[Imagined] MA Fleury to Toronto for Kadri (bigger package)

[Dobber]

What do you think of this? Just popped into my head yesterday, thought some of it made sense...

To Pittsburgh:
N. Kadri ($4.5 million), B. Leipsic + pick(s) to balance things out

To Toronto
Fleury ($5.75 million) + pick(s) to balance things out

Timeline: only happens after (if) Toronto signs Stamkos and drafts Matthews

Reasoning - Penguins need to get value for a goalie or they will lose one next summer. They are also handcuffed in salary, so this gives them a bit of breathing room. Leafs will soon have a strong core on D and FWD, but the weakness is in net. They would also not be able to use Kadri properly, given the pieces that are coming in. There is also no room in Toronto for Leipsic, but he's a worthwhile prospect to take a chance on, if you're the Penguins.

Flaws: Penguins have the same issues as Toronto will have - Kadri would be forced to play third-line center or moved to a wing. And what about Bonino?

[JagrBomb]

definitely not.

the leafs aren't going to win the cup in the next 3 years, perhaps not even make the playoffs. why trade a young #2C for a vet goalie that could potentially be a product of his team?

Fleury is going to get lit up if the leafs D doesn't improve this summer. that should be their number 1 priority. Kadri alone won't get the leafs a top 4D, but packaging some pick(s)/prospect(s) could get it done.

and if the leafs do end up signing Stamkos and want to accelerate the rebuild, then there are much cheaper options out there. goalie market has been shit for years, always more teams selling than there are buyers. add in the expansion draft threat for goaltending and it lowers the seller's asking price even more.

a team like CGY makes more sense for fleury. good team in front of him that could make the playoffs with him in net.

DAL has already stated they won't buy out lehtonen.

so perhaps Andersen to Toronto might be the goalie they get. PIT 1st (potentially last pick in the first) or TOR 2nd (1st pick in the 2nd) would be the max i'd give up, and that's only if the leafs sign Stamkos. otherwise they need to continue the slow rebuild, with acquiring D as their #1 priority this summer. There are a bunch of top 4 D potentially available too (barrie, shattenkirk, yandle, trouba, brodin, hamonic etc), but a lot of teams that are more desperate to win now will likely outbid them by overpaying. EDM, BOS etc

[yougo]

definitely not.

the leafs aren't going to win the cup in the next 3 years, perhaps not even make the playoffs. why trade a young #2C for a vet goalie that could potentially be a product of his team?

Fleury is going to get lit up if the leafs D doesn't improve this summer. that should be their number 1 priority. Kadri alone won't get the leafs a top 4D, but packaging some pick(s)/prospect(s) could get it done.

and if the leafs do end up signing Stamkos and want to accelerate the rebuild, then there are much cheaper options out there. goalie market has been shit for years, always more teams selling than there are buyers. add in the expansion draft threat for goaltending and it lowers the seller's asking price even more.

a team like CGY makes more sense for fleury. good team in front of him that could make the playoffs with him in net.

DAL has already stated they won't buy out lehtonen.

so perhaps Andersen to Toronto might be the goalie they get. PIT 1st (potentially last pick in the first) or TOR 2nd (1st pick in the 2nd) would be the max i'd give up, and that's only if the leafs sign Stamkos. otherwise they need to continue the slow rebuild, with acquiring D as their #1 priority this summer. There are a bunch of top 4 D potentially available too (barrie, shattenkirk, yandle, trouba, brodin, hamonic etc), but a lot of teams that are more desperate to win now will likely outbid them by overpaying. EDM, BOS etc

I agree with all of this except the bit of Fleury being a product of the team in front of him. Outside of Letang, the Pens defense is average at best. Fleury was the Pens MVP this regular season.

But yeah, I wouldn't do it if I was the Leafs.

[Pit Bulls]

....so perhaps Andersen to Toronto might be the goalie they get. PIT 1st (potentially last pick in the first) or TOR 2nd (1st pick in the 2nd) would be the max i'd give up, and that's only if the leafs sign Stamkos. otherwise they need to continue the slow rebuild, with acquiring D as their #1 priority this summer. There are a bunch of top 4 D potentially available too (barrie, shattenkirk, yandle, trouba, brodin, hamonic etc), but a lot of teams that are more desperate to win now will likely outbid them by overpaying. EDM, BOS etc

Exactly! I've been saying the same thing for a couple months now to a buddy of mine - Andersen makes more sense. But I was thinking Kadri for Andersen - the leafs keep their picks and ANA gets a much needed secondary scoring. One of Kadri or Bozak would be available IF the leafs sign Stamkos AND draft Matthews. Kadri would be more desireable to ANA than Bozak and there is nothing wrong with Bozak as the #3C.

[Dobber]

definitely not.

the leafs aren't going to win the cup in the next 3 years, perhaps not even make the playoffs. why trade a young #2C for a vet goalie that could potentially be a product of his team?

Fleury is going to get lit up if the leafs D doesn't improve this summer. that should be their number 1 priority. Kadri alone won't get the leafs a top 4D, but packaging some pick(s)/prospect(s) could get it done.

and if the leafs do end up signing Stamkos and want to accelerate the rebuild, then there are much cheaper options out there. goalie market has been shit for years, always more teams selling than there are buyers. add in the expansion draft threat for goaltending and it lowers the seller's asking price even more.

a team like CGY makes more sense for fleury. good team in front of him that could make the playoffs with him in net.

