Kassian v. M. Tkachuk

[LawMan]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=owDK0bqIFP4

I'm trying to get some neutral, informed opinions on this situation. For the unaware Matthew Tkachuk took 2-3 good runs at Kassian on Saturday night. The 3rd one is in the clip above, after being hit hard Kassian gets up and lays a beating on Tkachuk, then pulls him up and beats him some more...

Kassian was given a double-minor penalty for roughing, Tkachuk was not assessed a penalty. Kassian also has a hearing with the NHL today (or tomorrow?)

Several former players have come out in defence of Kassian saying that after Tkachuk ran him several times he was obligated to fight Kassian, and that the hits were dirty. Some media are saying that there is no longer room in the NHL for fighting an unwilling combatant like Kassian did to Tkachuk.

Which player is in the right and which is in the wrong here?

[Axeman33]

I was wondering when this was coming.

[DocMcPuffin]

Nobody has to fight anyone after a clean hit. All 3 were clean in my opinion but that's up for debate. I think the penalty was justified but I don't think there should be any further discipline. Luckily for the Flames, if Kassian is playing next game, he's dumb enough to go out and intentionally try to hurt someone so he can give us another 2 points.

[jdreed3184]

I don't put too much stock into "unsaid" rules.

Tkachuck landed 3 clean hits against the Oilers big man for a reason: take his focus off the game and enjoy the fruits of that accomplishment. As long as you achieve this goal through clean hits, I'm good.

I think Kassian is a moron and didn't have the discipline to stay on his game.

[MZac]

This.

[Kofax]

If it's three clean hits, then I'm with the rest of you above, but the one below is the hit that I thought was questionable. He comes in legally, but Kassian is in a vulnerable position, and you can see his head snap once it is landed. Back in the day this was a fine hit, but I thought this was the type of hit that the NHL was trying to eliminate from the game, so I'm confused as to why Kassian ends up with a hearing here but Tkachuk doesn't. Also, Kassian looks a little dazed after this one, and I'm surprised the concussion spotters didn't step in here.



Ferraro adds to that as well:

On Tkachuk hits v Kassian. I’m serious here. Aren’t these the same hits Raffi Torres used to throw that the league eventually said were penalties? Any hit from above goal line to player coming from below. #thenandnow

Kassian was run 3 times in this game, so he maybe needs to consider the way he's playing and keep his head up a little more. I also have no problem with Kassian going after Tkachuk either, as if a guy is coming at you that hard trying to hurt you 3 times, you should be standing up for yourself.

This probably is not much of a conversation if it's not Tkachuk, but he has a history of taking cheap shots and playing on the line, so it is magnified. I don't like having to answer for a good hit with a fight, but Tkachuk knew what he was doing targeting a guy like Kassian with big hits 3 times, so he would have known it was coming. That was likely his intention to draw him into something he had no intention of answering for so I'm not surprised he turtled, but I don't like it either.

[doulos]

I'm an Oiler fan so tough to give a clear answer without coming off as biased. I've never liked Kassian and booed him live when he played his first game as an Oiler. I do appreciate that he's cleaned things up a bit, but from what I can tell he doesn't mind rough play, and finds it a fun part of the game. He's also up there for someone who has historically been one of the dirtiest players in the league - so to see him get a taste of his own medicine is kind of nice to be honest.

My own take is that 2 of the 3 hits were just fine, but the hit shown earlier in this thread was exactly the kind of thread that the league seems to have wanted to get out of the game. They didn't call the hit and Kassian overreacted to the next hit out there since he likely felt like the refs were not interested in dealing with it themselves.

Most of the ex-NHL players who have chimed in on this situation seem to also point out the ugly hit by Tkachuk earlier, and these are the guys who know best in my opinion. Tkachuk very clearly has a reputation for being dirty, and not answering for his action, and frankly, good for him and the Flames. The league and the NHLPA have shown no interest in fixing this issue and have basically given him free rein to keep doing it - and it resulted in a big powerplay and win for his team, so it got the exact result he and his teammates wanted.

Unless other teams take matters into their own hands and either start targetting the Flames players, or start regularly taking Tkachuk to task for these things, it will never change. And, so, it will probably never change because there will be some sort of token fight at the start of the next game and everyone will move on until Tkachuk does it again (which he will, because why wouldn't he - it works!)

I think Kassian lost his cool (and in some ways I can't blame him - and I'd say most players from around the league are probably happy for what he did) and cost his team a goal and a potential win. I don't think he deserves any extra discipline though.

[MZac]

I voted no suspension for either. One hit was debatably late (all were debatably dangerous) and the Oilers lost out on potentially 2 points because of Kassian's reaction. No one appeared to be seriously injured (this debatably shouldn't matter but it seems to when it comes to suspensions and real life). This seems to be a reasonable outcome. Watch for the ref's to be all over these teams on January 29th.

