Your thoughts on the legalization of marijuana

[forumname]

wtf is a "wonder-bread type" anyway?

You don't put miracle whip on your wonder bread?

[StuntMan12]

Do any of you have family that think it's shameful to smoke weed? Or kind of look down on you for being a weed smoker?

[rataylor22]

Decriminalization or legalization does not deal with removing the organized crime aspect of it directly. By legalizing marijuna, we are just making it legal to smoke it, but there is nothing done to crack down further on the illegal distribution of it. If it's cheaper to get it from a pusher, people will still buy it buy it from them (chemicals or not). And if it's legal to smoke it, organized crime will be able to sell it with more ease. Basically, decriminalization or legalization is good business for organized crime.


EDIT (added on):
I doubt making it legal will greatly increase the number of smokers (it will but I do not think it will be substantial). With that in mind, do you really think the current method of getting weed from all the smokers out there will drastically change (pushers, friends of friends... all linked back to the mob)? I think everything has to do with the price and ease of getting the substance.

The example of alcohol was brought up; if you could get illegal booze that tasted and looked exactly like that of the SAQ, LCBO or other stores, but at a fraction of the price, would you do it? Maybe, maybe not, right... but that would be linked to the fact that you are accustomed to the ''real thing'' already so why get an illegal form of it... With marijuna, the known thing IS the illegal format of it! If that version is cheaper than another version of it, why would you go for the new more expensive thing if you are already OK buying the illegal thing?!

I can't tell if you're more knowledgeable than me on the subject, or far less. What I do know is your whole concept of "a fraction of the price" is incredibly wrong or else you're using the phrase incorrectly. How much cheaper do you think an illegal dealer can afford to sell it over a "licensed dealer". I'd be willing to be the cheapest they could go would be 8/10s or maybe 7/10s of the price. So sure that's a fraction, but that's not the proper way to use that saying. And like I said. All it takes is about half the current market to start buying from licensed dealers and all of a sudden the competition is way too high and unprofitable for illegal sources to keep dealing.

[Mr. Guru]

if you could get illegal booze that tasted and looked exactly like that of the SAQ, LCBO or other stores, but at a fraction of the price, would you do it? Maybe, maybe not, right... but that would be linked to the fact that you are accustomed to the ''real thing'' already so why get an illegal form of it...

Booze was illegal. Than it was legal.

No one bought the illegal booze anymore.

[CascadeFilly]

For the sake of stating my opinion, I think it's a bad idea to legalize it. We're about to de-stigmatize a drug by making it legal, and I don't think it's a good idea at all.

[Loch]

For the sake of stating my opinion, I think it's a bad idea to legalize it. We're about to de-stigmatize a drug by making it legal, and I don't think it's a good idea at all.

I don't know that there is a massive stigma attached to it's current illegality. (of course, I live in BC, soo....)

Pot has been one of (if not the) largest cash crops in BC for years... the only thing legalizing it will increase is tax revenue. Plus, it is a little weird to go on a road trip through Washington and Oregon and have BC (of all places) be the one with restrictive pot laws. Just feels unnatural.

Oh, and I do not typically partake... one pot brownie years ago is it for me.

[Bass56]

Booze was illegal. Than it was legal.

No one bought the illegal booze anymore.

I was illustrating an example in today's society, where something you know as being legal (alcohol sales in OUR lifetime) could be sold illegally in contrast to a substance that is illegal as we know it to be sold in a legal form (once again, in OUR lifetime).

[Mr. Guru]

But all you have to do is look at history....

[Bass56]

I can't tell if you're more knowledgeable than me on the subject, or far less. What I do know is your whole concept of "a fraction of the price" is incredibly wrong or else you're using the phrase incorrectly. How much cheaper do you think an illegal dealer can afford to sell it over a "licensed dealer". I'd be willing to be the cheapest they could go would be 8/10s or maybe 7/10s of the price. So sure that's a fraction, but that's not the proper way to use that saying. And like I said. All it takes is about half the current market to start buying from licensed dealers and all of a sudden the competition is way too high and unprofitable for illegal sources to keep dealing.

Yes the fraction part was meant as a ''rebate'' or 7/10ths-like. Basically, if you can get a gram for less than 10$ illegally, unless the legal version matches that price (the current average in Colorado looks more like $13 per g.) I don't think the illegal sales will be wipped out. Now if the current illegal price drops even more to outweigh the new entrant (offer and demand curve), the illegal sales should continue to thrive.

My argument was linked to the fact that marijuana is currently being purchased AND consumed illegally. Even if it becomes legal to purchase from specific selling points and legal to smoke, I doubt those who are currently buying the substance illegally will all buy it from legal sellers unless the price is lower at these new selling points. Also, if the ''buzz effect'' is less present with the legal version, price won't even factor in the customers' decision IMO (or vice versa but I doubt the legal form will be stronger).

