Edmonton Oilers

[doulos]

There is not one single thing the Oilers need more than a new owner. They have a lot of needs, but first and foremost the owner is what created all of this.

I don't agree at all. Rarely does an owner have much of an effect on the team. It could be argued he's a bit absent and should make some changes in management, so I grant you he should probably fire his buddies, but aside from that there is very little for him to wreck and his deep pockets will come in handy once things turn around in Edmonton.

But to point out the rich guy who probably rarely concerns himself with the team (this is a rich boy's toy for him, he has a real job outside of the Oilers) seems a little over the top.

[doulos]

By management do you mean the owner because he's the one who empowers everyone. Kevin Lowe even offered to step down and was rebuffed by Katz. If management is seriously the problem then the owner must change before there's light at the end of the tunnel.

I've reached acceptance stage. Who cares, at this point? It's going to suck until it gets better. No matter how hard Gary Bettman tries with his loser point to create false parity the NHL is still a zero sum league. For there to be great teams, there have to be bad teams too. Our turn. And you can pretend like you deserve better but deserve's got nothing to do with it. That's why I fully support any and all jersey throwers. As a fan of a team you are just cheering for laundry and nothing more.

No, by management I mean Kevin Lowe and Craig McTavish, not the owner. The owner just needs to do his job and replace those guys.

Also, I'm not sure if I gave the impression that I "deserve" anything as a fan. I "desire" a competitive team, but in a Universe that is going to end up in heat death, the very concept of "deserve" is pretty pointless.

[metaldude26]

No, by management I mean Kevin Lowe and Craig McTavish, not the owner. The owner just needs to do his job and replace those guys.

Also, I'm not sure if I gave the impression that I "deserve" anything as a fan. I "desire" a competitive team, but in a Universe that is going to end up in heat death, the very concept of "deserve" is pretty pointless.

Yes but as he has continually proven to be far too loyal to make those management moves do you really trust the owner to make good new hires?

[doulos]

how many more franchise players need to go to the oilers? Do you think it's going to make a difference? I seriously doubt it. And again, the best player in the draft is a forward, something of which they DON'T NEED AS MUCH AS DEFENSE AND GOALIES.

Everyone in Edmonton is delusional, and like gainerama said. It's like watching a brutal QE2 crash. McDavid won't turn this franchise around. Hall didn't do it, Eberle, Nuge, Yakupov, Draisaitl didn't/won't do it. Nothing will do it unless there are some serious major movements at the top.

And if the owner isn't willing to make that change this trend of garbage team will continue for as long as he's comfortable funding it.

McDavid alone is not going to magically win the team a Stanley Cup. But if you look at the impact of a guy like Crosby, you can see that a special player like him can make a large difference, on a degree that is unmatched by any of the previous Oiler draft picks.

The people who are delusional are the ones who think Oiler fans don't get it for the most part. We do. This team is garbage. This team has massive glaring holes in every aspect of the team - players, coaching, management, ownership, scouting etc. It's getting a little ****ing tiresome to listen to fans of other teams berate Oiler fans for the state of their own team - as if it's their own fault. This is like blaming the abused for having the crap kicked out of them by their abuser. Oiler fans (for the most part) get it. The team is a total disaster from top to bottom. There is no magical easy fix. The only power fans have is to stop attending games. That's real easy to say, but a lot harder to do when attending games is far more than cheering for a team but involves your social group, your date night, your season ticket holders who don't want to give up their spots, the 'Make a Wish' kids activities etc. It's just not that cut and dry. It's super easy for me, who lives 6.5 hours out of town and only attends a few games a year at the best of times, to stop attending, but I understand how hard it is for those who have the Edmonton Oilers high on their list of activities they are massively involved in.

Firing Chabot is not going to win a Stanley Cup. It's one small piece of the puzzle that needed to happen. The result was people berating the team for making the move. The move wasn't bad. Expecting it to solve everything would be idiotic, but the only people claiming that it was the only thing that needed to change, were sarcastic fans of other teams who made up some narrative that the management team fired Chabot and then clapped their hands and "Fixed!" Oiler fans (again, for the most part, there is always drunken fan #78 who has some interesting ideas on what will work) never believed that was the entire answer, but just one piece of the puzzle.

Guess what else is not going to fix the team when taken in isolation?

