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Thread: [TRADE] Montreal acquires Dvorak from Arizona

  1. #31
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    Default Re: [TRADE] Montreal acquires Dvorak from Arizona

    It is hard for me to reconcile someone’s opinion as serious and educated while also saying Danault’s line got caved in in the playoffs because that just….didn’t happen.

    I also find it fun when people say “you clearly haven’t watch Danault” and then sing the praises of Dvorak, a player they definitely haven’t watched very much recently. I’m quite confident the average Habs fan isn’t regularly tuning into Coyotes games.

    Dvorak’s numbers in junior simply do not matter at this point. I highly doubt he moves the needle enough on the Canadiens for them to make the playoffs this year. 60+ points? I doubt it. How many 2Cs actually pass 60 points in the NHL these days? For record, 41 players listed as “C” and 85 forwards total have averaged the 0.73 P/G mark over the last two years. So I’ll take the under on Montreal’s 2C surpassing 60 points

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    Default Re: [TRADE] Montreal acquires Dvorak from Arizona

    We can analyze the trade on multiple side for pro and cons, but for me Dvorak is very welcome, because there was just one good center on Montreal team with Suzuki. They now have a second good one...

    As for the playoffs, yes the division will be very competitive so there is nothing sure with the Habs, but same thing with few other teams. It will be great to play against Boston again...As a Habs fan, I'm pretty happy right now...
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  3. #33
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    Default Re: [TRADE] Montreal acquires Dvorak from Arizona

    Quote Originally Posted by rataylor22 View Post
    It is hard for me to reconcile someone’s opinion as serious and educated while also saying Danault’s line got caved in in the playoffs because that just….didn’t happen.

    I also find it fun when people say “you clearly haven’t watch Danault” and then sing the praises of Dvorak, a player they definitely haven’t watched very much recently. I’m quite confident the average Habs fan isn’t regularly tuning into Coyotes games.

    Dvorak’s numbers in junior simply do not matter at this point. I highly doubt he moves the needle enough on the Canadiens for them to make the playoffs this year. 60+ points? I doubt it. How many 2Cs actually pass 60 points in the NHL these days? For record, 41 players listed as “C” and 85 forwards total have averaged the 0.73 P/G mark over the last two years. So I’ll take the under on Montreal’s 2C surpassing 60 points
    The line of Danault absolutely did get caved in, except in the Winnipeg series in which they absolutely dominated. His Corsi and Fenwick were both in the 42% range overall in the playoffs. So, take me seriously or not, that is what happened.

    That being said, you're absolutely right that Dvorak's junior numbers are irrelevant and it's not like Dvorak is some sort of savior. He's an average 2nd line center. I also agree that 60 points is probably his ceiling and not what should be expected of him. And yes, the Habs are still hard pressed to make the playoffs with him.

    My objection comes from comparing Danault and Dvorak as if there's this major gap in between them. They're different players and bring different things, but overall, both are 2C in the NHL.

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    Default Re: [TRADE] Montreal acquires Dvorak from Arizona

    I’m not sure Danault is even relevant here.
    He’s been gone for two months.

    Irrelevant to the offer sheet.

    Dvorak v. KK is really all than should be analyzed.
    2021/22 Mtl wins this situation.
    after that who really knows. ?
    Carolina developed players better then Mtl.

    If KK hits potential the question that we will need to ask is,
    - Could he have reached that potential if she stayed in Mtl?
    pure speculation at the end of the day.

    Fun observation….

    Joke was the biggest KK tire pumper on these Dobber boards in his draft year.
    he was the only one (outside of Bergervin) that thought KK was a top 10 talent
    Carolina did hire him as a Euro amateur scout
    might be nothing… like I Said fun observation.

    And clearly Arz is going FULL REBOOT after Chayka.

    they will be bottom 3 and stockpiling picks the next 2-4 years. Expect the. To be busy at the trade deadline. Lots of expiring contracts.
    how many extra 2023 picks can they acquire to go with their current 8 1st, 2nd rounders in 2022?
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    Default Re: [TRADE] Montreal acquires Dvorak from Arizona

    I’d be interested to know the Danault xG share, which is widely accepted to be a much better metric than Corsi/Fenwick. Would also be interested what all of those metrics were pre-Tampa, because Tampa caves everyone.

