Av's listening to offers on O'Reilly

[Axeman33]

Come on, you're better than that.

In the interest of no one putting words in my mouth, I think the Avs are a young team with wavering effort levels, poor defense, and some exciting young talent. I get to see them a fair bit in the Central. I see ROR as a young, strong, versatile two-way forward, who I'd wager is worth around 6M in today's NHL, but if a team paid him 7M, there are worse ways to "waste" that 1M. Just my opinion. I know nothing of the guy's character or anything like that. I just like what I see when I watch him play.

And you are better than that if you don`t think the loss of Paul Stastny played a big role in these young players decline this past season.

[marshal]

Buyer beware when the Avs have been trying to move him for a couple years now and he's expecting quite the extension. I bet most of the league is scared of acquiring this guy at a high cost, having him play for a year and then having their feet held to the fire to re-sign him long-term, or watching him walk in the summer.

As an O'Reilly owner in a non-cap league, I'm very interested to see where he goes. Don't think his ceiling is higher than 65 pts/season, but if he lucks out and gets dealt to a powerhouse team... Here's hoping.

[yougo]

And you are better than that if you don`t think the loss of Paul Stastny played a big role in these young players decline this past season.

To say the loss of Stastny played a big role is not accurate. It did play a role, but a small one. The Avs disappointing season was very easy to predict. They had an inflated shooting percentage and save percentage in 2013-14, it was due to come back to normal and it did. It's that that simple really. They're PDO was through the roof in 2013-14. Now they didn't make any upgrade last off-season and lost a top6 player in Stastny, who they replaced with Iginla (who brings probably more value on the ice than Stastny).

[CascadeFilly]

And you are better than that if you don`t think the loss of Paul Stastny played a big role in these young players decline this past season.

Obviously it had an effect, but most pundits expected the team to fall back to earth last season, because the advanced stats indicated that likelihood.

[Axeman33]

The fact remains that ROR hit the jackpot a couple years ago when he got offer sheeted and he's been living on the premise that he's worth that much, and now more since that contract expired. He isn't worth that much.

$7M+ is a number normally a number you see given to players who have proven themselves for years and have earned it the right to ask for that much money. This kid is 24 years old and has one season over 60 points for his career. One season. Now I realize there's more to hockey then putting up points, but when you are a top six player you are expected to produce at a higher rate than that, if you are earning that much money. He is paid like he's the best player on their team and I don't even think he's in the top three. He might be number 4 but he isn't at the top. I'd want Duchene, MacKinnon and Barrie before ROR. O'Reilly had two more points than Barrie last year.

Don't get me wrong, I am not saying this kid isn't a good hockey player and doesn't still have upside, but his salary is too far ahead of his career at this point. He hasn't done enough to warrant asking for that much money at this stage in his career.

That's my opinion and how I see Ryan O'Reilly at this point. Over-paid for the return on the dollar and he has been ever since he got offered that silly contract by Calgary that was matched by Colorado. He wasn't worth the $10M over two years back then, and he's barely worth that much today.

Maybe someday he will be worth $7M, but he isn't to me at this point. If you guys can't see that then there isn't much more I can say on this.

If this kid is as good as you all think he is, and worth the money you say he is, then why are the Avalanche trying so damn hard to move him? One would think this is exactly the type of player a team would want to build around. Ev said it himself, these are the type of players you need to win. I guess Colorado proved that was not the case last year.

[YzermansLegacy]

There was a moment last year when Joe spoke out and I thought the situation might be salvageable. Now, if this has merit, I just don't see them making amends.

Dutchie is an excellent 2-way C and between him and Mack, you're looking at a dynamite 1-2 down the middle. Crazy speed in a game that's turning more towards speed. And with Bleackley on the way as a potential defensive 3C, I think the writing's on the wall that ROR is a goner.

Maybe not by this summer, although I think that's most likely, but definitely before he becomes a UFA after next season.

The Avs aren't in a position where they can lose that kind of asset for nothing like they did with Stastny. They have holes to fill and ROR would be coveted by a number of teams imo.

