Results 1 to 15 of 15

Thread: Hughes and Kakko

  1. #1
    Palefa's Avatar
    Palefa is offline
    Join Date
    Sep 2020
    Posts
    902
    Rep Power
    9

    Dobber Sports Initiate

    Default Hughes and Kakko

    Hi all!

    If Jack Hughes and Kakko were elliglble for this year NHL draft, how would you rank them among the new ones (Lafrenière, Byfield, Stutzle, etc...)?

    Thanks
    10 team, points only, no cap, Bonus : PPG, SHG, HT, Shoot Out
    Top 9F, 4D, 1G . Keep 10 + 2 extras 150g or less, Max 22 (12F, 6D, 2G + 2 extras)

  2. #2
    Location
    Nova Scotia
    Rep Power
    40

    Dobber Sports Deity

    Default Re: Hughes and Kakko

    A while back, we had a similar thread and after some searching:

    https://forums.dobbersports.com/show...ighlight=Kakko

    This should offer a few opinions. Granted, this was back in July so some folks opinions might have changed since then. Mine has not,
    10 Team, Points Only, Cash League

    25 Man Roster (no position), top 20 point getters count at end of month
    Keep 20/25 at seasons end, Cut 5 to FA for redrafting
    Goalie points W=2pt L=-1pt SHO=2pt

    Stamkos, Tavares, Eichel, Mercer, JRobertson, RThomas, Kucherov, Nugent-Hopkins, Tuch, KConnor, Necas, Point, Konecny, SJarvis, Cozenz, Morrissey, Bouchard, Josi, Novak, Tolvanen, Peterka, Brink

    G- Vasilevskiy, Sorokin, Oettinger


    "Cleavage is like the sun. You can look, but dont stare.. Unless you're wearing sunglasses."

  3. #3
    Palefa's Avatar
    Palefa is offline
    Join Date
    Sep 2020
    Posts
    902
    Rep Power
    9

    Dobber Sports Initiate

    Default Re: Hughes and Kakko

    Nice thanks. Generally top 5 for both!
    10 team, points only, no cap, Bonus : PPG, SHG, HT, Shoot Out
    Top 9F, 4D, 1G . Keep 10 + 2 extras 150g or less, Max 22 (12F, 6D, 2G + 2 extras)

  4. #4
    Location
    Prairies
    Rep Power
    40

    Dobber Sports Demi-God

    Default Re: Hughes and Kakko

    For me, both Hughes & Kakko are right there with Byfield.
    Probably
    1. Lafreniere
    ...
    2a. Hughes
    2b. Byfield
    2c. Kakko

  5. #5
    Belexus75's Avatar
    Belexus75 is offline
    Join Date
    Jul 2014
    Posts
    6,402
    Rep Power
    50

    Dobber Sports Wizard

    Default Re: Hughes and Kakko

    Quote Originally Posted by Palefa View Post
    Nice thanks. Generally top 5 for both!
    yup those guys you listed would be the top 5 ....and 3 years ago their current order maybe flipped up side down including Laffy imo. They all very close...but one who will have most work to get there imo is J Hughes as he was struggling a bit with physicality of the NHL...i dont see other 4 having that trouble..at least not to the same degree.
    14 Teams H2H Dynasty, 28 roster spots (8 bench), 15 minors under 100
    Weekly Matchups - Daily Lineups

    Skaters: G/A/Pt/PIM/SoG/STP/H+B/ToI/Corsi
    Goalies: W/GAA/SVs/SV%/SHO

    C: Eichel, Kadri, Mcdavid, Sodeberg, Schenn
    LW: Ehlers, Landeskog, Meier, Debrusk, Foegele, Lee
    RW: Pastrnak, Marner, Palmieri, Terry, D. Brown, Bailey, Granlund
    D: Krug, Josi, Ekholm, Faulk, Muzzin, Karlsson, Cernak,
    G: Hellebuyck, Biship, M Jones

  6. #6
    senryu's Avatar
    senryu is offline
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Posts
    3,883
    Location
    Winden, DEU
    Rep Power
    50

    Dobber Sports Star

    Default Re: Hughes and Kakko

    Quote Originally Posted by Pengwin7 View Post
    For me, both Hughes & Kakko are right there with Byfield.
    Probably
    1. Lafreniere
    ...
    2a. Hughes
    2b. Byfield
    2c. Kakko
    I like this ordering.