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    Default Re: [TRADE] Montreal acquires Dvorak from Arizona

    Quote Originally Posted by rataylor22 View Post
    I’d be interested to know the Danault xG share, which is widely accepted to be a much better metric than Corsi/Fenwick. Would also be interested what all of those metrics were pre-Tampa, because Tampa caves everyone.
    I don't have his splits between series but overall, his expected goals share in the playoffs was 46% while his actual goals were 36.1%.

    I'd be curious to see the results outside TB as well but I doubt they change the point made here.

    Meanwhile, Gallagher was at 57% expected goal and 54% actual goals.

    Regular season? Danault at 47% for both stats and Gallagher at 60%.

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    Default Re: [TRADE] Montreal acquires Dvorak from Arizona

    It's pretty clear that Bergevin and his scouting staff have struggled to draft and develop quality centers. Jake Evans is finally finding his way, and he was a 7th round pick, so good on them there but lots of swings and misses for Bergevin there. Trading for them seems to be their only option.
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    Default Re: [TRADE] Montreal acquires Dvorak from Arizona

    I also think I see Dvorak being more of a Plekanec than Danault. I guess because I’m not a big Danault fan. I think he got a bit lucky in the playoffs with JT going down and Scheifle being suspended. Made it so much easier for him to focus on shutting down the obvious leftovers. I’m not discounting what Montreal did as a whole but his defensive prowess may have been a wee bit overblown. Good deal tho for the Habs.
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  9. #39
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    Default Re: [TRADE] Montreal acquires Dvorak from Arizona

    Woof

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    Default Re: [TRADE] Montreal acquires Dvorak from Arizona

    Indeed.
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  11. #41
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    Default Re: [TRADE] Montreal acquires Dvorak from Arizona

    I actually thought to myself this morning: "Hey wait, doesn't Dvorak play for Montreal?"
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    Default Re: [TRADE] Montreal acquires Dvorak from Arizona

    My thought recently was "what if MTL kept Danualt instead of going after Dvorak" but I know the timing wasn't likely going to let that happen.
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    Default Re: [TRADE] Montreal acquires Dvorak from Arizona

    Quote Originally Posted by Axeman33 View Post
    Danault did not have a great year offensively last year so yes, compared to last year, he'll be better than Danault, but Danault had some good offensive years prior to last year. I see him as a replacement for Danault as already mentioned but I don't see him as a strong upgrade offensively if you look at them over the years.

    Dvorak has yet to put up 40 points in a single season so I'm not jumping on him and looking for offensive.

    I won't be one bit surprised to see Danault in LA have a better offensive season than Dvorak in Montreal next year
    .
    So far, this prediction is coming true. I dont expect it to change.

    Danault 9pts in 15 games with 43.6% offensive zone start

    Dvorak 5 pts in 17 games with 48% offensive zone start.
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  14. #44
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    Default Re: [TRADE] Montreal acquires Dvorak from Arizona

    Quote Originally Posted by Axeman33 View Post
    So far, this prediction is coming true. I dont expect it to change.

    Danault 9pts in 15 games with 43.6% offensive zone start

    Dvorak 5 pts in 17 games with 48% offensive zone start.
    I would bet his 43.6% OZS is still probably more times starting in the OZ then Dvorak's 48%. On a per game basis.
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    Default Re: [TRADE] Montreal acquires Dvorak from Arizona

    Quote Originally Posted by Invictus View Post
    I would bet his 43.6% OZS is still probably more times starting in the OZ then Dvorak's 48%.
    Im pretty sure the numbers speak for themselves.
    10 Team, Points Only, Cash League

    25 Man Roster (no position), top 20 point getters count at end of month
    Keep 20/25 at seasons end, Cut 5 to FA for redrafting
    Goalie points W=2pt L=-1pt SHO=2pt

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    G- Vasilevskiy, Sorokin, Oettinger


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