Ottawa Senators

[bumchilly25]

And....I know it was just the Canes last night, but tell me that wasn't one of Patty's best games, especially on the PP. I really like him and 65 back there rather than the 4 fwd, 1 D set up:

Patrick Wiercioch netted a power-play goal for Ottawa in a 2-1 overtime win over Carolina on Tuesday night.
He accounted for four shots on goal, while playing 21:44 of ice time. In 44 games this season, Wiercioch has 11 points and a plus-9 rating.

Source: Ottawa Citizen Mar 18 - 11:23 AM

[notch4077]

That was Wiercioch's best game that I've watched either live or on TV.

[evans334]

This will be an interesting sight to see.

First 10,000 fans attending tomorrow’s game will receive a Hamburglar mask

[Big Ev]

What a game. Two points back of Boston with a game in hand.

Turris, Stone, and Michalek are studs together. If Mark Stone doesn't get a Calder nomination it won't be a surprise but it will be a shame.

Turris has elevated his game when it matters most and he's proven to be such a clutch player. He's easily our #1 centre still and will be for long time. I thought Zibanejad might be passing him but now, not yet anyway. Turris-Zibanejad-Pageau is unreal down the middle

[Fighting_Emu]

Is Hoffmans run over? Been quiet lately- like 12 mins tonight...

[The Comish]

If Mark Stone doesn't get a Calder nomination it won't be a surprise but it will be a shame.

Turris has elevated his game when it matters most and he's proven to be such a clutch player. He's easily our #1 centre still and will be for long time. I thought Zibanejad might be passing him but now, not yet anyway. Turris-Zibanejad-Pageau is unreal down the middle

Stone will definitely get some Calder action, but there is no nomination process. The Professional Hockey Writers Association dudes vote their top five (10-7-5-3-1) and the top three point getters are named "finalists". Will Stone be a finalist? He should be in everyone's top five along with Gaudreau, Forsberg, Klingberg and Ekblad. Hoffman is a darkhorse and doesn't seem to get much Calder talk, same for Anders Lee. I'm with you on Stone though, I'm now a fan of his game.

I think you are a little off with your Turris-Zibanejad-Pageau being "unreal" down the middle. I think that screams worse than average. Isn't Lazar in the plans at C (at least next year?) or has he looked overwhelmed in his rookie year?

I am cheering for Ottawa, but have several Bruins in my fantasy leagues and it would be better for my leagues that count playoffs. It's a good time to be a Sens fan - at least the team is providing some excitement down the stretch.

[Big Ev]

Stone will definitely get some Calder action, but there is no nomination process. The Professional Hockey Writers Association dudes vote their top five (10-7-5-3-1) and the top three point getters are named "finalists". Will Stone be a finalist? He should be in everyone's top five along with Gaudreau, Forsberg, Klingberg and Ekblad. Hoffman is a darkhorse and doesn't seem to get much Calder talk, same for Anders Lee. I'm with you on Stone though, I'm now a fan of his game.

I think you are a little off with your Turris-Zibanejad-Pageau being "unreal" down the middle. I think that screams worse than average. Isn't Lazar in the plans at C (at least next year?) or has he looked overwhelmed in his rookie year?

I am cheering for Ottawa, but have several Bruins in my fantasy leagues and it would be better for my leagues that count playoffs. It's a good time to be a Sens fan - at least the team is providing some excitement down the stretch.

no way is that worse than average when zibanejad is in his prime. its very similar to bostons when Krejci is in the lineup. If you've been paying attention to the team over the last month and a bit you would see that this is a glimpse of what is to come. Turris being the reliable 60 point two way stud centre and zibanejad being a second line power C like Ryan Kesler. Pageau the spark plug, tenacious third line centre who provides energy every shift, and then like you said, you have Lazar waiting in the wings too. Lazar can be a centre but right now there's no room for him there. Maybe when Legwand is done after next season. That's how good the depth is riht now. I don't know what you think average is, but that centre depth will be just as good and better than a lot of teams going forward.

