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Thread: Getting grilled for trade

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    Default Getting grilled for trade

    Standard cats(g,a,ppp,fow,pim,hit,shot,blocked shot). Last place looking to future .
    I traded kucherov, hall, klingberg, couturier, and rakell for eichel, Barrie, and huberdeau. I couldn't keep ruskell kling couturier or rakell anyways
    Keepers are now eichel, huberdeau, draisatl, panarin, teraveinen, rantenen,chabot,heiskanen,gaudreau,barkov, G hart, G markstrom. So effectively kuch/hall for eichel/huberdeua. Seems like a better tandem with added Fow for me right?

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    Default Re: Getting grilled for trade

    I would take Kuck over Eichel, Hall and Hubs are pretty similar, Klingberg over Barrie, and then you gave up extra good pieces to make it happen? I can see why some people are getting on you about it.
    (Also I would have kept Couturier over Teravainen).
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    Default Re: Getting grilled for trade

    I really like this trade for a team looking towards future championships
    Not right now, but 2+ years from now:
    Eichel > Kucherov
    Huberdeau > Hall
    (and the others, as you say, you can't keep)

    With the FOW in play, both from Eichel & some from Huberdau, I think this is a win... especially since you have a very young team.

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    Default Re: Getting grilled for trade

    Quote Originally Posted by Pengwin7 View Post
    I really like this trade for a team looking towards future championships
    Not right now, but 2+ years from now:
    Eichel > Kucherov
    Huberdeau > Hall
    (and the others, as you say, you can't keep)

    With the FOW in play, both from Eichel & some from Huberdau, I think this is a win... especially since you have a very young team.
    It's possible it is a win two+ years from now, but right now, for how much was shipped out, I think there could have been a better return - depends on the league though, I could be wrong there.
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    Default Re: Getting grilled for trade

    First of all, the trade on its own:

    Kucherov/Hall/Klingberg/Couturier/Rakell for Eichel/Barrie/Huberdeau

    Is absolutely brutal and you are right to get grilled on that one. It's terrible. I don't care if there's some guys you can't keep there, you need to get more back, whether that's in the form of picks for next year, or prospects, you needed to do better than this. It is really really really bad.

    Second, the keeper implications.

    Kucherov > Eichel
    Hall >= Huberdeau

    This is less terrible as you do get younger, but given the fact that you added all those other assets, you needed to win this portion of the trade by more of a margin then just youth. Again, you should have received additional picks for next year at the least. You sold low on both Kucherov and Hall and bought high on both Eichel and Huberdeau.

    The grilling, in this case, is well deserved.

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    Default Re: Getting grilled for trade

    quite frankly you just gave up too many assets here. I get the method in your madness but if you had held on to one of those other assets (like say Couturier) then you'd have him for a potential future trade or keep plus you would be less likely to be grilled like you are.
    having said that though, I agree that this is a good trade for a couple yrs down the road

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    Default Re: Getting grilled for trade

    Quote Originally Posted by Eskimo Brother View Post
    I think there could have been a better return - depends on the league though
    What we see is that it is a Keep 12... and there's FOW in play.
    Most teams don't even want to talk about moving out guys like Eichel & Huberdeau unless the return is a HUGE improvement for the one year.

    Also, based on the quality of players discussed... I'm assuming this is an 8 or 10-team league.
    If it's a 12+ team league... yeah... probably too much given for the "get".

    (I do understand that other competing teams won't like the massive return for one team... PQMC feels like this to me sometimes. It's the major downside to "partial/limited keeper" leagues. So the "grilled", via non-trading teams, is fully understood!)

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    Default Re: Getting grilled for trade

    Quote Originally Posted by Pengwin7 View Post
    What we see is that it is a Keep 12... and there's FOW in play.
    Most teams don't even want to talk about moving out guys like Eichel & Huberdeau unless the return is a HUGE improvement for the one year.

    Also, based on the quality of players discussed... I'm assuming this is an 8 or 10-team league.
    If it's a 12+ team league... yeah... probably too much given for the "get".

    (I do understand that other competing teams won't like the massive return for one team... PQMC feels like this to me sometimes. It's the major downside to "partial/limited keeper" leagues. So the "grilled", via non-trading teams, is fully understood!)
    I guess I'm assuming that the FOWs don't come into play that much. Yes Eichel is pretty solid, but so are most decent Cs, so if it's a shallower league with a few slots for each position (not just 6-9 F slots) then not a big avantage. Hubs hasn't taken a faceoff in about a month. Not since Barkov was back to full health from his ailment.
    And if it is such a shallow league, turnaround to contending should only be a year or two at most.
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    Default Re: Getting grilled for trade

    ^Good points. Though a lot of people hate trading their better players in limited keepers.
    We don't really know what this set of GMs is like for trading.

    Usually when I see really unbalanced trades it's one of three reasons:
    a) The guy getting the lesser end doesn't feel like he can get players he likes anywhere else
    b) The guy getting the lesser end really ADORES the players he IS getting... and doesn't care to evaluate the quality he's is giving away
    c) Season is over and might as well buddy-trade my non-keepers to team in league I wouldn't mind seeing win.

