Toronto Maple Leafs

[DusterDave]

A little late but did anyone else catch William Nylander's tweet last night? It read "Coming soon... (pen/paper emoji)". It was instantly deleted of course. Dubas was also on Prime Time Sports today saying "Their camp has been focused on a long-term deal and ours as well. I think a bridge deal for both of us would be the sub-optimal solution to this. We continue to work primarily on long term deals." Between Nylander's deleted tweet and Dubas' comments, it makes me believe they are extremely close to reaching an agreement and are likely just ironing out the details. I'd expect an announcement by the weekend to be honest.

Now the more pressing issue, the backup goaltending situation. What is everyone's best guess as to which of the two is placed on waivers and who stays up? Who do you guys prefer? I have a feeling this could be the first rift between Dubas and Babcock. I think Dubas prefers Sparks while Babcock wants the veteran McElhinney, Dubas will eventually win this battle and rightfully so. Bob McKenzie was on the TSN panel last night and said something along the lines of: "Dubas isn't going to waive the 25 year old AHL goaltender of the year and Calder Cup champion who they have developed within the system because of 3-4 bad periods in the preseason." And he is 100/% correct. McElhinney has been fantastic for the Leafs and I appreciate everything he has done but let's face it, he is easily replaceable. Sparks is home grown and still an unknown. We all know goalies are unpredictable and late bloomers, we could have a gem on our hands. He cannot be wasted by being placed on waivers, he will surely get claimed. McElhinney will certainly clear waivers and if Sparks falters as a backup during the regular season, then they can make the switch but it would be a very foolish move to risk losing Sparks after a few bad preseason periods of play. Dubas is also on record multiple times saying they won't be carrying three goalies to start the season. An interesting week ahead for Leafs Nation for sure.

[Mr. Guru]

A little late but did anyone else catch William Nylander's tweet last night? It read "Coming soon... (pen/paper emoji)". It was instantly deleted of course. Dubas was also on Prime Time Sports today saying "Their camp has been focused on a long-term deal and ours as well. I think a bridge deal for both of us would be the sub-optimal solution to this. We continue to work primarily on long term deals." Between Nylander's deleted tweet and Dubas' comments, it makes me believe they are extremely close to reaching an agreement and are likely just ironing out the details. I'd expect an announcement by the weekend to be honest.

Now the more pressing issue, the backup goaltending situation. What is everyone's best guess as to which of the two is placed on waivers and who stays up? Who do you guys prefer? I have a feeling this could be the first rift between Dubas and Babcock. I think Dubas prefers Sparks while Babcock wants the veteran McElhinney, Dubas will eventually win this battle and rightfully so. Bob McKenzie was on the TSN panel last night and said something along the lines of: "Dubas isn't going to waive the 25 year old AHL goaltender of the year and Calder Cup champion who they have developed within the system because of 3-4 bad periods in the preseason." And he is 100/% correct. McElhinney has been fantastic for the Leafs and I appreciate everything he has done but let's face it, he is easily replaceable. Sparks is home grown and still an unknown. We all know goalies are unpredictable and late bloomers, we could have a gem on our hands. He cannot be wasted by being placed on waivers, he will surely get claimed. McElhinney will certainly clear waivers and if Sparks falters as a backup during the regular season, then they can make the switch but it would be a very foolish move to risk losing Sparks after a few bad preseason periods of play. Dubas is also on record multiple times saying they won't be carrying three goalies to start the season. An interesting week ahead for Leafs Nation for sure.

Poor Mac. He doesn't deserve to lost the job.

But whats best for the club long term? Mac is a UFA at seasons end.

[lucafen4]

A little late but did anyone else catch William Nylander's tweet last night? It read "Coming soon... (pen/paper emoji)". It was instantly deleted of course. Dubas was also on Prime Time Sports today saying "Their camp has been focused on a long-term deal and ours as well. I think a bridge deal for both of us would be the sub-optimal solution to this. We continue to work primarily on long term deals." Between Nylander's deleted tweet and Dubas' comments, it makes me believe they are extremely close to reaching an agreement and are likely just ironing out the details. I'd expect an announcement by the weekend to be honest.

