Karlsson

[Ballsakic]

I have Karlsson in my espn free league. I just missed drafting him in my paid league, He is great to watch.

[TheHockeyPulse]

I have Karlsson and Letang and Fowler in the same keeper. I think I'm set on the blueline for a while.....different story in net though.

[Tree_Frogs]

Hey guy's, first post...

I've had Karlsson in my points only dynasty league since he was a prospect. I don't think there are many people here that like the kid going forward as much as I do. So you'll understand how painful it is to receive an offer of Malkin and a 3rd round pick next year for Karlsson.

How do I say yes to that offer???? HOW DO I SAY NO?

Help!

[agentzero]

Hey guy's, first post...

I've had Karlsson in my points only dynasty league since he was a prospect. I don't think there are many people here that like the kid going forwards as much as I do. So you'll understand how painful it is to receive an offer of Malkin and a 3rd round pick next year for Karlsson.

How do I say yes to that offer???? HOW DO I SAY NO?

Help!

Welcome to the boards! And I will welcome you this way: I love Karlsson. We all do. But take this deal, change your passport, dye your hair, move to an undisclosed island in the Caribbean and don't contact family or friends for at least 4 years.

I can't comprehend a league format where owning a F like Malkin could be worse than owning a D like Karlsson....unless F pts were worth one, and D pts were worth 400,000.

Unreal. I want these kinds of offers....lol

[fungchen3]

Welcome to the boards! And I will welcome you this way: I love Karlsson. We all do. But take this deal, change your passport, dye your hair, move to an undisclosed island in the Caribbean and don't contact family or friends for at least 4 years.

I can't comprehend a league format where owning a F like Malkin could be worse than owning a D like Karlsson....unless F pts were worth one, and D pts were worth 400,000.

Unreal. I want these kinds of offers....lol

This is crazy. All hyperbole aside, it depends on the league format. In my main league (team in my sig) I would NEVER trade Karlsson for Malkin. I think the chances of Karlsson hitting 60 on a regular basis are far better than Malkin hitting 120 year after year. Add to that the premium placed on an elite, young defensemen, and Karlsson for Malkin is a deal that I would never do.

[MT319]

I think the chances of Karlsson hitting 60 on a regular basis are far better than Malkin hitting 120 year after year.

Yup, likewise...but in all fairness the vast majority of settings Malkin would be more valuable, not in yours however given where I value them comparatively. Karlsson is the real deal...I advocated multiple times that i'd keep Karlsson over Green last December and there was exactly 1 other person on this entire site who concurred and believed the same, Fungchen3. In that setting you play you deserve to own Karlsson so good for you man.

[Tree_Frogs]

The Malkin offer appears to be dead! The owner wanted some time to think about the offer he made. It's been all quiet since. Oh well.... At least I still own Karlsson.

Another team offered me OEL and two first round picks (very low picks both being in the 11, 12 overall range) I turned him down! Going to need more than that.

[agentzero]

This is crazy. All hyperbole aside, it depends on the league format. In my main league (team in my sig) I would NEVER trade Karlsson for Malkin. I think the chances of Karlsson hitting 60 on a regular basis are far better than Malkin hitting 120 year after year. Add to that the premium placed on an elite, young defensemen, and Karlsson for Malkin is a deal that I would never do.

Ok. Seriously there's no way.

I LOVE Karlsson. Huge fan. However, Malkin is a generational talent. He has the ability to lead the league in scoring. Few have his ability. I may be thinking pts only here, but there's no way I can pass up that kind of offensively talented forward for a talented D. Sure, Karlsson may exceed 50 every year, he may not. He hasn't yet. Malkin has exceeded 100 pts, and some. He's done it. He plays with the best player in the World, mostly on the PP. There's no chance I would hesitate trading Karlsson for Malkin. I think there are a bunch of offensive D that could compensate the loss of a Karlsson. Not many F can compensate the loss of a Malkin.

I haven't come across a format where I'd prefer Karlsson to Malkin.

[ross10019]

Ok. Seriously there's no way.

I LOVE Karlsson. Huge fan. However, Malkin is a generational talent. He has the ability to lead the league in scoring. Few have his ability. I may be thinking pts only here, but there's no way I can pass up that kind of offensively talented forward for a talented D. Sure, Karlsson may exceed 50 every year, he may not. He hasn't yet. Malkin has exceeded 100 pts, and some. He's done it. He plays with the best player in the World, mostly on the PP. There's no chance I would hesitate trading Karlsson for Malkin. I think there are a bunch of offensive D that could compensate the loss of a Karlsson. Not many F can compensate the loss of a Malkin.

I haven't come across a format where I'd prefer Karlsson to Malkin.

I generally agree with you agentzero. The one element to think about though is Malkin's increasingly worrisome injury concerns, a torn ACL and MCL last year, nothing to sneeze at. Then there's the risk of bolting to the KHL (always there with Russian players, even the very best) - I'm not suggesting Geno is the type of player who woudl bolt once his contract is up in just under 3 years, but you never know.

I still wouldn't trade Malkin straight up for Karlsson, but I think given these factors and Karlsson's development (we're not talking 50+ points consistently, but possibly 60-65 consistently given what he's shown so far, and that's on a relatively bad team), it's not out of the realm of the possible that more and more people would this as a viable trade as time goes on.

[agentzero]

I see the point and Karlsson has shown amazing flashes of brilliance having us thinking that he could be a consistent 60+ D, but there is no guarantee...I know Malkin has a red flag with the knee injury, but it's still Malkin. Don't think I could pass him up, even for Karlsson.....I don't think Malkin would ever leave the NHL anyway....

Moot point I guess since the offer is dead lol, but I would have taken it.

[Atomic Wedgy]

May 1st, 2010. I traded Ryane Clowe and Tomas Kaberle for...... Claude Giroux and Erik Karlsson. Good times.