[marshal]

The fact remains that ROR hit the jackpot a couple years ago when he got offer sheeted and he's been living on the premise that he's worth that much, and now more since that contract expired. He isn't worth that much.

$7M+ is a number normally a number you see given to players who have proven themselves for years and have earned it the right to ask for that much money. This kid is 24 years old and has one season over 60 points for his career. One season. Now I realize there's more to hockey then putting up points, but when you are a top six player you are expected to produce at a higher rate than that, if you are earning that much money. He is paid like he's the best player on their team and I don't even think he's in the top three. He might be number 4 but he isn't at the top. I'd want Duchene, MacKinnon and Barrie before ROR. O'Reilly had two more points than Barrie last year.

Don't get me wrong, I am not saying this kid isn't a good hockey player and doesn't still have upside, but his salary is too far ahead of his career at this point. He hasn't done enough to warrant asking for that much money at this stage in his career.

That's my opinion and how I see Ryan O'Reilly at this point. Over-paid for the return on the dollar and he has been ever since he got offered that silly contract by Calgary that was matched by Colorado. He wasn't worth the $10M over two years back then, and he's barely worth that much today.

Maybe someday he will be worth $7M, but he isn't to me at this point. If you guys can't see that then there isn't much more I can say on this.

If this kid is as good as you all think he is, and worth the money you say he is, then why are the Avalanche trying so damn hard to move him? One would think this is exactly the type of player a team would want to build around. Ev said it himself, these are the type of players you need to win. I guess Colorado proved that was not the case last year.

Agree with all of this.

Only thing I would add/ask - wasn't O'Reilly asking $6M/annually from the Avs before the Flames made the offer sheet to him?

[Big Baby]

Come on, you're better than that.

In the interest of no one putting words in my mouth, I think the Avs are a young team with wavering effort levels, poor defense, and some exciting young talent. I get to see them a fair bit in the Central. I see ROR as a young, strong, versatile two-way forward, who I'd wager is worth around 6M in today's NHL, but if a team paid him 7M, there are worse ways to "waste" that 1M. Just my opinion. I know nothing of the guy's character or anything like that. I just like what I see when I watch him play.

I watch the Avalanche play a lot as well. CascadePhilly knows what he's talking about. ROR is a number 1 C on quite a few teams and $7m is well worth his services. He is still very young and plays like a veteran. Im a leaf and penguins fan and would gladly trade kessel or Malkin for ROR + a prospect and pick.

[STLblues]

Who would have guessed that ROR is the summer of 2015 version of yak....lol

[Axeman33]

I watch the Avalanche play a lot as well. CascadePhilly knows what he's talking about. ROR is a number 1 C on quite a few teams and $7m is well worth his services. He is still very young and plays like a veteran. Im a leaf and penguins fan and would gladly trade kessel or Malkin for ROR + a prospect and pick.

Again, if all this is in fact the case, why are the Av's trying so hard to trade him then?

[2014olympicgold]

Talent wise he is very good. He won’t blow the barn doors open with points, but his prevention and ability to play in all aspects of the game is his bonus. 7mill for a guy who will play PP, Even, and the PK is rare now a days. I would love someone with that talent and abilities on my team, but ROR agent…I get the sense he’s just too much for GMs to deal with.

No one really has proof the guy needs to head to an asylum, but to walk into a negotiation and practically say “we want 6mill for 6yrs” and just repeat that over and over what I think he does is odd. That’s not negotiating, that’s a hostage taking really. Now, ROR could easily tell the agent “this is what I want, nothing less”, which makes the agent the best rule follower ever.

We all know 1 team out of 30 would pay a 24yr old 7millx7yrs easily because if that team is young and not going to do well for 3+years, 7mill come 2018 could look very good for a No1 center. And if he doesn’t do well as a No1 center, 7mill for a solid 2-way No2 center could still be very good.

[Pengwin7]

ROR is OK... I think he's an NHL C2.
And the current pay for that role is about $5.5m.
Which means somebody is going to shell out $6m or $6.5m.

It makes sense for the Avs to entertain offers because they really DO need to look at the future as Duchene/MacKinnon and push MacK to play center.