Now if there was to be a legalization AND a severe crackdown on illegal sales (i.e. purchasing and/or selling gets stiffer punishments), than organized crime sales would take a much harder hit! As I said, just making it legal doesn't hurt the illegal activity as much as some say.

[Bass56]

But all you have to do is look at history....

I am, just from another perspective

Illegal activity back then existed and thrived, illegal activity exists now and is thriving. Where there's a way, there's a will (not the other way around in mob terms).

I do understand that the illegal booze era has ended and legalization is mainly what killed it, but what about fake liscended products and under-aged workers; both are illegal, yet clients continue to purchase goods related to this because the alternative serves a similar purpose yet costs less!

As my argument said, making a legal version alone won't kill the illegal problem like it did with the booze era. More severe punishments for those involved in selling AND/OR purchasing illegally must be implemented to stop the problem.

[rataylor22]

Yes the fraction part was meant as a ''rebate'' or 7/10ths-like. Basically, if you can get a gram for less than 10$ illegally, unless the legal version matches that price (the current average in Colorado looks more like $13 per g.) I don't think the illegal sales will be wipped out. Now if the current illegal price drops even more to outweigh the new entrant (offer and demand curve), the illegal sales should continue to thrive.

Yes ok but what you're not seeming to understand is that the current illegal sellers cannot afford to drop their price any lower and continue to make a profit.

My argument was linked to the fact that marijuana is currently being purchased AND consumed illegally. Even if it becomes legal to purchase from specific selling points and legal to smoke, I doubt those who are currently buying the substance illegally will all buy it from legal sellers unless the price is lower at these new selling points. Also, if the ''buzz effect'' is less present with the legal version, price won't even factor in the customers' decision IMO (or vice versa but I doubt the legal form will be stronger).

Now if there was to be a legalization AND a severe crackdown on illegal sales (i.e. purchasing and/or selling gets stiffer punishments), than organized crime sales would take a much harder hit! As I said, just making it legal doesn't hurt the illegal activity as much as some say.

As has been quoted before, currently the "medical" version of marijuana is generally the best/strongest product you can buy. So to say "I doubt the legal form will be stronger" is far fetched at best. Legal growing operations will be held up to standards and proper growing conditions. And I think if you could walk 2 blocks to your local shop or trying to arrange a meetup with your dealer, the majority of people would choose the shop, even if it was a little more expensive, just for ease and convenience. Hell, in Alberta Co-op and Costco are the 2 cheapest places to buy alcohol, but tons of 1 off liquor stores thrive and exist because people will always choose convenience of walking a block to the liquor store than having to drive 10 minutes to get the best price. The "illegal" sellers would have to have a substantially lower price to make them the most attractive option, and they simply CANT afford to be that much lower.

I am, just from another perspective

Illegal activity back then existed and thrived, illegal activity exists now and is thriving. Where there's a way, there's a will (not the other way around in mob terms).

I do understand that the illegal booze era has ended and legalization is mainly what killed it, but what about fake liscended products and under-aged workers; both are illegal, yet clients continue to purchase goods related to this because the alternative serves a similar purpose yet costs less!

As my argument said, making a legal version alone won't kill the illegal problem like it did with the booze era. More severe punishments for those involved in selling AND/OR purchasing illegally must be implemented to stop the problem.

This is just a bad argument. Making weed legal won't kill the drug problem, but it will end the unregulated and unlicensed sales of weed problem. Fake licensed products and under age workers still exist because they are SUBSTANTIALLY cheaper than the legal alternative. You don't seem to understand that the markup/profit margin on weed doesn't exist to the point where an illegal dealer can provide a substantial price saving.

You're arguing that the illegal dealer will just make their price lower so that they are the most attractive option. Making their price substantially lower will mean they won't make any money. Making their price marginally lower won't make them a more attractive option over convenience. So eventually they stop selling because the price they're selling at isn't making them a tangible profit, or eventually they stop selling because nobody is bothering to come to them for a marginally lower price. In the end, the result is the same. If it's not worth it for the seller, and it's not worth it for the buyer, then the market dies out. It won't be immediate, I'm sure selling alcohol illegally once prohibition ended still happened for a while, but it will die it. To say it's not a direct comparison because it was a different era is silly.

[Mr. Guru]

And if drug dealers were to make the alternative cheaper....like fake licensed products....the quality won't be near the same.......like fake licensed products

[Bass56]

Yes ok but what you're not seeming to understand is that the current illegal sellers cannot afford to drop their price any lower and continue to make a profit.



As has been quoted before, currently the "medical" version of marijuana is generally the best/strongest product you can buy. So to say "I doubt the legal form will be stronger" is far fetched at best. Legal growing operations will be held up to standards and proper growing conditions. And I think if you could walk 2 blocks to your local shop or trying to arrange a meetup with your dealer, the majority of people would choose the shop, even if it was a little more expensive, just for ease and convenience. Hell, in Alberta Co-op and Costco are the 2 cheapest places to buy alcohol, but tons of 1 off liquor stores thrive and exist because people will always choose convenience of walking a block to the liquor store than having to drive 10 minutes to get the best price. The "illegal" sellers would have to have a substantially lower price to make them the most attractive option, and they simply CANT afford to be that much lower.