DAL has already stated they won't buy out lehtonen.

so perhaps Andersen to Toronto might be the goalie they get. PIT 1st (potentially last pick in the first) or TOR 2nd (1st pick in the 2nd) would be the max i'd give up, and that's only if the leafs sign Stamkos. otherwise they need to continue the slow rebuild, with acquiring D as their #1 priority this summer. There are a bunch of top 4 D potentially available too (barrie, shattenkirk, yandle, trouba, brodin, hamonic etc), but a lot of teams that are more desperate to win now will likely outbid them by overpaying. EDM, BOS etc

No, but starting goalies aren't easy to get. This summer is their shot at one. This summer's UFA crop is the best ever. Ever before, and likely the best for the next few years. If the Leafs sign Stamkos and Yandle, add Matthews and Nylander and Fleury, then things are a lot different. They don't need to go after a defenseman via trade. Lots of good UFA options.

I do agree with you about Calgary. Not making "more sense" but definitely making sense. And Andersen to the Leafs is my first option, if I were to choose. Fleury is of course Plan B.

[newfcollins]

dso perhaps Andersen to Toronto might be the goalie they get. PIT 1st (potentially last pick in the first) or TOR 2nd (1st pick in the 2nd) would be the max i'd give up, and that's only if the leafs sign Stamkos.

Problem is the draft takes place before the Leafs can even talk to Stamkos. So they would need to decide whether to make that deal regardless of if they sign Stammer or not.

[Zorro]

I can't really see this happening, I think Fleury will be a Star or a Flame personally.. But if Fleury was to become a Leaf I definitely don't agree with the people who think he is going to struggle.. The Penguins D is pretty much the same as the Leafs D..

[deantime419]

Flames, Canes, Sens are the teams I envisioned him going to. Leafs could fit the bill too though.

I pictured them getting a roster player with less value than Kadri+futures.

Stajan(salary retained) or Colborne.
Zack Smith and Anderson (salary retained).
Komarov, or Lupul/Michalek/Laich (salary retained).

[blayze]

I don't know why we would entertain that...

First of all, Fleury is the most overrated goalie in modern NHL history.

Secondly, our window to win a championship is at least 3-4 years from now... but then Stammer will be a Hasbeen and MAF will be even more horrendous than he is today.

[deantime419]

Fleury had a hell of a regular season this year. Arguably his best.

He won't get a huge return but I think a handful of teams have to be willing to give up some decent assets for him.

[STONE.]

Leafs could get Miller cheaper. Just saying. Make it happen.

[Dobber]

I don't know why we would entertain that...

First of all, Fleury is the most overrated goalie in modern NHL history.

Secondly, our window to win a championship is at least 3-4 years from now... but then Stammer will be a Hasbeen and MAF will be even more horrendous than he is today.

Is that the window if JVR, Rielly, Stamkos, Yandle, Nylander, Matthews, Vesey (or Radulov?) and Fleury are in the lineup next season? Not that they'd walk out and win a Cup first year, but is the timeline still 3-4 years if those players are on board? I'm still in the hypothetical fairy-tale land of course...but if we're in this land I made up, we may as well be all the way in. Is that the window with these players added?

- - - Updated - - -

Leafs could get Miller cheaper. Just saying. Make it happen.

Hoo boy...ideally you'd want to upgrade Bernier, not downgrade the stickboy....

[blayze]

Is that the window if JVR, Rielly, Stamkos, Yandle, Nylander, Matthews, Vesey (or Radulov?) and Fleury are in the lineup next season? Not that they'd walk out and win a Cup first year, but is the timeline still 3-4 years if those players are on board? I'm still in the hypothetical fairy-tale land of course...but if we're in this land I made up, we may as well be all the way in. Is that the window with these players added?

Daryl... you know I'm one of the biggest Stamkos nut-hugger on these forums (remember those epic Stamkos vs Malkin threads?!?) ... and even I know bringing Stammer to Toronto would be a terrible move.

By the time our crop of youngsters have developed to their potential, Stammer/Yandle will long be hasbeens and Fleury will the new JS Giguere...

As much as I think Kadri is a douchebag, he is an important piece of the puzzle... a solid two-way 2nd line center who can score. Why give him up for a mentally fragile goalie who just got supplanted by a back-up? Especially when we're TRYING to accumulate more picks!

We need to tank for another couple of years, grab a few more top 5 picks, and then make our push in 2020+.

Have some patience... it's all about the long game

[Dobber]

This summer is a once in a lifetime opportunity to turn an eight-year rebuild into a three-year rebuild. The quality of this crop of UFA's has never before been seen - and will never be seen again. If the Oilers had this crop two summers ago, they'd have enjoyed two playoff runs by now.
Leafs have enough picks. Acquiring more is no longer high on the agenda. 13 will tie an NHL record this month.

I have patience, you know that. Simply by how long I've stuck by the Oilers' plan should say as much.

[blayze]

This summer is a once in a lifetime opportunity to turn an eight-year rebuild into a three-year rebuild. The quality of this crop of UFA's has never before been seen - and will never be seen again. If the Oilers had this crop two summers ago, they'd have enjoyed two playoff runs by now.
Leafs have enough picks. Acquiring more is no longer high on the agenda. 13 will tie an NHL record this month.

I have patience, you know that. Simply by how long I've stuck by the Oilers' plan should say as much.

Ok, let's play it out and pretend the rebuild does happen and we sell the farm to acquire the lineup you mention above: Stammer, Yandle, Fleury, Matthews, JVR, Nylander, Rielly, etc.

Let's also pretend that Stammer's health isn't going to be an issue, and while we're at it, might as well stretch and pretend that all the youngsters develop the way we think they should.

Even in that scenario - I personally don't see that lineup as a cup caliber team. I see it as a 2nd round team at best.