Now the more pressing issue, the backup goaltending situation. What is everyone's best guess as to which of the two is placed on waivers and who stays up? Who do you guys prefer? I have a feeling this could be the first rift between Dubas and Babcock. I think Dubas prefers Sparks while Babcock wants the veteran McElhinney, Dubas will eventually win this battle and rightfully so. Bob McKenzie was on the TSN panel last night and said something along the lines of: "Dubas isn't going to waive the 25 year old AHL goaltender of the year and Calder Cup champion who they have developed within the system because of 3-4 bad periods in the preseason." And he is 100/% correct. McElhinney has been fantastic for the Leafs and I appreciate everything he has done but let's face it, he is easily replaceable. Sparks is home grown and still an unknown. We all know goalies are unpredictable and late bloomers, we could have a gem on our hands. He cannot be wasted by being placed on waivers, he will surely get claimed. McElhinney will certainly clear waivers and if Sparks falters as a backup during the regular season, then they can make the switch but it would be a very foolish move to risk losing Sparks after a few bad preseason periods of play. Dubas is also on record multiple times saying they won't be carrying three goalies to start the season. An interesting week ahead for Leafs Nation for sure.

Didn't see it, but love it. ...

I think the job is Sparks. Mac was never a long term option, he's been around - he knows. Picard will also have to clear waivers & won't, someone will claim him - Wouldn't be surprised to see Picard traded here shortly

[Mr. Guru]

Didn't see it, but love it. ...

I think the job is Sparks. Mac was never a long term option, he's been around - he knows. Picard will also have to clear waivers & won't, someone will claim him - Wouldn't be surprised to see Picard traded here shortly

I'll be surprised if Pickard is picked up.

Maybe even Mac. He is a UFA at years end....Is he THAT much of an upgrade where the team is willing to pay their AHL starter $650k plus?

[DusterDave]

I think Sparks is the only one of the three that would get claimed.

[Cdot588]

https://www.bardown.com/leafs-fans-a...weet-1.1180415

Fake newsssss

Sorry to say that the tweet was fake.

[havanablast21]

I remember we when Picard was seriously viewed as the Heir apparent to the Colorado crease. I wonder what happened to motivate the trade to LVG and then waiving by Vegas?

[DusterDave]

https://www.bardown.com/leafs-fans-a...weet-1.1180415

Fake newsssss

Sorry to say that the tweet was fake.

Thanks for sharing. Leafs fans are a crazy kind of fan.

[2014olympicgold]

So, with Horton and the LTIR thing, they wanna be as close to the cap as possible to get the full benefit of placing him on the IR right? The simplistic way of thinking of LTIR use is:

Upper cap limit is 60mill, team has 59mill on their roster. Player A making 2mill gets hit and goes on LTIR. The league gives them 2mill of additional cap money to use on a replacement player, but because they were at 59mill, the teams new upper cap limit is 61mill.

So looking at the Leafs right now, they have 13.3mill in space (66.2mill used on a 79.5mill cap). Looking at the “Non-rostered players” (not counted towards the cap), there’s no player making over 1mill to allow some fun player moving to raise them to the cap.

Right now, placing Horton on the LTIR would get them no where if I’m understanding LTIR because his cap hit (5.3mill) is lower than the cap space the Leafs have. Pretty much, Leafs need to sign Nylander to lets say 7.5mill, but then they can’t bring any of the sub-1mill players up because they would be at the roster limit (they’re at 22 players right now without Nylander, and you’re allowed 23 right?)

So they sign Nylander to a 7.5mill/yr contract, their team cap hit would be at 73.7mill, leaving like 5.8mill in cap space, leaving again, no point in LTIR-ing Horton.

