Reply With QuoteYa probably right but when you hear things like russian plays have no heart and.crap like that it is funny. That borders on bigotry!Originally Posted by metaldude26
You guys are both wrong. In the last ten seasons, including ties
8/13 Richard winners from North America.
4/10 Art Ross winners from North America.
So it's pretty much a mixed bag.
I don't know that Europeans are consistently overrated or underrated. I just think that for the most part we suck at evaluating talent on a global scale so there are always going to be overrated and underrated players regardless of nationality. I do think that there is a general shying away from Russians because of the KHL threat but that mirrors what's going on in the NHL.
Ya probably right but when you hear things like russian plays have no heart and.crap like that it is funny. That borders on bigotry!
"My Name Is My Name" ~Marlo
"I'm just a Gangster I suppose and I want my fu***** corners"~ Barksdale
grammar Nazi
Noun
(slang, idiomatic) 1. A person who habitually corrects or criticizes the language usage of others, especially in situations where it is unnecessary, e.g. an informal conversation.
Notes: This behavior is almost always found in people with very low I.Q's, whom have a very low sense of self worth. Impotence is also commonly linked to Grammar Nazi's.
With me, there is definitely an unfair stigma in rating NA with Europeans.
In my opinion, I have MacKinnon and Barkov rated fairly even (right now). Barkov slightly ahead. However, he's Finnish (European). It takes a lot for a kid to come over and adapt to the culture and lifestyle let alone get accustomed to the ice size and 'physicalness' of the game. Hell, many Europeans can't even get over the cultural differences to even make an impact on the ice. I'll take my chances with the NA kid all day long.
Whenever I have a NA player and a European player rated the same I will always draft the NA player. And over the years it has worked out in my favour. Is it biased? Hell yeah. Im not going to lie, but it's worked out. ''
It's missing a few guys, but the first thing that 'red flagged' me was Mantha llisted as an OHL player.
You read my post wrong, those are Richard winners not Art Ross.
Metaldude - my 7 out of 10 wasn't wrong, you just extended the years you observed farther than I did...apples to oranges.
As for the players I listed, I took it as a general assumption that they would be widely regarded as many of the best young players in the NHL. Substitute the phrase 'Consensus Choices' for 'Facts' and would you disagree with the list? How bout this, I'll make a list of the top overseas players drafted over the same period and we'll compare:
2006-present (Top overseas NHL talent)
Landeskog, Backstrom, Voracek, Karlsson, Tlusty, Grabner, Varlamov, Berglund, Kulemin, Anisimov, Boedker, Eller, Voynov, Hedman, OEL, Kulikov, Burmistrov, Josi, Tarasenko, Brodin, Zibanejad?, Granlund?, Niederrieiter?, Kuznetsov?
2006-present (Top NA NHL talent)
Tavares, Stamkos, Giroux, Hall, Eberle, Seguin, Skinner, Couture, Stepan, RNH, Huberdeau, Doughty, Pietrangelo, Kessel, Giroux, Lucic, E Kane, P Kane, Benn, Toews, Duchene, PK Subban, Shattenkirk, Max Pac, McDonagh, Sam Gagner, Bogo, Ennis, Del Zotto, Carlson, Kadri, O'Reilly, Fowler, Faulk
To be honest, I actually had to dig deeper just to try to fill out the overseas list and left plenty of NA talent off the list purely because it wasn't needed to illustrate the point.
Obviously overseas players have had a great run over the past 10-15 years but looking at these two lists where are you willing to put your money over the next decade? Why has this happened? I have many theories as to why this is happening but that's another conversation for another time.
100% agreement. This has been my strategy for about the past 4-5 years.
Any team picking Barkov in the Top 5 is nuts. I would never take a guy who skates as poorly as he does that high.
Also I wouldn't compare "North America" to "Europe" I would go country-by-country. If I was running an NHL team I probably would only pick Canadians, Americans, and Swedes. I would never take a Fin as that country hasn't produced anything in a long while, and their league isn't that great to evaluate prospects in. Russia, obviously not taking any of them. It would vary player by player like Tomas Hertl, but I'd stick to those three countries if I want to have success.
So you would not have taken Tavares?
Definitely take Tavares #1. Barkov is a lot slower as a prospect, and not nearly as good of a prospect either.
But I also wouldn't take Barkov because he's a Fin...just a ton of Fins disappointing recently.
I would bank that all of Monahan, Mackinnon, Drouin, and Lindholm have better careers than Barkov.
See this is insanity to me. It is the same crap that I argued in the Darvish thread a year and a half ago. How has that turned out so far for those suggesting Japanese players don't translate. You judge talent individually and not were there from. That is why you pay your scouts.
"My Name Is My Name" ~Marlo
"I'm just a Gangster I suppose and I want my fu***** corners"~ Barksdale
grammar Nazi
Noun
(slang, idiomatic) 1. A person who habitually corrects or criticizes the language usage of others, especially in situations where it is unnecessary, e.g. an informal conversation.
Notes: This behavior is almost always found in people with very low I.Q's, whom have a very low sense of self worth. Impotence is also commonly linked to Grammar Nazi's.
What part of Barkovs skating would you consider poor? While he does not skate like Mackinnon his skating is far from poor, he has excellent stability, good top end speed, a powerful stride. His first few steps maybe lack and his skating style looks a little awkward but I think you are selling him way short if you are grading his skating as poor. Just my .02 although I have watched a considerable amount of Tappara games this year.
12 team points only keeper (G = 1, A = 1, W = 2, SO = 2)
Dress 6 forwards, 4 defensemen, 2 goalies, weekly starts
Roster limit - 20 plus 4 prospects
I'll pay my scouts to find North Americans and Swedes because I feel that I have the best chance of winning a Cup with them in the lineup. Fact is that Finns and Russians (actual Russians, not CHLers) aren't translating as well, or at all, to the NHL lately.
I'm biased because my team, arguably the best drafting team in the past 5 years, has picked only one non-North American or Swede during that timeframe.
The Pittsburgh Penguins also have been North American heavy, and it's worked out fine for them.
Most scouts have it listed as average to slightly below. Definitely the weakest part of his game. Same thing that was said about Tavares.
Wow! Can you begin to explain away what he just did this year as a baby in a mens league?
Posting Permissions