Career Backup Vezina Trophy Winner?

[27Blue]

another guy who just looks at the coach
talk about naive...

hitch has coached many goaltenders, even a cup winner, and none of them have put up numbers like elliott did this year. none. not even close. why not? why couldn't hitch get them 940 save percentages?

the blues are the first team that elliott has played for that has had any kind of defence. when he was playing in ottawa, the team sucked. plain and simple. he sucked, their defence sucked, they all sucked.

he isn't the best goalie in the world. he probably wouldn't thrive as a clear-cut number one. but what he did in 40 games this year deserves credit. a shut-out in nearly 1/4 of his starts. come-on. hitch helped, but elliott was a man on fire. nearly every single game that he played all year.

[mister_mcgoo]

another guy who just looks at the coach
talk about naive...

hitch has coached many goaltenders, even a cup winner, and none of them have put up numbers like elliott did this year. none. not even close. why not? why couldn't hitch get them 940 save percentages?

the blues are the first team that elliott has played for that has had any kind of defence. when he was playing in ottawa, the team sucked. plain and simple. he sucked, their defence sucked, they all sucked.

he isn't the best goalie in the world. he probably wouldn't thrive as a clear-cut number one. but what he did in 40 games this year deserves credit. a shut-out in nearly 1/4 of his starts. come-on. hitch helped, but elliott was a man on fire. nearly every single game that he played all year.

Are you not paying attention here or what? I mentioned Hitch only as an aside to the whole argument and then that's all you focus on -lol. You are right if you are arguing that Hitch is not the sole reason Elliot posted such great numbers, but it doesn't follow from that argument that he is not a factor in the equation! Any coach who can make Marty Turco look like a star is a big factor in the equation, sorry bub.

But the point you should be paying attention to here more than anything is the relatively small subset of games you are basing this whole 'best goalie in the league' argument off of. Its the same dumb shit you tried to pull with the Pietrangelo a couple weeks ago...its not that you aren't well within your rights to sing their praises and be bullish on their potential for the future but you can't go making sweeping statements like this with not even half a season to base it off of, especially when said goalie finished the season on a 4 game losing streak (a sweep nonethless) posting numbers of 3.31 GAA and .854 S%! You should do a little homework and look into the mercurial career of Steve Mason a bit before you get out of hand with Elliot. He's had ONE good half season, that's all

[27Blue]

Are you not paying attention here or what? I mentioned Hitch only as an aside to the whole argument and then that's all you focus on -lol. You are right if you are arguing that Hitch is not the sole reason Elliot posted such great numbers, but it doesn't follow from that argument that he is not a factor in the equation! Any coach who can make Marty Turco look like a star is a big factor in the equation, sorry bub.

But the point you should be paying attention to here more than anything is the relatively small subset of games you are basing this whole 'best goalie in the league' argument off of. Its the same dumb shit you tried to pull with the Pietrangelo a couple weeks ago...its not that you aren't well within your rights to sing their praises and be bullish on their potential for the future but you can't go making sweeping statements like this with not even half a season to base it off of, especially when said goalie finished the season on a 4 game losing streak (a sweep nonethless) posting numbers of 3.31 GAA and .854 S%! You should do a little homework and look into the mercurial career of Steve Mason a bit before you get out of hand with Elliot. He's had ONE good half season, that's all

you need to go back and reread my posts - or maybe go back to school to learn to read. cause i never said anything about elliott being the best goalie anywhere... in fact, i said the opposite - twice. i will say it one more time for you really slowly so that you can follow:

e l l i o t t i s n o t t h e b e s t g o a l i e BUT h e p l a y e d
g r e a t t h i s y e a r a n d h e d e s e r v e s c r e d i t f o r i t ! ! ! !

[mister_mcgoo]

you need to go back and reread my posts - or maybe go back to school to learn to read. cause i never said anything about elliott being the best goalie anywhere... in fact, i said the opposite - twice. i will say it one more time for you really slowly so that you can follow:

e l l i o t t i s n o t t h e b e s t g o a l i e BUT h e p l a y e d
g r e a t t h i s y e a r a n d h e d e s e r v e s c r e d i t f o r i t ! ! ! !

learn to read? you need to learn to ****ing express yourself properly dude, this is similar to the bullshit you pulled with the Pietrangelo post...its not that you're necessarily wrong in your belief that these players had tremendous seasons and show incredible promise, most of us aren't going to disagree with that one iota...its that you make these blanket statements on these players without qualifying them and with an incredibly limited sample of data to base it off of.