  7. #7
    Lindros88's Avatar
    Lindros88 is offline
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Posts
    560
    Rep Power
    14

    Dobber Sports Apprentice

    Default Re: Hughes and Kakko

    I feel like Kakko, Byfield and Hughes could go in any order based on which team values the individual skill set more. I personally like Byfield a bit more than Hughes and Kakko, but it doesn't mean I'm right either hah. Either way, Laf, Hughes, Byfield and Kakko would still be the top 4 (real or fantasy) with Laf leading the way as of now (and any of the other 3 could end up the better player).
    14T dynasty
    G, A, +/-, PIM, PPP, SHP, GWG, SOG
    W, SV%, SO, GAA, SVS

  8. #8
    Rep Power
    11

    Dobber Sports Apprentice

    Default Re: Hughes and Kakko

    Quote Originally Posted by Pengwin7 View Post
    For me, both Hughes & Kakko are right there with Byfield.
    Probably
    1. Lafreniere
    ...
    2a. Hughes
    2b. Byfield
    2c. Kakko
    I agree with this order for Points only. Hughes/Byfield/Kakko are so close they are interchangeable in Points only. Multicat is where it becomes different.
    20tm multicat salary keeper
    19 Active/6 Reserve/ 33 Minors
    3C/3LW/3RW/3SKT/6D/1G
    Skaters: G/A/PlusMinus/PIM/SOG/PPP/SHP/Hit/Blk/FOW/FO%
    Goalies: W/GAA/SV/SV%/SHO

  9. #9
    CHunter's Avatar
    CHunter is offline
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Posts
    4,449
    Rep Power
    44

    Dobber Sports Genius

    Default Re: Hughes and Kakko

    Quote Originally Posted by BlackhawksFan View Post
    I agree with this order for Points only. Hughes/Byfield/Kakko are so close they are interchangeable in Points only. Multicat is where it becomes different.
    Yes...but I would put Kakko a hair above Hughes and Byfield due to his teammates.....assuming Byfield goes to LA.....
    12 teams dynasty, Points only ( G and A = 1pt)


    F: McDavid (12.5M), Kucherov (9.5M), Boldy (7M), Kyrou (8.13M), J. Norris (7.95M), Zegras (5.95M), Kuzmenko (5.5M), Reichel (0.925M), P. Kane (2.75M), Lundell (0.925M), Rasmussen (1.46M), Rossi (0.86M).

    D: Korchinski (0.925M), Byram (3.85M), Burns (5.28M).

    G: Kochetkov (2M), Shesterkin (5,670M).

    Bench: E. Karlsson (10M), Lucius (0.925M), Edvinsson (0.89M), Askarov (0.925M), Quinn (0.86M), Berggren (0.925M), Stankoven (0.81M), Knight (4.5M), Mitchkov (TBD), Athanasiou (4.25M), Samsonov (3.55M), Klingberg (4.15M).

  10. #10
    LuigiC173's Avatar
    LuigiC173 is offline
    Join Date
    Dec 2015
    Posts
    5,181
    Location
    Adirondacks
    Rep Power
    50

    Dobber Sports Superstar

    Default Re: Hughes and Kakko

    Kakko also gets the added bonus of less pressure assuming NY selects Alexis so everyone will be enamored with the shiny new toy.

  11. #11
    Location
    Flames!
    Rep Power
    38

    Dobber Sports Pro

    Default Re: Hughes and Kakko

    Yeah, Kakko is soooo 2019.

  12. #12
    Toepick's Avatar
    Toepick is offline
    Join Date
    Jul 2020
    Posts
    24
    Rep Power
    0

    Dobber Sports Rookie

    Default Re: Hughes and Kakko

    Just make sure you compare apples to apples (draft year vs draft year production) instead of apples to oranges (draft year vs 1st NHL year).

    Hughes, when playing against players in his age range (18-24 when including NCAA) had amazing stats. Better than any other USNTDP player before him including Matthews & Eichel. He just wasn't physically ready to play in the NHL against men at 5'10 & 165 lbs but in order to burn through his rookie contract years, he had to play pro. That means he couldn't go play NCAA and there was no benefit for him to go dominate Jr hockey in Canada playing against 16-20 yr old players. Europe likely wasn't an attractive option so he ended playing in the NHL on a crappy team when he was not ready for that level. Results were predictably crappy. Another way to look at it is to see all the hype around Zegras this year. He was buried on that USNTDP team behind Hughes/Turcotte and after one post draft great NCAA season, people talk about him in the same sentence as Hughes. I love Zegras but I don't think people will be trading him 1 for 1 for Hughes two years from now.

