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Thread: Salary cap advice, upper and lower limit?

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    Default Salary cap advice, upper and lower limit?

    Hi! Next season we'll start with salary cap, so my question is, what is a good upper and lower limit?

    After some googleing I think at least 30M over the NHL salary cap, but I'm not sure.

    If 30M, should we use that for future seasons as well? Or should it be percent over Nhl's salary?

    Our league is a 10-team with 21 man roster.

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    Default Re: Salary cap advice, upper and lower limit?

    Welcome to the forums! It really depends on what kind of team you want to have. Do you want a player like Panarin, Doughty, Kane, or even maybe E.Karlsson in your FA pile, and forcing teams to cut players and make decisions, or do you just want there to be something stopping the top team from getting absolutely stacked?
    For a small league like that, 20-30M above the cap sounds reasonable.

    Also it sounds like you're implementing it on an existing league. How are you making that work?
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    Default Re: Salary cap advice, upper and lower limit?

    You generally won't need a lower limit in fantasy leagues with cap. The issue in the real world is owners charging major league prices for minor league games and pocketing money, screwing the fans. That doesn't happen in fantasy.

    I'm also interested to hear how you guys are going to go from no cap to cap.
    Last edited by stevegamer; February 21, 2020 at 10:06 PM.
    10 team Head-to-head true dynasty. Roster 33, draft 2, cut down before season. Start 1 G, 1 backup G, 6 D, 12 F arranged in 4 lines of 3. Only categories that matter are Goals, Assists, Save% with a shutout bonus. Having NHL teammates helps.

    G: Bobrovsky
    Backup G: F Andersen
    D: Ekblad, Yandle, Carlson, DeAngelo, Letang, Makar
    F1: Couturier, Giroux, Voracek
    F2: Schiefele, Wheeler, MacKinnon
    F3: Stamkos, Point, JT Miller
    F4: Bertuzzi, Tavares, Seguin

    Bench:
    G:
    D: Barrie, M Reilly, Heiskanen, Klingberg, Morissey, Weegar
    F: Bailey, Benn, Guentzel, Johnsson, Labanc, Mikheyev, Necas
    Reserve: Datsyuk

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    Default Re: Salary cap advice, upper and lower limit?

    The lower limit in fantasy cap leagues is weird. In theory it prevents a team from filling its roster with bubble players on purpose which makes the league worse for everyone else. In practice I've noticed that the bad teams are typically bad because they have all of the bad contracts, so the cap floor isn't even an issue. Bad GMs will find a way to screw it up.


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    Default Re: Salary cap advice, upper and lower limit?

    Quote Originally Posted by Eskimo Brother View Post
    Welcome to the forums! It really depends on what kind of team you want to have. Do you want a player like Panarin, Doughty, Kane, or even maybe E.Karlsson in your FA pile, and forcing teams to cut players and make decisions, or do you just want there to be something stopping the top team from getting absolutely stacked?
    For a small league like that, 20-30M above the cap sounds reasonable.

    Also it sounds like you're implementing it on an existing league. How are you making that work?
    Thanks! My idea is to stop the top teams from getting stacked. But we haven't discussed it that much yet, only that everyone is positive to salary cap. What is the most common way to do it?

    And regarding how we are going from no cap to cap, we're just implementing it after this season. Everyone is on to this. But maybe it's not a good idea? :P

    Quote Originally Posted by ericdaoust View Post
    The lower limit in fantasy cap leagues is weird.
    Quote Originally Posted by stevegamer View Post
    You generally won't need a lower limit in fantasy leagues with cap.
    Then we simply skip it, we haven't discussed it anyway.

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    Default Re: Salary cap advice, upper and lower limit?

    The most common way to do it is usually to start the league with it haha. I don't know of any leagues that have done it in between years, but that doesn't mean it doesn't happen.

    In terms of how to do it, try to cover as many rules as possible from the get go, be very clear in what is expected, what penalties will be, and what the goals are for the cap. When initiating it all, be ready to make some changes, and clearly outline how possible changes could be applied (timeline, voting system, etc.). Cap leagues fall apart easier than other leagues because rules are not strictly laid out, and GMs end up on opposite sides of debates where things weren't clear.
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    Default Re: Salary cap advice, upper and lower limit?

    I know of leagues that have gone to auction following a season with a pure draft, but not salary cap. There what usually happens is auction values are set by prior years' production.

    If you were going to try and implement this, you'll need to see what everyone's cap situation is right now, and figure out how to deal with keepers and the max so that teams that would be crippled by being over the max or are too close to the cap can get under. Might be wise to start with a max amount of salary that you can keep, and go from there.
    10 team Head-to-head true dynasty. Roster 33, draft 2, cut down before season. Start 1 G, 1 backup G, 6 D, 12 F arranged in 4 lines of 3. Only categories that matter are Goals, Assists, Save% with a shutout bonus. Having NHL teammates helps.

