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Thread: Knight vs Kahkonen for Keeper

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    Default Knight vs Kahkonen for Keeper

    Hello all,

    Trying to decide on whether I should keep one of my current goalies. The shortlist is really Knight or Kahkonen, since both would only cost me an 18th round pick to keep.

    I feel like both of them are going to be in a 1A/1B situation (Knight with Bob and Kahk with Talbot), but Florida is trending upward whereas not sure Minny can be as good as last year (assuming they resign Kaprizov - without him, basement).

    I also think Talbot is going to be more stable in net than Bob, so likely that Knight has the 1A edge more than Kahk does.

    Thoughts?
    TEAM (Previous Year's Keepers in Bold):
    Centres: Eriksson Ek, Crosby, Bennett and Lindholm
    Wingers: Kucherov, J Robertson, Fiala, Wilson, Stone (IR), Konecny (DTD), Terry, Toffoli
    Dmen: Josi, Dobson, Seider, Letang and Montour
    Goalies: Hellebuyck, Demko, Gibson and Ersson

    CATS:
    Skater Cats: G, A, +/-, PIM, PPP, SOG, Hit, Blk
    Goalie Cats: GS, W, GAA, SA, SV%

    Roster:
    2LW, 2RW, 2C, 4D, 2Util, 2 G

    12 team, 6-keeper league (keeper cost based on draft position; keeper cost increases by 2 rnds each year until hits 5th round cost, then increases by 1 rnd each year), 19 rnd draft. Undrafted FA pick ups cost 18th round pick to keep.

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    Default Re: Knight vs Kahkonen for Keeper

    In a keep 6, both those guys probably aren't keepers and should be easily re-draftable in the draft if you need them. I'd be looking at keeping Kucherov, Hughes, Trocheck, Robertson, Theodore and probably one of Batherson, Kyroux, Mantha, Farabee or Caufield.

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    Default Re: Knight vs Kahkonen for Keeper

    I think Knight has great value as an 18th rounder but would need to compare your other keeper ideas (and their costs). In a silo though I prefer Knight over Kahkonen

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    Default Re: Knight vs Kahkonen for Keeper

    Quote Originally Posted by niconasr View Post
    In a keep 6, both those guys probably aren't keepers and should be easily re-draftable in the draft if you need them. I'd be looking at keeping Kucherov, Hughes, Trocheck, Robertson, Theodore and probably one of Batherson, Kyroux, Mantha, Farabee or Caufield.
    Agree here.
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    Default Re: Knight vs Kahkonen for Keeper

    Thanks for the replies - yeah there are lots of other keeper considerations. Trochek would only cost me a 17th to keep, but I expect regression from him so might try to see what I get offered in trades.
    Theodore would cost an 8th to keep, which is maybe 1-2 rounds after he'd otherwise be drafted in a 12 team league, so not huge value. Hughes would cost a 13th rounder to keep and I don't think he's going to go that much earlier in the draft so again not great draft value.


    Kuch is going to cost me an 8th, so definite lock. Roberston 18th, so lock. Batherson 18th, so lock. After that I may gamble on Caufield (also an 18th cost) and then I really like Tolvonen in a multi-cat (also an 18th cost). Mantha is interesting (and also an 18th cost), but I'm wondering whether Knight is going to be a better bet for driving goalie cat wins since I've got what Mantha offers covered elsewhere.
    TEAM (Previous Year's Keepers in Bold):
    Centres: Eriksson Ek, Crosby, Bennett and Lindholm
    Wingers: Kucherov, J Robertson, Fiala, Wilson, Stone (IR), Konecny (DTD), Terry, Toffoli
    Dmen: Josi, Dobson, Seider, Letang and Montour
    Goalies: Hellebuyck, Demko, Gibson and Ersson

    CATS:
    Skater Cats: G, A, +/-, PIM, PPP, SOG, Hit, Blk
    Goalie Cats: GS, W, GAA, SA, SV%

    Roster:
    2LW, 2RW, 2C, 4D, 2Util, 2 G

    12 team, 6-keeper league (keeper cost based on draft position; keeper cost increases by 2 rnds each year until hits 5th round cost, then increases by 1 rnd each year), 19 rnd draft. Undrafted FA pick ups cost 18th round pick to keep.

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    Default Re: Knight vs Kahkonen for Keeper

    Sounds like you have a lot of 18ths. does each subsequent 18th climb up a round?

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    Default Re: Knight vs Kahkonen for Keeper

    Quote Originally Posted by COLT.45 View Post
    Sounds like you have a lot of 18ths. does each subsequent 18th climb up a round?
    Normally yes, but I stocked up on 18 round picks and hold four of them, so each will cost just the 18th.
    TEAM (Previous Year's Keepers in Bold):
    Centres: Eriksson Ek, Crosby, Bennett and Lindholm
    Wingers: Kucherov, J Robertson, Fiala, Wilson, Stone (IR), Konecny (DTD), Terry, Toffoli
    Dmen: Josi, Dobson, Seider, Letang and Montour
    Goalies: Hellebuyck, Demko, Gibson and Ersson

    CATS:
    Skater Cats: G, A, +/-, PIM, PPP, SOG, Hit, Blk
    Goalie Cats: GS, W, GAA, SA, SV%

    Roster:
    2LW, 2RW, 2C, 4D, 2Util, 2 G

    12 team, 6-keeper league (keeper cost based on draft position; keeper cost increases by 2 rnds each year until hits 5th round cost, then increases by 1 rnd each year), 19 rnd draft. Undrafted FA pick ups cost 18th round pick to keep.

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    Default Re: Knight vs Kahkonen for Keeper

    Quote Originally Posted by Melloj View Post
    Thanks for the replies - yeah there are lots of other keeper considerations. Trochek would only cost me a 17th to keep, but I expect regression from him so might try to see what I get offered in trades.