This is what you said verbatim on Elliot:

truth is, elliott was one of the very best goaltenders in the league this year.

did I accuse you of calling him the best ever? No. I quoted you pretty exactly in fact, so why would you assume I meant something other than what I said? Why would you assume I was applying my statement to some different context than what was being discussed? IMO there was a lot of great goaltending in the NHL this season... but I prefer to base my opinion on full body of work raher than 38 starts...so yeah, Lundqvist, Quick, Rinne for example are guys who have proven they are the real deal and win despite their team's play and have done so for several years now...guys like Elliot and Smith had great seasons statistically to be sure but they also had a lot of help and haven't proven they can handle the full laod on their own, especially when their team struggles...when Elliot proves that then you can start making sweeping statements like you seem so very fond of

[27Blue]

typical...

[mister_mcgoo]

typical...

what? that you overstate every single aspect you discuss that is Blues related? You need to give your head a good shake, your team just got SWEPT 4-0 and it wasn't even close, where was this amazing goalie in this series? Where was that vaunted .940 s%?...great goalies win big games when their team needs it most, they make the clutch saves when it counts, that is the true measure of a great goalie, its not just stats (look no further than Osgood for that), and its certainly not just a half season...if guys like Carey and Mason can fool us for a whole season then I'm sorry but we need to hold that kind of sweeping qualification to a slightly higher standard than 38 GP

[hockeyrobot]

what? that you overstate every single aspect you discuss that is Blues related? You need to give your head a good shake, your team just got SWEPT 4-0 and it wasn't even close, where was this amazing goalie in this series? Where was that vaunted .940 s%?...great goalies win big games when their team needs it most, they make the clutch saves when it counts, that is the true measure of a great goalie, its not just stats (look no further than Osgood for that), and its certainly not just a half season...if guys like Carey and Mason can fool us for a whole season then I'm sorry but we need to hold that kind of sweeping qualification to a slightly higher standard than 38 GP

Gonna have to agree with mcgoo on this one....but that's probably expected because I was also opposing Innocent Bystander in the great AP debate. But he also threw a positive shoutout to Ozzie....so how can I not

[27Blue]

over-reacting and off topic again mcgoo...
blah blah blah
playoffs this blah blah blah
pietrangelo that blah blah blah
i was a bully growing up blah blah
i'm right you're wrong blah blah blah

[mister_mcgoo]

over-reacting and off topic again mcgoo...
blah blah blah
playoffs this blah blah blah
pietrangelo that blah blah blah
i was a bully growing up blah blah
i'm right you're wrong blah blah blah

you're right dude, how could I be so blind?...I'm gonna immediately trade my Rinne, Lundqvist, Karlsson and Seguin for Halak, Elliot, Pietrangelo and Backes...the Blues are the team of the next decade, they will only continue to improve on this year's improbable numbers!

[3rtpaper]

Since I am a math kind of guy I will chip in

Smith = Decent Goalie
Smith + Poor Defense = AHL Smith
Smith + Good Defense = Star
Elliot = Decent Goalie
Elliot + Poor Defense = AHL Elliot
Elliot + Good Defense = Star
Elliot = Smith

Any goalie in the NHL is obviously at least a decent goalie or they wouldn't have made it to the NHL. But you can't look at 1 year and decide how good that goalie is. Smith and Elliot were terrible last year and that caused a great number of us to miss drafting these players. However, it is equally foolish to take 1 good year and act like they are the next great Lundy.

Elliot will have a good year next year, he is a decent goalie and is on a defensive minded team, that being said though he put up career numbers this year which I don't expect next year (still will have good stats). The fact remains though is that Elliot is still behind Halak, when Elliot had his time to shine this playoffs he fell apart. He went up against one of the best goalies in the league and he was shown to be the much lesser of the goalies.