    Hughes' less heralded brother had the same decision to make a few years ago: turn pro or go NCAA. Quinn went back for two years of NCAA hockey and got stronger because he wasn't ready physically to play pro. Once he was ready, he put up Calder worthy stats this past year and people see him as a top 10 D in the league. I would expect the same with Jack. The extended break due to Covid will have given him more time to get stronger. I would expect a decent but not spectacular year from him and then good to great years starting in the 2021-22 season which would have been his first season had he followed Quinn's footsteps of 2 yrs of NCAA.

    Only difference between J Hughes/Lafreniere are in the positions they play and the stats they'll bring. Hughes will play center and be a point producing machine like P Kane and Lafreniere will play wing and be a Taylor Hall clone who'll get you decent points but also contribute in banger cats. They'll both be great in their respective categories so pick accordingly.

    Kakko/Byfield are similar. One is a winger that played against men in Europe who had a tough time adjusting to the NHL at 18. The other will likely be a center who will play 9 NHL games at 18 before being sent down to Jr where he will dominate against 16-20 yr olds. In year 3+, I would expect Byfield to be the better fantasy player as he has a path to top line minutes in LA given Kopitar's age and lack of proven NHL pivots on that roster. Kakko will also be really good but may have a tougher time getting PP1/top line minutes given the depth of the NYR lineup. However, if he gets top line minutes with Panarin & Zibby sooner, lookout.

    All that said, I think I would rank them as follows:
    1) Hughes - this shiny toy has barely been out of the package. He still projects to be the best point producing machine out of the 4.
    2) Lafreniere - power forward that can score against Jr competition. Will take him a few years to be able to get the strength to physically dominate at the NHL level but the depth of the NYR lineup will shield him. If he shows he can play right away, he'll play top 2 lines. If he's still too raw, they can hide him on the third line.
    3) Byfield - Big slick center. Almost a year younger than Lafreniere. Dominated Jr because of skill but also because of his size. That size won't matter as much in the NHL until he gets man strength to go along with it. That will take him a few years to develop. Once he gets it, he'll be a load to contain down low. Ideally, he'll start banging as well but I figure he'll be something like a Joe Thornton type player. More assists than goals and not overtly physical.
    4) Kakko - I think he's a Rantanen type player. Will be great but not flashy. His value will show up in little things he does. Will need a good center to maximize his offensive value but can play up or down the lineup. Will get 90 pts and everyone will say "where did that come from". Don't think he'll reach superstar levels but should be a dependable high point producing player that you'll love to have on your fantasy team and need to have on a Cup contending team. If you don't have him on your roster, the asking price will likely always be too high as you'll say "he's really good but I don't think he's great".

    My 4 cents worth

  13. #13
    Palefa's Avatar
    Palefa is offline
    Join Date
    Sep 2020
    Posts
    902
    Rep Power
    9

    Dobber Sports Initiate

    Default Re: Hughes and Kakko

    Wow, amazing, thanks!!

  14. #14
    HonkyTonkMan's Avatar
    HonkyTonkMan is offline
    Join Date
    Oct 2017
    Posts
    1,999
    Rep Power
    28

    Dobber Sports Stud

    Default Re: Hughes and Kakko

    Quote Originally Posted by Toepick View Post
    Just make sure you compare apples to apples (draft year vs draft year production) instead of apples to oranges (draft year vs 1st NHL year).

    Hughes, when playing against players in his age range (18-24 when including NCAA) had amazing stats. Better than any other USNTDP player before him including Matthews & Eichel. He just wasn't physically ready to play in the NHL against men at 5'10 & 165 lbs but in order to burn through his rookie contract years, he had to play pro. That means he couldn't go play NCAA and there was no benefit for him to go dominate Jr hockey in Canada playing against 16-20 yr old players. Europe likely wasn't an attractive option so he ended playing in the NHL on a crappy team when he was not ready for that level. Results were predictably crappy. Another way to look at it is to see all the hype around Zegras this year. He was buried on that USNTDP team behind Hughes/Turcotte and after one post draft great NCAA season, people talk about him in the same sentence as Hughes. I love Zegras but I don't think people will be trading him 1 for 1 for Hughes two years from now.