Turris and zibanejad can both be #1 centres in the league one day.

[The Comish]

no way is that worse than average when zibanejad is in his prime. its very similar to bostons when Krejci is in the lineup. If you've been paying attention to the team over the last month and a bit you would see that this is a glimpse of what is to come. Turris being the reliable 60 point two way stud centre and zibanejad being a second line power C like Ryan Kesler. Pageau the spark plug, tenacious third line centre who provides energy every shift, and then like you said, you have Lazar waiting in the wings too. Lazar can be a centre but right now there's no room for him there. Maybe when Legwand is done after next season. That's how good the depth is riht now. I don't know what you think average is, but that centre depth will be just as good and better than a lot of teams going forward.

Turris and zibanejad can both be #1 centres in the league one day.

Unfortunately, that day is not today. Potential does not equal reality unless they reach their potential.

Up until very recently, Pageau was an AHL player. Zibanejad is clearly still learning the ropes and Turris is a responsible 60 point player. Average at best. I see Turris, Zibanejad and Lazar as the near future down the middle in Ottawa.

[Maaaasquito]

Unfortunately, that day is not today. Potential does not equal reality unless they reach their potential.

Up until very recently, Pageau was an AHL player. Zibanejad is clearly still learning the ropes and Turris is a responsible 60 point player. Average at best. I see Turris, Zibanejad and Lazar as the near future down the middle in Ottawa.

To be fair a 60-point center, in this day and age, is pretty much a number 1 C if you believe this is the scoring trend moving forward. Right now there's probably only 20 or so C that will hit 60 points by season's end.

What used to be 100 point Cs are now point-per-gamers, point-per-gamers are now 70-pointers, and 70 pointers are now 60-pointers... teams are choosing to spread the ice-time/responsibility around a lot more now than ever before...

If you look at comparisons
Kings: Kopitar(64)/Carter(62)/Stoll(18)
Hawks: Toews (69)/Richards (43)/Shaw(22)
Blues: Backes(61)/Stastny(53)/Lehtera(50)
Rangers: Stepan(64)/Brassard(63)/Moore(25)
Lightning: Stamkos(75)/Johnson(75)/Filppula(52)

So I think when you're looking at a C breakdown of 60-60-30 you're probably built in the same mode as some of these "championship" caliber type teams...

[The Comish]

Oh yeah, I wasn't thinking that to be a #1 C you needed to be a 100 pt guy. Turris is clearly #1, but in overall terms if you consider every #1 C on all 30 NHL teams, where would you rank Turris?

Bergeron, Getzlaf, E.Staal, Toews, Johansen, Datsyuk, Kopitar, Tavares, Giroux, Crosby, Couture, Stamkos, H.Sedin and Backstrom all probably rank ahead of Turris. That's 14 of 30 teams.

I would group O'Reilly, RNH, M.Koivu, Plekanec, Stastny, Little and Stepan as in the same range as Turris with guys like Monahan, Fisher and Zajac not very far behind.

Those championship calibre-type teams also have great top 9 depth and depth on D as well. It's definitely not about just the numbers (60-60-30), but I know I'm preaching to the choir here. I just look at the Sens C depth and think it's average at best. It could grow to be better than average, but it will take some growth by Zibanejad and Pageau/Lazar.

[Maaaasquito]

Oh yeah, I wasn't thinking that to be a #1 C you needed to be a 100 pt guy. Turris is clearly #1, but in overall terms if you consider every #1 C on all 30 NHL teams, where would you rank Turris?

Bergeron, Getzlaf, E.Staal, Toews, Johansen, Datsyuk, Kopitar, Tavares, Giroux, Crosby, Couture, Stamkos, H.Sedin and Backstrom all probably rank ahead of Turris. That's 14 of 30 teams.

I would group O'Reilly, RNH, M.Koivu, Plekanec, Stastny, Little and Stepan as in the same range as Turris with guys like Monahan, Fisher and Zajac not very far behind.

Those championship calibre-type teams also have great top 9 depth and depth on D as well. It's definitely not about just the numbers (60-60-30), but I know I'm preaching to the choir here. I just look at the Sens C depth and think it's average at best. It could grow to be better than average, but it will take some growth by Zibanejad and Pageau/Lazar.

Yeah I think it depends on what your definition of #1 C means... #1 in the NHL means top 30, 30 teams each having a #1, hence 30 #1 C in the NHL... #1 in fantasy is a whole different argument, 12 teams #1 = top 12 Cs...

Now within that "30" of course you're going to have a massive range, it goes from generational guys like Crosby all the way down to Girgensons(40 some odd points)... and it also depends on what/how are the characteristics you're going to use to judge these players on. If you use "just points" well Turris probably is very much in the same boat as Little/RNH/Plekanec/Brassard/Backes/Bergeron... and probably could be construed as an "average" #1 C.

Also I guess it depends on what context you're trying to use it in... you calling the Ottawa Cs "average" sounded "negative" or you are "knocking" them. Of course that could just be my interpretation of it... But if we were to use the same definition, Nashville's forward corps probably would be considered "average" by your definition, yet they're 3 points out from winning a President's trophy, so does having a "average" C group really mean much? While teams with generational guys like Crosby, Backstrom are fighting for wild card spots...

Also Turris is 25, Zibanejad is 21, Pageau is 22, Lazar is 20 that's a very young set of Cs that it's probably hard to peg that they're going to be average for the next x number of years... If you're doing it with say 30, 30, 28 and 27 year olds you probably could have a easier way to peg them, but 21, 22 and 20 to pigeon hole them is pretty tough...

[Big Ev]

Look at the top two teams in the East right now, New York and montreal. Theres no doubt in my mind ottawa's centre group is just as good as theirs today and will most likely be better in the future. The point is you don't need to have a crosby or getzlaf stud centre to be a contender. You said they have top 9 depth and that's exactly what ottawa has and will have. They are rolling three lines and controlling games.

Turris should be grouped in with bergeron as that's very much his style and he's even out producing him this season. RNH isn't at his level yet and Eric Staal is definitely not as good as Turris anymore. Just naming some guys off comishs list.

but that's not my point, I didnt say Turris ranked at the top of number one centres, but he is a number one centre. And it's not just about points. It's exactly why I said this team was better off getting rid of spezza and they have most certainly proven that. My original point was ranking the depth of the centres on every line, we can see that it is easily better than pretty much all of he non playoff teams and arguably better than some current playoff teams such as Montreal, New York, Boston, Winnipeg, etc. The growth in Zibanejads game has been great and we are seeing he type of power centre he will be one day. His offensive game reminds me of Voracek and he is progressing that way.

anyways I find it funny I got laughed at for saying ottawas forward depth was superior to montreals a couple of months ago. Looking at both forward groups today, it's not even a contest. Especially given the ages of the two groups. I am just salivating at the thought of potentially playing them in round one.

[The Comish]

Yeah I think it depends on what your definition of #1 C means... #1 in the NHL means top 30, 30 teams each having a #1, hence 30 #1 C in the NHL... #1 in fantasy is a whole different argument, 12 teams #1 = top 12 Cs...

Now within that "30" of course you're going to have a massive range, it goes from generational guys like Crosby all the way down to Girgensons(40 some odd points)... and it also depends on what/how are the characteristics you're going to use to judge these players on. If you use "just points" well Turris probably is very much in the same boat as Little/RNH/Plekanec/Brassard/Backes/Bergeron... and probably could be construed as an "average" #1 C.

Also I guess it depends on what context you're trying to use it in... you calling the Ottawa Cs "average" sounded "negative" or you are "knocking" them. Of course that could just be my interpretation of it... But if we were to use the same definition, Nashville's forward corps probably would be considered "average" by your definition, yet they're 3 points out from winning a President's trophy, so does having a "average" C group really mean much? While teams with generational guys like Crosby, Backstrom are fighting for wild card spots...

Also Turris is 25, Zibanejad is 21, Pageau is 22, Lazar is 20 that's a very young set of Cs that it's probably hard to peg that they're going to be average for the next x number of years... If you're doing it with say 30, 30, 28 and 27 year olds you probably could have a easier way to peg them, but 21, 22 and 20 to pigeon hole them is pretty tough...

I know I sound like I'm slamming Ottawa's C depth, but I don't think anyone is quaking in their skates thinking about facing them. At the moment, they are average at best. Sure, they could go on to be Boston 2.0, but until they mature and actually get there, they will continue to make the mistakes young players typically make (outside of Turris, who is pretty solid all around). Teams with more experienced (better? depends on how you define better) C will exploit the young guys.

Teams aren't make or break for the playoffs based on their C depth, it's more of a team thing - how well they play together, coupled with stellar goaltending and you've got something. Yes, the Sens are on a pretty epic run currently and it's been fun to watch, but does anyone outside of Ottawa think this run is something other than a run/hot streak? For the record, I really like what Ottawa is building here, but even if they sneak into the playoffs, they aren't going to win more than one round, if that.

Ev - Be careful what you wish for - Seeing Carey Price and that ever annoying P.K. Subban for 4+ games may not exactly be an easy path to round 2, although it might be a pretty fun match-up to watch!

[The Black Panther]

Look at the top two teams in the East right now, New York and montreal. Theres no doubt in my mind ottawa's centre group is just as good as theirs today and will most likely be better in the future. The point is you don't need to have a crosby or getzlaf stud centre to be a contender. You said they have top 9 depth and that's exactly what ottawa has and will have. They are rolling three lines and controlling games.

Turris should be grouped in with bergeron as that's very much his style and he's even out producing him this season. RNH isn't at his level yet and Eric Staal is definitely not as good as Turris anymore. Just naming some guys off comishs list.

but that's not my point, I didnt say Turris ranked at the top of number one centres, but he is a number one centre. And it's not just about points. It's exactly why I said this team was better off getting rid of spezza and they have most certainly proven that. My original point was ranking the depth of the centres on every line, we can see that it is easily better than pretty much all of he non playoff teams and arguably better than some current playoff teams such as Montreal, New York, Boston, Winnipeg, etc. The growth in Zibanejads game has been great and we are seeing he type of power centre he will be one day. His offensive game reminds me of Voracek and he is progressing that way.

Nice post. I agree. Turris just needs to continue to improve his FOs

[Maaaasquito]

I know I sound like I'm slamming Ottawa's C depth, but I don't think anyone is quaking in their skates thinking about facing them. At the moment, they are average at best. Sure, they could go on to be Boston 2.0, but until they mature and actually get there, they will continue to make the mistakes young players typically make (outside of Turris, who is pretty solid all around). Teams with more experienced (better? depends on how you define better) C will exploit the young guys.

Teams aren't make or break for the playoffs based on their C depth, it's more of a team thing - how well they play together, coupled with stellar goaltending and you've got something. Yes, the Sens are on a pretty epic run currently and it's been fun to watch, but does anyone outside of Ottawa think this run is something other than a run/hot streak? For the record, I really like what Ottawa is building here, but even if they sneak into the playoffs, they aren't going to win more than one round, if that.

Ev - Be careful what you wish for - Seeing Carey Price and that ever annoying P.K. Subban for 4+ games may not exactly be an easy path to round 2, although it might be a pretty fun match-up to watch!

I don't know if many teams are quaking in their skates about facing any team anymore... there's so much parity in the league that any given team can beat any other team on any night... Are there some that are a step above others, probably defending champs usually get given the moniker of being the "team to beat", but other than that there maybe he only a handful of team who are "benchmarkers". As I alluded to before "average" might be enough to win a cup these days...

Once playoffs start anything goes really... LA snuck in as 8th seeds for a couple of years and they end up winning it... Now I'm not saying Ottawa is in the same boat as LA, but who knows a couple of confident building games, and the Hamburgular continuing to be Superman and they end up as Edmonton making a unlikely cup run...