    Kuch is going to cost me an 8th, so definite lock. Roberston 18th, so lock. Batherson 18th, so lock. After that I may gamble on Caufield (also an 18th cost) and then I really like Tolvonen in a multi-cat (also an 18th cost). Mantha is interesting (and also an 18th cost), but I'm wondering whether Knight is going to be a better bet for driving goalie cat wins since I've got what Mantha offers covered elsewhere.

    I would still keep Hughes and Theodore. Hughes in your league has dual position eligibility and is expected to take a step forward this year. Theodore IMO is consistently undervalued in drafts so I wouldn't want to risk losing him in order to keep someone like Knight or Kahkonen. Especially when your league counts SOG his value goes WAY up considering he is putting up 3 SOG/G, he's a top five player at that position in your league no question.

    Any idea what your goalie options are for the draft? Do you have all of your picks? The problem here is none of your options are starters, they are all at best timeshares for this year, next year and possibly further. You need to find a solid 1A if you can
    Keep 3 League, 14 team H2H, Roster: 6F, 4D, 4BN, 2G
    Cats: G, A, +/-, PPP, SOG, PIM, HITS, BLKS, W, GAA, SA, SV%
    F: Matthews, Pastrnak, Hughes, Pettersson, Guentzel, Meier, Hyman, Streamer
    D: Dahlin, Carlson, Trouba, Gudas, Larsson
    G: Oettinger, Talbot, Swayman

    One Year League, 10 Team H2H, Roster: 2C, 2LW, 2RW, W, F, 4D, UTIL, 5BN, 2G
    Cats: G, A, PPP, SHP, SOG, SH%, PIM, HITS, BLKS W, GAA, SV, SV%, SHO
    C: McDavid, Thomas, Rossi
    LW: Guentzel, McTavish, Byfield, Huberdeau
    RW: Miller, Barzal, Zuccarello, Schmaltz, Tarasenko
    D: Josi, Seider, Trouba, Gudas, L. Hughes
    G: Oettinger, Demko
    IR: Hamilton

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    Default Re: Knight vs Kahkonen for Keeper

    If you are deciding between Knight and Kahkonen, the clear answer is Knight. The Wild don't think Kahkonen is very good and he will likely never be anything more than a back up goalie. Knight could be a star as soon as this season.

    With that said, I am a bit confused by your keeper rules. How exactly would you be able to have multiple keepers that all cost you an 18th round pick? Do you have enough 18th round picks to keep all of those guys?

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    Default Re: Knight vs Kahkonen for Keeper

    Quote Originally Posted by chuckcouples View Post
    If you are deciding between Knight and Kahkonen, the clear answer is Knight. The Wild don't think Kahkonen is very good and he will likely never be anything more than a back up goalie. Knight could be a star as soon as this season.

    With that said, I am a bit confused by your keeper rules. How exactly would you be able to have multiple keepers that all cost you an 18th round pick? Do you have enough 18th round picks to keep all of those guys?
    Hi - basically if you pick up an FA during the year, they cost you an 18th round pick to keep. So I had traded a lot of my team away for picks last season and grabbed guys off the FA market when it looked like they had potential. As part of my trades I acquired about four 18th round picks, so I could keep 4 guys from the FA group for their 18th round pick cost. With Kuch at an 8th, that leaves five more spots to fill in the wide potential keeper group I own.

    I currently own one 1st, two 2nds, two 3rds, one 4th, one 5th, two 6ths, no 7th, two 8ths, one 9th, one 10th and then one 13th, one 17th and four 18th round picks.
    TEAM (Previous Year's Keepers in Bold):
    Centres: Eriksson Ek, Crosby, Bennett and Lindholm
    Wingers: Kucherov, J Robertson, Fiala, Wilson, Stone (IR), Konecny (DTD), Terry, Toffoli
    Dmen: Josi, Dobson, Seider, Letang and Montour
    Goalies: Hellebuyck, Demko, Gibson and Ersson

    CATS:
    Skater Cats: G, A, +/-, PIM, PPP, SOG, Hit, Blk
    Goalie Cats: GS, W, GAA, SA, SV%

    Roster:
    2LW, 2RW, 2C, 4D, 2Util, 2 G

    12 team, 6-keeper league (keeper cost based on draft position; keeper cost increases by 2 rnds each year until hits 5th round cost, then increases by 1 rnd each year), 19 rnd draft. Undrafted FA pick ups cost 18th round pick to keep.

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    Default Re: Knight vs Kahkonen for Keeper

    Quote Originally Posted by COLT.45 View Post
    In a silo though I prefer Knight over Kahkonen
    I have no idea why... but I love this "in a silo" phrase!
    I also support Knight over Kahkonen... FLA will find a way to let him shift into that #1 spot.

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    Default Re: Knight vs Kahkonen for Keeper

    Knight is substantially more valuable than Kahkonen.

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    Default Re: Knight vs Kahkonen for Keeper

    This format is all about draft value, and getting great keepers cheaper.

    8th: Kucherov - lock, as you said. In fact, he's a lock for a few years.
    13th: Hughes - I think this is as cheap as he'll get, actually. Possible trade option.
    17th: Trocheck - Will go higher int he draft, a good trade option.
    18th: Roberston, Batherson, Caufield, Tolvanen, Mantha, Knight, Kahkonen - lots of options here.

    You may have some more 18th round options that we don't have named.

    I'd lean towards seeing what Knight brings in return. While he could be a great keeper option, skaters are more reliable, and there's virtually no risk of the skaters being a negative. Same with mantha & Trocheck; and I'd want picks or definite multi-round values in return.
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