Now, I wonder, if the team could do something like acquiring like Bolland (5.5mill 1 yr) for like a PTBDL, 7^th round pick, something like that, to get to this scenario:

Leafs get Bolland, cap hit goes from 66.2mill to 71.7mill
Leafs sign Nylander to a 7.5mill contract, cap hit goes from 71.7 to 79.2mill (Cap limit is 79.5mill)
Leafs place Horton and Bolland on LTIR. Leafs have 10.8mill on LTIR, moving their “Rostered Salary” to 90mill, but with LTIR cap relief, they now have 10.5mill in cap space. (90mill cap hit – 79.5mill upper limit = 10.5mill in LTIR relief)

Am I understanding that right? Bolland is on his last yr of his contract, he’s a 100% LTIR guy, without getting him, leafs cap space is 5.8mill (66.2mill + 7.5mill = 73.7mill – 79.5mill = 5.8)

[Eskimo Brother]

I think your logic is a little faulty in that the limit doesn't increase, it's just that the player's hit against the cap gets wiped out. So acquiring Bolland is a net zero, as his LTIR cap hit has no effect on the Leafs' cap.

You're also working under the assumption that moving Horton to the LTIR is to create cap space, but you don't have that cap space actually being used. If it gets used, great. If it's not being used, then itin the big picture it doesn't matter if Horton is on LTIR or not, because you're under the cap and icing the same roster anyways.

[2014olympicgold]

I think your logic is a little faulty in that the limit doesn't increase, it's just that the player's hit against the cap gets wiped out. So acquiring Bolland is a net zero, as his LTIR cap hit has no effect on the Leafs' cap.

You're also working under the assumption that moving Horton to the LTIR is to create cap space, but you don't have that cap space actually being used. If it gets used, great. If it's not being used, then itin the big picture it doesn't matter if Horton is on LTIR or not, because you're under the cap and icing the same roster anyways.

To maximize the LTIR cap use you need to be as close to the cap as possible though. So I may have worded it wrong, but acquiring Bolland would increase their money spent to get to the upper limit, essentially what Lupul's contract was doing last yr.

And it's benefit would just be at trade deadline pretty much. Getting Bolland increases the cap space from 5.8mill to 10.5mill.



I think the thinking in LTIR that most people have is you get 100% of that players contract off your cap, but it's not. Here's the CapFriendly FAQ on LTIR https://www.capfriendly.com/ltir-faq

[Eskimo Brother]

Fair enough. It's not something I fully seem to have wrapped my head around either.

[2014olympicgold]

Fair enough. It's not something I fully seem to have wrapped my head around either.

CapFriendly's FAQ does not really make it clear to me.

But the way I always understood was the example I said before:

Salary Cap Upper Limit is lets say 60mill
Team is operating at 59mill (1mill in cap space)
Player A making 5mill/yr (all base salary, it gets ugly when there's bonuses and stuff) gets hurt
Since a player can't be moved off the Roster (sent down) while on LTIR, his "cap hit" needs to still be counted

(Cap used - Upper Cap) + Players salary = What a team can use as their Cap space including LTIR player salary
(59mill-60mill) + 5mill = 4mill in cap space now, 3mill more than what they had before, even though the player that went on LTIR made 5mill.


So if you get closer to the Upper Limit, the more space you create:
(59.9mill-60mill)+5mill = 4.9mill in space now.

However, if you have more space initially than what an LTIR player makes, then the league assumes you don't need cap relief to operate:
(50mill-60mill) + 5mill = -5mill, if this equation pops out a negative number, then you don't get the LTIR cap relief?

[hockeymanG23]

I remember all the juggling the Flyers needed to do with Pronger on LTIR and in the end you're better off to just be under as the team is now, and after a Nylander extension, as opposed to through LTIR since those savings don't compound as the season goes along with the view off adding at the trade deadline.

Honestly the only thing that its good for is if the team is in some form of cap hell and you really don't want to get there by adding deal weight like Bolland.

Think about this too, if it was beneficial then why do so many teams pay with prospects and picks to get rid of the dead weight?

[2014olympicgold]

Can you be trade while you're on the IR?

I guess the biggest point is, "If it can or should be done, the Leafs would be doing it already".