Firing Lowe
Firing MacTavish
Upgrading the Defense
Upgrading the C position
Upgrading the Goalie Position
Firing the coach
Firing the Scouts
Drafting McDavid


By themselves none of these things will really make much difference. That's where things are at with this team - they are THAT bad. all of these things likely need to happen in order to even START seeing change with the team.

Oiler. Fans. Get. It.

So, you can take your 'Everyone in Edmonton is delusional' and put it on the mantle with any other broad sweeping generalizations you might have that don't actually fit with reality.

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Yes but as he has continually proven to be far too loyal to make those management moves do you really trust the owner to make good new hires?

Tough to say. There is some risk there.

[rataylor22]

I don't agree at all. Rarely does an owner have much of an effect on the team. It could be argued he's a bit absent and should make some changes in management, so I grant you he should probably fire his buddies, but aside from that there is very little for him to wreck and his deep pockets will come in handy once things turn around in Edmonton.

But to point out the rich guy who probably rarely concerns himself with the team (this is a rich boy's toy for him, he has a real job outside of the Oilers) seems a little over the top.

No, by management I mean Kevin Lowe and Craig McTavish, not the owner. The owner just needs to do his job and replace those guys.

Also, I'm not sure if I gave the impression that I "deserve" anything as a fan. I "desire" a competitive team, but in a Universe that is going to end up in heat death, the very concept of "deserve" is pretty pointless.

Really? Are you that blind to your own team? The management in Edmonton has been a mess forever because of the "old boys club" that exists within the organization. Even if Katz cleans house, he will just hire more of his completely unqualified friends in their spots. I mean, do you know how many cups Kevin Lowe has won? You can't argue with success like that. Every bad decision Edmonton makes starts and ends with Katz, because every Edmonton hire is one of his buddy's. I'd find it highly doubtful that Katz isn't making money. So the owner is doing the only job he cares about, which is making money. He clearly doesn't care about winning if he's let incompetent people run his organization for this long.

[rataylor22]

Well doulos, your rant clearly shows you aren't blind to your team. My apologies. Still seems like you're pretty blind to what your owner is, and how he has impacted what this team is today.

[doulos]

Really? Are you that blind to your own team? The management in Edmonton has been a mess forever because of the "old boys club" that exists within the organization. Even if Katz cleans house, he will just hire more of his completely unqualified friends in their spots. I mean, do you know how many cups Kevin Lowe has won? You can't argue with success like that. Every bad decision Edmonton makes starts and ends with Katz, because every Edmonton hire is one of his buddy's. I'd find it highly doubtful that Katz isn't making money. So the owner is doing the only job he cares about, which is making money. He clearly doesn't care about winning if he's let incompetent people run his organization for this long.

Katz is in on the Oilers as an entertaining way to make money, but I don't believe he will let the team be horrific forever. This might be a super-elite hobby for Katz, but these types of personalities generally are also competitive. I still believe that at some point he will be forced to make the real tough decisions and get rid of his buddies. Maybe I am wrong and the team is doomed to be dead last until Katz passes the team over to his frizzy haired offspring. If that happens my interest will be long moved onto other things by that point.

There is a risk that Katz will get rid of MacTavish and Lowe and hire Mark Messier to replace them. I'm actually concerned about that. I just dispute that he is the biggest thing that needs to change with the team. Realistically, if the rest of the management team is replaced, and a suitable replacement can be found, then the damage an owner can do at that point is pretty minimal compared to the help he can bring (ie really deep pockets) However, as I said to metaldude, there is certainly the risk that he just hires more cronies.

[rataylor22]

I think we can all agree Steve Smith would do the best job for the oilers.

[metaldude26]

My biggest issue with Katz is that he's more interested in the Oilers as a business venture than fielding a winning team. I am not even an Edmonton resident but I loathe any owner that holds his fans hostage with threats of moving the team to get them to pay for a new arena that they won't benefit from nearly as it will the owner, if it benefits them at all.

Not to mention he made his millions in the pharmaceutical industry, which I have my personal issues with.

[Axeman33]

My biggest issue with Katz is that he's more interested in the Oilers as a business venture than fielding a winning team. I am not even an Edmonton resident but I loathe any owner that holds his fans hostage with threats of moving the team to get them to pay for a new arena that they won't benefit from nearly as it will the owner, if it benefits them at all.

Not to mention he made his millions in the pharmaceutical industry, which I have my personal issues with.