This is just a bad argument. Making weed legal won't kill the drug problem, but it will end the unregulated and unlicensed sales of weed problem. Fake licensed products and under age workers still exist because they are SUBSTANTIALLY cheaper than the legal alternative. You don't seem to understand that the markup/profit margin on weed doesn't exist to the point where an illegal dealer can provide a substantial price saving.

You're arguing that the illegal dealer will just make their price lower so that they are the most attractive option. Making their price substantially lower will mean they won't make any money. Making their price marginally lower won't make them a more attractive option over convenience. So eventually they stop selling because the price they're selling at isn't making them a tangible profit, or eventually they stop selling because nobody is bothering to come to them for a marginally lower price. In the end, the result is the same. If it's not worth it for the seller, and it's not worth it for the buyer, then the market dies out. It won't be immediate, I'm sure selling alcohol illegally once prohibition ended still happened for a while, but it will die it. To say it's not a direct comparison because it was a different era is silly.

Rataylor; if the current seller at the corner of the street pockets $1 from a $9 sale, he will most likely pocket that same dollar on a $6 sale should THE BIG GUYS on top of the food chain take a cut in order to still make money. Like I said, where there's a way, there's a will. The money to be made from weed does not come from dealers; it comes from higher up. If they still want to do business, they drop the price; that's all. The dealers are just distribution means, not big profit makers! Common man, it's not rocket science!

Also, I get your example of convenience, but that just validates my point! A dealer is convenient; a weed bank is not IMO unless they are at every corner. I don't know if you can get weed in the legalized areas 24/7 (in North America), but I know you can right now illegally. Also, people ''will not drive the extra 10 minutes'' to get more expensive weed if their dealer is just around the corner!

As for the strenght of the product; I just read that it is cleaner, not stronger. I may be wrong, but that it why I said ''I doubt'' and not ''it is''.

We both have arguments for and against this, but until it is fully deployed and in place for some time, we won't know which side wins.

[Bass56]

And if drug dealers were to make the alternative cheaper....like fake licensed products....the quality won't be near the same.......like fake licensed products

Quality yes; use no! You buy a knockoff for the look and social recognition, not the durability. You smoke weed for a buzz, not a body cleanse! I agree that there are many harmful chemicals in the street drug, but the legal version will not be a ''healty option'', just a cleaner one. Like I said in another post; the strenght of the product combined with the price of it will dictate which version will thrive.

Speaking of GURU and health; the majority of the people don't buy Guru organic energy drinks although they are one of the only ones sold in North America that are organically certified. People still drink the Monsters and Rockstars even though they are filled with crap because they are less expensive, yet still pack a punch! I know I did go off tangent here and I don't want to use it as an example to illustarte my point about weed, but I do find it amusing that it connects your name with a similar example

[rataylor22]

Rataylor; if the current seller at the corner of the street pockets $1 from a $9 sale, he will most likely pocket that same dollar on a $6 sale should THE BIG GUYS on top of the food chain take a cut in order to still make money. Like I said, where there's a way, there's a will. The money to be made from weed does not come from dealers; it comes from higher up. If they still want to do business, they drop the price; that's all. The dealers are just distribution means, not big profit makers! Common man, it's not rocket science!

Also, I get your example of convenience, but that just validates my point! A dealer is convenient; a weed bank is not IMO unless they are at every corner. I don't know if you can get weed in the legalized areas 24/7 (in North America), but I know you can right now illegally. Also, people ''will not drive the extra 10 minutes'' to get more expensive weed if their dealer is just around the corner!

As for the strenght of the product; I just read that it is cleaner, not stronger. I may be wrong, but that it why I said ''I doubt'' and not ''it is''.

We both have arguments for and against this, but until it is fully deployed and in place for some time, we won't know which side wins.

Quality yes; use no! You buy a knockoff for the look and social recognition, not the durability. You smoke weed for a buzz, not a body cleanse! I agree that there are many harmful chemicals in the street drug, but the legal version will not be a ''healty option'', just a cleaner one. Like I said in another post; the strenght of the product combined with the price of it will dictate which version will thrive.

Speaking of GURU and health; the majority of the people don't buy Guru organic energy drinks although they are one of the only ones sold in North America that are organically certified. People still drink the Monsters and Rockstars even though they are filled with crap because they are less expensive, yet still pack a punch! I know I did go off tangent here and I don't want to use it as an example to illustarte my point about weed, but I do find it amusing that it connects your name with a similar example

Exactly. If you want to just stubbornly beat your head on the wall spouting shit you have no idea what you're talking about, I guess I can't stop you. But yea, you've made it clear you don't have any idea what you're talking about at this point.