    Hughes' less heralded brother had the same decision to make a few years ago: turn pro or go NCAA. Quinn went back for two years of NCAA hockey and got stronger because he wasn't ready physically to play pro. Once he was ready, he put up Calder worthy stats this past year and people see him as a top 10 D in the league. I would expect the same with Jack. The extended break due to Covid will have given him more time to get stronger. I would expect a decent but not spectacular year from him and then good to great years starting in the 2021-22 season which would have been his first season had he followed Quinn's footsteps of 2 yrs of NCAA.

    Only difference between J Hughes/Lafreniere are in the positions they play and the stats they'll bring. Hughes will play center and be a point producing machine like P Kane and Lafreniere will play wing and be a Taylor Hall clone who'll get you decent points but also contribute in banger cats. They'll both be great in their respective categories so pick accordingly.

    Kakko/Byfield are similar. One is a winger that played against men in Europe who had a tough time adjusting to the NHL at 18. The other will likely be a center who will play 9 NHL games at 18 before being sent down to Jr where he will dominate against 16-20 yr olds. In year 3+, I would expect Byfield to be the better fantasy player as he has a path to top line minutes in LA given Kopitar's age and lack of proven NHL pivots on that roster. Kakko will also be really good but may have a tougher time getting PP1/top line minutes given the depth of the NYR lineup. However, if he gets top line minutes with Panarin & Zibby sooner, lookout.

    All that said, I think I would rank them as follows:
    1) Hughes - this shiny toy has barely been out of the package. He still projects to be the best point producing machine out of the 4.
    2) Lafreniere - power forward that can score against Jr competition. Will take him a few years to be able to get the strength to physically dominate at the NHL level but the depth of the NYR lineup will shield him. If he shows he can play right away, he'll play top 2 lines. If he's still too raw, they can hide him on the third line.
    3) Byfield - Big slick center. Almost a year younger than Lafreniere. Dominated Jr because of skill but also because of his size. That size won't matter as much in the NHL until he gets man strength to go along with it. That will take him a few years to develop. Once he gets it, he'll be a load to contain down low. Ideally, he'll start banging as well but I figure he'll be something like a Joe Thornton type player. More assists than goals and not overtly physical.
    4) Kakko - I think he's a Rantanen type player. Will be great but not flashy. His value will show up in little things he does. Will need a good center to maximize his offensive value but can play up or down the lineup. Will get 90 pts and everyone will say "where did that come from". Don't think he'll reach superstar levels but should be a dependable high point producing player that you'll love to have on your fantasy team and need to have on a Cup contending team. If you don't have him on your roster, the asking price will likely always be too high as you'll say "he's really good but I don't think he's great".

    My 4 cents worth

    I agree and have Byfield, Hughes, Laf in the same tier. Kakko is not in their tier (in my opinion) but will still be a hell of a player. Hughes is on a team where absolutely no one can score (or do much of anything at all). They will get better, and so will he. I'd be buying low if I could on him all day long....

  15. #15
    Location
    South Dakota
    Rep Power
    50

    The Great One

    Default Re: Hughes and Kakko

    Just look what the break did for Jesperi Kotakaniemi in MTL. He was a different player coming into the qualifying round with all the work he did over the break. Hopefully a number of these young guys were paying attention. I'm sure they were. Just need their gym time to pay off and for their physical development to catch up with the skill set.

    I also disagree that Rantnanen is not flashy. I've seen him play live numerous times and he's flashy as hell. He's not quite as explosive a skater as Mackinnon, but he plays a lot more of a well rounded game (up and down and across the ice vs Mackinnon's more N-S game) and has eye popping skill. He's a younger better Evgeni Malkin. I don't know if Kakko is at that level skill wise. But I've not seen him play.
    12 team Yahoo Roto keeper (keep 3)
    9 F, 6 D; roster 3 G max
    G,A,PPP,SOG,BLKS,HITS - W,SO,SV%,Saves

    F: B Tkachuk, Stutzle, Eriksson Ek, Necas, Konecny, Cooley, Boldy, Lehkonen, Tippett
    D: Dahlin, Seider, Matheson, Durzi, Addison, Mintyukov
    G: Hill, Husso

    IR:

    Bench: L Hughes, Merzlikins, Terry, Tuch

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •