normally say this to you too often, but you are so wrong on this. Being smaller doesn't mean he has to work harder at all. I am a goalie, and I have been a goalie for over 35 years of my life, playing at various levels through out those years. I am 5'8" and in my late 40s and I still play in a competitive league. I dont work harder then other goalies who are bigger. I work smarter. I have no doubt that Saros does the same thing. He knows he's not as big so he has to be smarter at his positioning. It's all about his angles.

There is no reason that Saros cannot be a number one starting goalie, playing just as many games as the other number one goalies in the league. His size won't hold him back from playing that many games; his Coach will be the only thing that holds him back. As long as he's stopping the puck, something he does very well because he's a smart goalie, he shouldn't have any issues proving many wrong.

Then please explain why there are no small starting goalies in the NHL. Even guys like Thomas and Halak only managed to do it for a year or two. There are plenty of small starting goalies in other leagues where the schedule isn't as bad.

EDIT: My research on this topic can be found from here: https://forums.dobbersports.com/show...48#post1830248

[Axeman33]

I dont have a scientific or fact driven answer for you. The best one I can give you is opinion. It's my opinion that teams still go on that ole way of thinking that a goalie has to be over 6 foot whatever to be successful in the NHL. Look how long it took the league to accept the fact that smaller players can play in this league and be successful. We still aren't 100% there, but we are certainly closer. The league isn't there yet on goalies.

I just disagree with you on your opinion that the league schedule is different or more difficult for smaller goalies. His size isn't the issue playing that many games; changing coaches/GMs train of thought is the issue. Hopefully Saros can do that.

[Jouko-Pouko]

I dont have a scientific or fact driven answer for you. The best one I can give you is opinion. It's my opinion that teams still go on that ole way of thinking that a goalie has to be over 6 foot whatever to be successful in the NHL. Look how long it took the league to accept the fact that smaller players can play in this league and be successful. We still aren't 100% there, but we are certainly closer. The league isn't there yet on goalies.

I just disagree with you on your opinion that the league schedule is different or more difficult for smaller goalies. His size isn't the issue playing that many games; changing coaches/GMs train of thought is the issue. Hopefully Saros can do that.

I'm hoping the best for him as well but odds are definitely stacked against him. I agree that we don't know for sure what's the reason small goalies can't have success in the NHL but either way, it seems pretty obvious that is the case. I just don't buy the explanation that maybe all small goalies are so bad that they can't force the decision. If they were able to be #1 goalies in the NHL, they would be. Something is blocking them from getting there, and my explanation is that it's the combination of their lack of size making things more difficult when they can't just block shots like bigger goalies, and that's too difficult to do over a gruesome schedule like what the NHL has. If someone else has a better and more reasonable explanation, I'm very much looking forward to it. Blaming coaches and GMs just doesn't seem reasonable to me.

[Axeman33]

I'm hoping the best for him as well but odds are definitely stacked against him. I agree that we don't know for sure what's the reason small goalies can't have success in the NHL but either way, it seems pretty obvious that is the case. I just don't buy the explanation that maybe all small goalies are so bad that they can't force the decision. If they were able to be #1 goalies in the NHL, they would be. Something is blocking them from getting there, and my explanation is that it's the combination of their lack of size making things more difficult when they can't just block shots like bigger goalies, and that's too difficult to do over a gruesome schedule like what the NHL has. If someone else has a better and more reasonable explanation, I'm very much looking forward to it. Blaming coaches and GMs just doesn't seem reasonable to me.

Fair enough. Obviously size affects how he plays, but it doesn't make playing the position more difficult. It just changes how one plays. That was the point I was trying to make.

[stevegamer]

I'm hoping the best for him as well but odds are definitely stacked against him. I agree that we don't know for sure what's the reason small goalies can't have success in the NHL but either way, it seems pretty obvious that is the case. I just don't buy the explanation that maybe all small goalies are so bad that they can't force the decision. If they were able to be #1 goalies in the NHL, they would be. Something is blocking them from getting there, and my explanation is that it's the combination of their lack of size making things more difficult when they can't just block shots like bigger goalies, and that's too difficult to do over a gruesome schedule like what the NHL has. If someone else has a better and more reasonable explanation, I'm very much looking forward to it. Blaming coaches and GMs just doesn't seem reasonable to me.

There's a real chance that part of the reason we aren't seeing as many smaller goalies is management bias. What characteristics are wanted in players is evolving in various sports. Sometimes a groupthink type of situation evolves, and that leads to a number of teams valuing things that don't actually matter to predict success, and failing to value things that do matter. Does goalie size matter? Probably a bit, but with the crackdown on all the extra gear that the netminders were wearing, it stands to reason that the larger goalie will lose more square inches of equipment than a smaller one. Perhaps that extra gear was helping larger goalies succeed more - I'm not sure that we could actually quantify that.

We've just seen the collection of castoffs that were the Vegas Golden Knights get to the Stanley Cup Final. Sometimes you just need an opportunity.

[Jouko-Pouko]

There's a real chance that part of the reason we aren't seeing as many smaller goalies is management bias. What characteristics are wanted in players is evolving in various sports. Sometimes a groupthink type of situation evolves, and that leads to a number of teams valuing things that don't actually matter to predict success, and failing to value things that do matter. Does goalie size matter? Probably a bit, but with the crackdown on all the extra gear that the netminders were wearing, it stands to reason that the larger goalie will lose more square inches of equipment than a smaller one. Perhaps that extra gear was helping larger goalies succeed more - I'm not sure that we could actually quantify that.

We've just seen the collection of castoffs that were the Vegas Golden Knights get to the Stanley Cup Final. Sometimes you just need an opportunity.

So you think teams have had great small goalies available for them but they've just decided to use lesser goalies because they're bigger? That just doesn't sound believable to me. Yes, I could buy a few teams making that mistake. But all 30/31 teams in the league year after year? That just doesn't sound reasonable.

Even with smaller skaters, there were always some teams willing to give those small guys a chance. Why hasn't that happened with small goalies with so many teams in dire need of better goaltending?

I'm not trying to pick a fight, and I know it's a popular opinion to blame the teams. But that doesn't mean it's correct. It's an easy answer but doesn't really seem reasonable when properly thinking about it.

[agentzero]

Anyone see/read Moneyball?

He may not look like a ball player, but he gets on base...

He may not look like an NHL goalie, but he makes saves...


After watching him play these last few seasons, I am a firm believer in his ability to deliver at the NHL level..

Also, I think his being smaller may make it easier on his body. His movements are more compact due to his smaller size, thus reducing exposure to injury..

[B3tt3rMan]

Great contract, I'm thinking he gets paid a pretty penny in 4 years from now as long as he can handle the heavier work load that'll be asked of him.

[CascadeFilly]

If Laviolette knows what's good for him and the Preds, he'll let Rinne carry the load in the regular season, then give Saros the reigns come playoff time.

[The Comish]

Interesting back and forth, thanks J-P and Axe. I hope "smaller" goalies (dammit, 6 foot tall people should not be called short! lol) can make some inroads back to NHL creases. I do know that when I look at my goalie prospects, I shy away from "smaller" goaltenders and when I see a "big" goalie with talent, I'm all over that.