I've said before, with the current young elite players getting $6m or $6m+... that makes that number what MacK will get... which means ROR, being better, will feel he "deserves" more. (Note: COL have two wingers in possible last year with team: Tanguay & Iginla).

So yeah... COL might as well move him if they can.
Now is a good time considering the NHL draft is (apparently) pretty deep this year in top two round talent.

In truth though, let's throw out ROR's 2013-2014 year, where all Avs had high numbers due to "luck-high" SH% for the Avs.
In the last 4 years, ROR is basically a 55pt player in 19:30 of TOI/game.

55pt-ish centers: Tyler Bozak, Ryan Kesler, Mikko Koivu, Tomas Plekanec
Yeah... I'd say $5m-$6m is about the range for this kind of guy.


As a trade partner goes... how about Toronto?
They'll be a cap spending team... Bozak's got a $4.2m cap hit with 3 years left.

My proposed trade (straight flip):
TOR gets: Ryan O'Reilly. One year left at $6.0m hit. TOR goes with ROR/Kadri as C1a/C1b. If JVR-ROR-Kessel chemistry works, great - give ROR a nice fat $7m+ contract. If not, buh-bye in 2016.
COL gets: Tyler Bozak. Three years left at $4.2m hit. COL saves cap room and gets a two-way (lesser offense) center back. They can even put him on MacKinnon's RW as defensive safe-guard while MacK learns the C2.

What say you TOR & COL fans?
Good trade or bad trade for your team?

[JagrBomb]

ROR is OK... I think he's an NHL C2.
And the current pay for that role is about $5.5m.
Which means somebody is going to shell out $6m or $6.5m.

It makes sense for the Avs to entertain offers because they really DO need to look at the future as Duchene/MacKinnon and push MacK to play center.

I've said before, with the current young elite players getting $6m or $6m+... that makes that number what MacK will get... which means ROR, being better, will feel he "deserves" more. (Note: COL have two wingers in possible last year with team: Tanguay & Iginla).

So yeah... COL might as well move him if they can.
Now is a good time considering the NHL draft is (apparently) pretty deep this year in top two round talent.

In truth though, let's throw out ROR's 2013-2014 year, where all Avs had high numbers due to "luck-high" SH% for the Avs.
In the last 4 years, ROR is basically a 55pt player in 19:30 of TOI/game.

55pt-ish centers: Tyler Bozak, Ryan Kesler, Mikko Koivu, Tomas Plekanec
Yeah... I'd say $5m-$6m is about the range for this kind of guy.


As a trade partner goes... how about Toronto?
They'll be a cap spending team... Bozak's got a $4.2m cap hit with 3 years left.

My proposed trade (straight flip):
TOR gets: Ryan O'Reilly. One year left at $6.0m hit. TOR goes with ROR/Kadri as C1a/C1b. If JVR-ROR-Kessel chemistry works, great - give ROR a nice fat $7m+ contract. If not, buh-bye in 2016.
COL gets: Tyler Bozak. Three years left at $4.2m hit. COL saves cap room and gets a two-way (lesser offense) center back. They can even put him on MacKinnon's RW as defensive safe-guard while MacK learns the C2.

What say you TOR & COL fans?
Good trade or bad trade for your team?

as a leafs fan i'd be fine with it, but the avs are looking for a D, preferably LH shot.

phaneuf/o'reilly swap would make sense but i think they prefer gardiner.

[ericdaoust]

The Avs have major needs on D and they will focus heavily there but they also have a hole on RW if O'Reilly moves on and MacKinnon shifts over to C. I think they will try to land a top-4 D via trade (O'Reilly) and another through free agency which will leave a bunch of their depth D in limbo. RW might be another revolving door situation with McGinn, Everberg, Hishon and Rendulic taking turns. Of course with Briere's contract off the books they might have enough to fetch a solid RW in free agency. Not enough coffee in me to play capologist.

[2014olympicgold]

With about half of Toronto’s forwards making between 1-3mill next yr, I think they can afford ROR, even come 2016-17. But with ROR, I’d bet Avs target a d-man.