I wonder what Don's take will be on Hockey Ni... Nevermind..


GettyImages-1193186544-e1578814075236-1024x683.jpg
#Tkurtle

[Dennis]

It should definitely be noted that Lindholm's game-winning goal came during the second of Kassian's roughing minors. Unsaid rule #1 is don't %!&* your team over.

[McDeichel]

Terrible reffing strikes again! The first was so not legal, that was a hit to the head. If that was a star player like McDavid, Crosby, etc. then Tkachuk would be getting a call from player safety 100%! Had the ref called even a 2 minute penalty on the first one (which was totally illegal), then this doesn’t happen. The other hits were Kassian was just in a bad spot with Tkachuk charging at him and he got rocked. Kassian then lost his cool, filled that turtling ***** in and got a suspension that I think he deserved. Tkachuk should get something for the first hit though. Can’t wait for January 29th!

[rataylor22]

My comments:

- I can see lots of arguments how the "first" Tkachuk hit was dirty and illegal (the one shown in Kofax's post), but I can't possibly imagine how anyone can call it a hit to the head. #ScreenshotLyfe can be misleading, but the screengrab literally shows Tkachuk's hip on Kassian's shoulder and Kassian's head whipping forward. His head literally couldn't whip like that if it was contacted. Charging sure, but there's no logical argument to make that it was a hit to the head.

- "The code" is BS and always has been. Players don't need to fight after clean hits, players don't need to fight after big hits, and lots of the time players don't fight (and nobody tries to fight them) after dirty hits. Just like nuclear deterrents are BS. Matt Cooke ended Marc Savard's career 10 feet from Milan Lucic.

- Call that a "turtle" if you want, but it sure doesn't make a hell of a lot of sense for a player like Tkachuk to ever fight a player like Kassian, it certainly doesn't make sense to wipe out a PP in a 3-3 game, and there wasn't much chance to even fight. Should Tkachuk have been "ready" to fight? Maybe, but fact is Kassian jumped him from behind and grabbed the back of his pads/jersey. That's an illegal tackle in football for a reason. There's basically nothing you can do to control yourself when someone has you firmly held like that.

- The end result of this probably ultimately ends with someone on the Flames getting hurt and someone on the Oilers getting suspended, followed by someone on the Oilers getting hurt and someone on the Flames getting suspended. 3 meetings in 6 games can be a recipe for disaster at the best of times.

- I have no opinion on who deserves a suspension and how long, because it's just a random dartboard anyways.

[ericdaoust]

I don't put too much stock into "unsaid" rules.

There are no "unsaid" rules. They are made up on the fly for convenience.

[tweetdrivr]

“Just like nuclear deterrents are BS.”
WTF. Do you mean the theory of nuclear deterrence is BS? Not sure where the heck that was going...

[2014olympicgold]

I'm ok with what happened on the ice and the results off the ice.

Tkachuk was running around targetting Kassian. Hits were legal to a point, the last one can be debated on charging. But Kassian wouldn't have known that at the time.

If you're going to hit a guy like Kassian who they already have history together constantly, you should expect him to try and fight you.

Neal, the ex-teammate sided with Kassian (no surprise tho), and Draisaitl said he'd just change instantly if Tkachuk comes on the ice during the 3-on-3 All-Star tournament. With Doughty's obvious hate towards Tkachuk too, this kids gaining a lot of negative buzz around him on the ice but top players. He's a great player, and he does a lot off the ice for kids and such, but seems like there's a lot of stuff around him on the ice.

Kassian suspended 2 games, 1st game back is Jan29th vs Calgary, 2nd game is Feb1st @ Calgary... Oh my lerd this will be fun.

[Daydream Nation]

I'm ok with what happened on the ice and the results off the ice.

Tkachuk was running around targetting Kassian. Hits were legal to a point, the last one can be debated on charging. But Kassian wouldn't have known that at the time.

If you're going to hit a guy like Kassian who they already have history together constantly, you should expect him to try and fight you.

Neal, the ex-teammate sided with Kassian (no surprise tho), and Draisaitl said he'd just change instantly if Tkachuk comes on the ice during the 3-on-3 All-Star tournament. With Doughty's obvious hate towards Tkachuk too, this kids gaining a lot of negative buzz around him on the ice but top players. He's a great player, and he does a lot off the ice for kids and such, but seems like there's a lot of stuff around him on the ice.

Kassian suspended 2 games, 1st game back is Jan29th vs Calgary, 2nd game is Feb1st @ Calgary... Oh my lerd this will be fun.

Good post. I agree.

While it worked out in Calgary's favor it definitely wasn't a good look for Tkachuk.