Kinda sounds like another Canadian team from years gone by.

harold-ballard.jpg

[doulos]

My biggest issue with Katz is that he's more interested in the Oilers as a business venture than fielding a winning team. I am not even an Edmonton resident but I loathe any owner that holds his fans hostage with threats of moving the team to get them to pay for a new arena that they won't benefit from nearly as it will the owner, if it benefits them at all.

Not to mention he made his millions in the pharmaceutical industry, which I have my personal issues with.

These are fair points. Let's have no illusions about his end goal with all of this 'Oiler stuff'.

[Dutch]

McDavid alone is not going to magically win the team a Stanley Cup. But if you look at the impact of a guy like Crosby, you can see that a special player like him can make a large difference, on a degree that is unmatched by any of the previous Oiler draft picks.

The people who are delusional are the ones who think Oiler fans don't get it for the most part. We do. This team is garbage. This team has massive glaring holes in every aspect of the team - players, coaching, management, ownership, scouting etc. It's getting a little ****ing tiresome to listen to fans of other teams berate Oiler fans for the state of their own team - as if it's their own fault. This is like blaming the abused for having the crap kicked out of them by their abuser. Oiler fans (for the most part) get it. The team is a total disaster from top to bottom. There is no magical easy fix. The only power fans have is to stop attending games. That's real easy to say, but a lot harder to do when attending games is far more than cheering for a team but involves your social group, your date night, your season ticket holders who don't want to give up their spots, the 'Make a Wish' kids activities etc. It's just not that cut and dry. It's super easy for me, who lives 6.5 hours out of town and only attends a few games a year at the best of times, to stop attending, but I understand how hard it is for those who have the Edmonton Oilers high on their list of activities they are massively involved in.

Firing Chabot is not going to win a Stanley Cup. It's one small piece of the puzzle that needed to happen. The result was people berating the team for making the move. The move wasn't bad. Expecting it to solve everything would be idiotic, but the only people claiming that it was the only thing that needed to change, were sarcastic fans of other teams who made up some narrative that the management team fired Chabot and then clapped their hands and "Fixed!" Oiler fans (again, for the most part, there is always drunken fan #78 who has some interesting ideas on what will work) never believed that was the entire answer, but just one piece of the puzzle.

Guess what else is not going to fix the team when taken in isolation?

Firing Lowe
Firing MacTavish
Upgrading the Defense
Upgrading the C position
Upgrading the Goalie Position
Firing the coach
Firing the Scouts
Drafting McDavid


By themselves none of these things will really make much difference. That's where things are at with this team - they are THAT bad. all of these things likely need to happen in order to even START seeing change with the team.

Oiler. Fans. Get. It.

So, you can take your 'Everyone in Edmonton is delusional' and put it on the mantle with any other broad sweeping generalizations you might have that don't actually fit with reality.

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Tough to say. There is some risk there.

spoken like a true homer..

You know it's a disaster when even the fans are going crazy!

Your "moves" are all fine, but the majority of oiler fans have been spoiled in the 80's and that's why they're delusional about the team.

It's a fact.

The fans not showing up doesn't do much, as the majority of seats are owned by corporations who give out tickets to clients etc. Not sure about other teams, but I know for Oilers and Flames tickets its SUPER easy to get free tickets just because oil companies own half the seats. So not sure if "fans" not coming to the game will have any impact at all really.


and I guess I should clarify you are less delusional than most.

[doulos]

spoken like a true homer..

You know it's a disaster when even the fans are going crazy!

Your "moves" are all fine, but the majority of oiler fans have been spoiled in the 80's and that's why they're delusional about the team.

It's a fact.

The fans not showing up doesn't do much, as the majority of seats are owned by corporations who give out tickets to clients etc. Not sure about other teams, but I know for Oilers and Flames tickets its SUPER easy to get free tickets just because oil companies own half the seats. So not sure if "fans" not coming to the game will have any impact at all really.


and I guess I should clarify you are less delusional than most.

Fine Dutch. You're free to believe what you will.

[Axeman33]

This is always fun to go back and watch every once in a while. Good speak Kevin.

[27Blue]

Up until last season, the Isles and the Oil were pretty comparable on a lot of fronts.
One off-season and 5 fresh bodies changed everything on the Island.
They still have the same clueless coach and same clueless GM and same absent, cheap owner, BUT

Halak, Boychuk, Leddy, Grabovski and Kulemin have allowed the PLAYERS to change their course.

Edmonton just needs better players.

*Still boggles my mind how cheaply the NYI acquired Leddy and Boychuk at the end of training camp.
A LOT of other teams are kicking themselves right now, guaranteed.