[fungchen3]

Ok. Seriously there's no way.

I LOVE Karlsson. Huge fan. However, Malkin is a generational talent. He has the ability to lead the league in scoring. Few have his ability. I may be thinking pts only here, but there's no way I can pass up that kind of offensively talented forward for a talented D. Sure, Karlsson may exceed 50 every year, he may not. He hasn't yet. Malkin has exceeded 100 pts, and some. He's done it. He plays with the best player in the World, mostly on the PP. There's no chance I would hesitate trading Karlsson for Malkin. I think there are a bunch of offensive D that could compensate the loss of a Karlsson. Not many F can compensate the loss of a Malkin.

I haven't come across a format where I'd prefer Karlsson to Malkin.

In my format D assists are worth 2 pts (Forwards are only 1) and D goals are worth 3 (Forwards are worth 2). So let's say for arguments sake:

Karlsson: 12G/45A/57Pts = 126 points

Malkin: 36G/59A/95Pts = 131 Points

Now you factor in how hard it is to land a young, stud D (there's far more forwards to choose from) and defensemen are worth gold in my league. On top of that, you factor that Malkin has been injured and over the span of the last couple of seasons (and this one) has been around a PPG player...yes, I take Karlsson every day "in MY particular format".

Yes, Malkin had TWO great years but so did Lecavalier. Malkin does have elite, world class talent, no doubt, but his injuries, linemates, and salary cap situation in PIT tell me that Malkin's unbelievable talent will not be totally reflected in the fantasy world.

I NEVER believed that Malkin has that 135-150 point upside like some do (at least REALISTIC upside). My gut tells me that he is a realistic 85-115 point player - 85 if he only plays like 70 games, and 115 if he plays a full 82 and all the stars align perfectly for him. However in most "Malkin years", he'll be 90-105 points, which is still pretty awesome.

But, like I said, EVERYTHING comes down to specific league formats. There's NEVER any absolutes...all leagues are different. Malkin as a name is better than Karlsson, but if a certain league values D-men heavily, this is not the no-brainer most think it is.

[mister_mcgoo]

In my format D assists are worth 2 pts (Forwards are only 1) and D goals are worth 3 (Forwards are worth 2). So let's say for arguments sake:

Karlsson: 12G/45A/57Pts = 126 points

Malkin: 36G/59A/95Pts = 131 Points

Now you factor in how hard it is to land a young, stud D (there's far more forwards to choose from) and defensemen are worth gold in my league. On top of that, you factor that Malkin has been injured and over the span of the last couple of seasons (and this one) has been around a PPG player...yes, I take Karlsson every day "in MY particular format".

Yes, Malkin had TWO great years but so did Lecavalier. Malkin does have elite, world class talent, no doubt, but his injuries, linemates, and salary cap situation in PIT tell me that Malkin's unbelievable talent will not be totally reflected in the fantasy world.

I NEVER believed that Malkin has that 135-150 point upside like some do (at least REALISTIC upside). My gut tells me that he is a realistic 85-115 point player - 85 if he only plays like 70 games, and 115 if he plays a full 82 and all the stars align perfectly for him. However in most "Malkin years", he'll be 90-105 points, which is still pretty awesome.

But, like I said, EVERYTHING comes down to specific league formats. There's NEVER any absolutes...all leagues are different. Malkin as a name is better than Karlsson, but if a certain league values D-men heavily, this is not the no-brainer most think it is.

yup format is everything, that's why I hate it when people make absolute statements about player value...leagues that give d-men more weight, either by pts or by including cats like blocks that d-men record more of you have to really crunch the numbers to get a proper perspective

[fungchen3]

yup format is everything, that's why I hate it when people make absolute statements about player value...leagues that give d-men more weight, either by pts or by including cats like blocks that d-men record more of you have to really crunch the numbers to get a proper perspective

That's the bottom line. I know of a league where goalie points are worth so much, you couldn't land someone like Bryzgalov or Lehtonen if you dangled Crosby, Ovechkin, Stamkos or a Sedin. In this particular league, the scoring is:

Forwards: G=2, A=1, PP/SH=3

Goalies: W=5, Saves=.5/per, SO=15 bonus points!!

So say Carey Price has a 33 save Win, he gets 21.5 points for the night. Malkin would have to score 8 goals, 3 on the PP and 3 assists to trump that. If Price got a SO on top of that, you're looking at 36.5 points for one nights work

Format is everything. Until you digest a particular format, speaking in absolutes is short-sighted.

[mister_mcgoo]

That's the bottom line. I know of a league where goalie points are worth so much, you couldn't land someone like Bryzgalov or Lehtonen if you dangled Crosby, Ovechkin, Stamkos or a Sedin. In this particular league, the scoring is:

Forwards: G=2, A=1, PP/SH=3

Goalies: W=5, Saves=.5/per, SO=15 bonus points!!

So say Carey Price has a 33 save Win, he gets 21.5 points for the night. Malkin would have to score 8 goals, 3 on the PP and 3 assists to trump that. If Price got a SO on top of that, you're looking at 36.5 points for one nights work

Format is everything. Until you digest a particular format, speaking in absolutes is short-sighted.

wow that's crazy...do you actually play in the league or is it just one you know of? Was the whole 1st round of the draft 90% goalies? lol

check out the league in my sig, its one that I run where I tried my best to equalize the relative value between goalies, d-men, scoring forwards and grit players on both D and F. Its certainly not perfect and if I were to do it again I'd tweak a few things but it really did succeed in leveling the field quite a bit. What I find most fun about Fantasy hockey is trying to mimic building a real world team as closely as possible...so just scoring won't do it, you need solid D and sandpaper and goalies who can face lots of rubber and still do well.