    G: Bobrovsky
    Backup G: F Andersen
    D: Ekblad, Yandle, Carlson, DeAngelo, Letang, Makar
    F1: Couturier, Giroux, Voracek
    F2: Schiefele, Wheeler, MacKinnon
    F3: Stamkos, Point, JT Miller
    F4: Bertuzzi, Tavares, Seguin

    Bench:
    G:
    D: Barrie, M Reilly, Heiskanen, Klingberg, Morissey, Weegar
    F: Bailey, Benn, Guentzel, Johnsson, Labanc, Mikheyev, Necas
    Reserve: Datsyuk

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    Default Re: Salary cap advice, upper and lower limit?

    Quote Originally Posted by Eskimo Brother View Post
    In terms of how to do it, try to cover as many rules as possible from the get go, be very clear in what is expected, what penalties will be, and what the goals are for the cap.
    Can you give some examples regarding penalties?

    Quote Originally Posted by stevegamer View Post
    If you were going to try and implement this, you'll need to see what everyone's cap situation is right now, and figure out how to deal with keepers and the max so that teams that would be crippled by being over the max or are too close to the cap can get under. Might be wise to start with a max amount of salary that you can keep, and go from there.
    The cap of all teams are:
    131M$
    125M$
    120M$
    116M$
    111M$
    110M$
    103M$
    99M$
    92M$
    85M$

    I have an idea that we can begin with a higher cap the first year then lower it the following season. Everyone is on to this and are willing to cut players from their teams.

    Is this a bad idea? The only problem I can see is that the top teams must cut players (but as I said, they are on to it), but is there anything else that could go bad doing this?

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    Default Re: Salary cap advice, upper and lower limit?

    Quote Originally Posted by chilledhobbit View Post
    Can you give some examples regarding penalties?


    The cap of all teams are:
    131M$
    125M$
    120M$
    116M$
    111M$
    110M$
    103M$
    99M$
    92M$
    85M$

    I have an idea that we can begin with a higher cap the first year then lower it the following season. Everyone is on to this and are willing to cut players from their teams.

    Is this a bad idea? The only problem I can see is that the top teams must cut players (but as I said, they are on to it), but is there anything else that could go bad doing this?
    I like the softer cap implementation. Makes sense to start it a little higher and then move it down for the next year. Gives an adjustment period.

    As for penalties, generally your stats shouldn't be counted as long as you're over the cap, but for obvious circumvention then the loss of draft picks is pretty standard. Repeating offenses means higher draft picks.

    What platform are you using? Yahoo, Fantrax, or other?
    Capped writer for DobberHockey. Find the latest articles here: https://dobberhockey.com/category/hockey-home/capped/
    (No I don't have a hockey problem...)

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    Default Re: Salary cap advice, upper and lower limit?

    We are using Fantrax.

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    Default Re: Salary cap advice, upper and lower limit?

    Maybe I'm just a newb but I don't understand why you need a lower limit? Our league uses a 30 man roster, 8 teams, with 11 players dressed each week. Our dressed players have to be at or less than 75% of the real NHL cap - so guys sitting on the bench don't affect your cap. This means there's a few guys who go undrafted - Toews, Doughty, Panarin (although I feel he'll get picked up in this next draft), Tavares.

    With this style you really don't need any penalties for going over the cap because your weekly roster would be invalid.

    A % of the cap is useful because it automatically adjusts for real cap increases. If you choose say $x million cap at some point you're going to have to change that as salaries increase and if it's vote based it's going to favour the GMs who have the more expensive players.

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    Default Re: Salary cap advice, upper and lower limit?

    Quote Originally Posted by dura_mater View Post
    Maybe I'm just a newb but I don't understand why you need a lower limit? Our league uses a 30 man roster, 8 teams, with 11 players dressed each week. Our dressed players have to be at or less than 75% of the real NHL cap - so guys sitting on the bench don't affect your cap. This means there's a few guys who go undrafted - Toews, Doughty, Panarin (although I feel he'll get picked up in this next draft), Tavares.

    With this style you really don't need any penalties for going over the cap because your weekly roster would be invalid.

    A % of the cap is useful because it automatically adjusts for real cap increases. If you choose say $x million cap at some point you're going to have to change that as salaries increase and if it's vote based it's going to favour the GMs who have the more expensive players.
    We pretty much covered that the lower limit is needed only in the real world where sports teams make tons of money, owners cry poor saying they lose money (paper losses) while pocketing lots of money (real cash profits), and they try and skimp on expenses.

    In auction leagues I've seen minimums because teams can pull some stuff to manipulate having excess unused salary dollars to trade to other teams so they can then exceed the cap for one year, but that's really rare.
    10 team Head-to-head true dynasty. Roster 33, draft 2, cut down before season. Start 1 G, 1 backup G, 6 D, 12 F arranged in 4 lines of 3. Only categories that matter are Goals, Assists, Save% with a shutout bonus. Having NHL teammates helps.

    G: Bobrovsky
    Backup G: F Andersen
    D: Ekblad, Yandle, Carlson, DeAngelo, Letang, Makar
    F1: Couturier, Giroux, Voracek
    F2: Schiefele, Wheeler, MacKinnon
    F3: Stamkos, Point, JT Miller
    F4: Bertuzzi, Tavares, Seguin

    Bench:
    G:
    D: Barrie, M Reilly, Heiskanen, Klingberg, Morissey, Weegar
    F: Bailey, Benn, Guentzel, Johnsson, Labanc, Mikheyev, Necas
    Reserve: Datsyuk

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