Is Kuznetsov amongst the absolute elite officially?

[HonkyTonkMan]

Is he a threat and should he be a top 10 (maybe even top 5 scorer) going forward?

He had a great 2015-16; sub par 2016-17 and obviously back this year and playoffs.

Should he be a top pick with McDavid, Kucherov, Scheifele, Sid etc in pools now? Seems like he has added an uptick in goal scoring too now...

Seems like Gaudreau and Kuzy are right there...

Cheers

[Zorro]

I'd say!! Ovechkin, Eichel, Seguin, Benn, etc. should be included.. Wheeler Giroux putting up points too..

[lucafen4]

There are clear tiers. One 80+pt season does not put you in that elite tier, not when there are several players hitting or flirting with 100pts - Kuch, Mack, Crosby, McDavid in a tier.. Scheifele, Eichel, Matthews, Kuzy among others in a second tier.

[rtstr]

Be careful-- you'll learn "elite" means lots of different things to lots of people.

To me, everyone in the NHL is an elite hockey player. But also to me, elite is best of the best. So to be the elite of the elite, you have to be among the best 15-20 players in the world IMO. I haven't done math but that's what, maybe 5% of the total NHL? Seems like a good threshold. Kuznetsov will always be in the conversation, and he'll have seasons where he's in that group and he'll have seasons where he's not.

Gun to my head, no Kuznetsov is not one of the Elite players in the NHL but he's certainly a must-own stud in every format. There will be times when he outperforms a handful of guys in my 20 player elite group and there will be times when he's outperformed by the next Josh Baileys of the league. But I don't think he's an automatic mainstay quite yet.

[Savvy1982]

Be careful-- you'll learn "elite" means lots of different things to lots of people.

To me, everyone in the NHL is an elite hockey player. But also to me, elite is best of the best. So to be the elite of the elite, you have to be among the best 15-20 players in the world IMO. I haven't done math but that's what, maybe 5% of the total NHL? Seems like a good threshold. Kuznetsov will always be in the conversation, and he'll have seasons where he's in that group and he'll have seasons where he's not.

Gun to my head, no Kuznetsov is not one of the Elite players in the NHL but he's certainly a must-own stud in every format. There will be times when he outperforms a handful of guys in my 20 player elite group and there will be times when he's outperformed by the next Josh Baileys of the league. But I don't think he's an automatic mainstay quite yet.

NHL Active Roster is 23 players. At 31 teams, that means there are 713 NHL players on Active Rosters at any given time, not counting IR.

5% of 713 players is 35.65.

So the Top 5% of NHL players is the best 35 players regardless of position.

I'd have Kuznetsov in my Top 35 NHLers, but probably in the lower half of the list.

[PenguinHunter]

I think he is a lot closer to the elite tier now that Washington uses both him and Backstrom on the top PP. Last year when he was not on the top PP unit, it really hurt his value. And I think as long as he stays on top PP unit even if he is not always slotted in with Ovy on the top line.

[blayze]

To me the "elite" is: McDavid, Crosby, Kuch, Malkin, Mack (borderline)... basically anyone with the potential to hit the century mark

I would put Kuz solidly in the second tier along with Scheifele, Giroux, Marchand, Stammer, etc.

[pmorrow]

I don't see him as being in the Tier 1...(blayze's list is pretty accurate) but he is in that 2nd tier. for me he still has to go out and do what he did last year. it has taken him quite a while to get to this level, so it's not a foregone conclusion that this is what he's going to keep doing. i would bet he keeps the momentum going forward, but i need to see it happen to truly declare hes in that top group.

[ericdaoust]

He's probably in "overrated" territory after what he has done this postseason. To some he'll be ranked closer to Crosby/McDavid than he should be.

[MZac]

He's probably in my top 20 but not in my top 10.

[HonkyTonkMan]

He also did have that monster season 2 years ago playing 2nd fiddle to Backstrom, so it's not like he came outta nowhere.

Not in McDavid's league, but who is? Ovie needs to stay at this level (which he may slow down) or that will hurt Kuzy IMO.

[fungchen3]

No. Kuznetsov is riding a high wave and is not in the elite. Players like him and Backstrom fluctuate too much, based on the season. I also think Kuznetsov hurts himself by not shooting nearly enough. While I think Kuznetsov will be a very good, steady player, his spread is anywhere between 70-85, which clearly places him outside of the elite. He's in the stud category though, with the likes of Tarasenko, Panarin, Forsberg, Monahan, Voracek, etc.

[Ingolo]

I'm on board with the rest here, Kuz is definitely in the second tier of players for me. Right there with guys like Seguin and Tavares. Definitely fantasy gold, but not quite at the McDavid/Crosby tier.

[forumname]

Players like him and Backstrom fluctuate too much, based on the season.

Pardon me sir? you better take another look at Backstroms numbers over the last 8 or so years. 0.85-1.05 points/game. Seems pretty steady to me.

[fungchen3]

Pardon me sir? you better take another look at Backstroms numbers over the last 8 or so years. 0.85-1.05 points/game. Seems pretty steady to me.

There is sizable fluctuation in Backstrom's points over the last 4 seasons...

Backstrom, Nicklas
2017-18 (71 points; -15 from prev.)
2016-17 (86 points; +16 from prev.)
2015-16 (70 points; -8 from prev.)
2014-15 (78 points)

... especially the last 3 seasons, you're looking at 15 to 16 point swings each way. I didn't say Backstrom wasn't a good producer... I said players like him and Kuznetsov fluctuate too much to bank on them being "elite" producers. Kuzzie same thing...

Kuznetsov, Evgeny
2017-18 (83 points; +24 from prev.)
2016-17 (59 points; -18 from prev.)
2015-16 (77 points; +40 from prev.)
2014-15 (37 points)

Perhaps it's a combination of "who gets to setup Ovie" or just dumb luck, but both of these guys see healthy swings in their production. I've owned Backstrom in my main league for 9 years now (still have him) and had Kuzzie for 3 (recently traded him). They are both very good owns overall, but they have swings. Not sure how this is even debatable.

And that's not even taking into consideration Backstrom's 100+ season early on that had poolies thinking he was going to be a long-term Platinum member in fantasy, connected-at-the-hip to Ovie.

Next year, I wouldn't be surprised if Backstrom bagged 81 and Kuznetsov puts up 70. That's another 10 and 13 point swing respectively.