    This one seems like a) & b)... unless other GMs familar with relationships can hint at c).

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    Default Re: Getting grilled for trade

    Yeah, it feels like a case of a) that just got tangled up in a bunch of names. I can definitely understand wanting to have Eichel. I turned down a deal two years ago in the PQMC of Kuch and Lindholm for Eichel and a scrub. Maybe one I should have taken in hindsight haha.
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    Default Re: Getting grilled for trade

    Owning Eichel as a center who can put up 100pts and 700-800FW is such a benefit.

    Players in 2018-19 who got 80+pts and 700+FW

    Toews - 81pts, 1059FW
    Barkov - 96pts 1041FW
    Crosby - 100pts, 1012FW
    Tavares - 88pts, 832FW
    Scheifele - 84pts, 803FW

    That's it. Bergeron would have been there without injuries.

    This yr, guys that are on pace for 80+pts and 700+FW
    Eichel - 109.88pts, 797.0FW
    Barkov - 97.58pts, 807.7FW
    Bergeron - 84.36pts, 884.3FW

    Right now, you can argue Eichel is 2nd most valuable Center only player this yr when you consider FW.
    McDavid - 51pts, 129FW - 139.4pts, 352.6FW
    Eichel - 39pts, 282FW - 109.88pts, 797FW
    MacKinnon - 44pts, 155FW - 128.74pts, 454.28FW
    12 Team, H2H, Keep 6 (in Bold)
    G, A, Pts, PPP, FW, SOG, Hits, Blocks
    W, Saves, S%, GAA, Game Started
    2C, 2LW, 2RW, 4D, 1Util, 2G, 5BN, 2IR, 1IR+, 1NA

    C: Horvat, Trocheck
    LW: J. Robertson, Byfield (C), Guenther
    RW: Pavelski (C), Giroux (C), Svechnikov (LW)
    D: Fox, Makar, Bouchard, Morrissey, Gudas
    Util: Meier (LW, RW)
    G: Oettinger, Georgiev, Samsonov, Woll


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    Default Re: Getting grilled for trade

    Quote Originally Posted by 2014olympicgold View Post
    Owning Eichel as a center who can put up 100pts and 700-800FW is such a benefit.

    Players in 2018-19 who got 80+pts and 700+FW

    Toews - 81pts, 1059FW
    Barkov - 96pts 1041FW
    Crosby - 100pts, 1012FW
    Tavares - 88pts, 832FW
    Scheifele - 84pts, 803FW

    That's it. Bergeron would have been there without injuries.

    This yr, guys that are on pace for 80+pts and 700+FW
    Eichel - 109.88pts, 797.0FW
    Barkov - 97.58pts, 807.7FW
    Bergeron - 84.36pts, 884.3FW

    Right now, you can argue Eichel is 2nd most valuable Center only player this yr when you consider FW.
    McDavid - 51pts, 129FW - 139.4pts, 352.6FW
    Eichel - 39pts, 282FW - 109.88pts, 797FW
    MacKinnon - 44pts, 155FW - 128.74pts, 454.28FW
    Fair enough

    Well if we decide Eichel > Kuch, I still think it was more than I would pay, but it makes it more even anyways.
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    Default Re: Getting grilled for trade

    Quote Originally Posted by Eskimo Brother View Post
    Fair enough

    Well if we decide Eichel > Kuch, I still think it was more than I would pay, but it makes it more even anyways.
    If someone offered me Eichel for Kuch...I don't know if I would do 1for1, I'm like 50/50, but if I got a little sweetener out of it, I would.

    But, it's def easier to manage a team with a RW keeper vs a C keeper. So there's that aspect too.

    UMMMM, if I'm resetting my team, I would take Kucherov prolly. This trade isn't a trade you rip a part, it's pretty decent from your aspect.
    12 Team, H2H, Keep 6 (in Bold)
    G, A, Pts, PPP, FW, SOG, Hits, Blocks
    W, Saves, S%, GAA, Game Started
    2C, 2LW, 2RW, 4D, 1Util, 2G, 5BN, 2IR, 1IR+, 1NA

    C: Horvat, Trocheck
    LW: J. Robertson, Byfield (C), Guenther
    RW: Pavelski (C), Giroux (C), Svechnikov (LW)
    D: Fox, Makar, Bouchard, Morrissey, Gudas
    Util: Meier (LW, RW)
    G: Oettinger, Georgiev, Samsonov, Woll


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    Default Re: Getting grilled for trade

    I just don't think it ends up being that close when you look at the whole deal.

    I'm ok with the keeper exchange when it comes down to it. I'm not sure I would have done it, but I get the arguments there. I think we're all on board that Kucherov/Hall for Eichel/Huberdeau can go either way and can be argued for each team.

    Where I differ is that I don't think it should cost Klingberg/Couturier/Rakell for Barrie to make up the perceived gap in this case which is FOW. If you want to compete, you need to make use of your assets and get something else added in there. Given it's a bit of a rebuild (I like the keeper list either way, it's decent) I think picks are the ideal way to go here.

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    Default Re: Getting grilled for trade

    Quote Originally Posted by bjs04f View Post
    I couldn't keep ruskell kling couturier or rakell anyways
    Just because you couldn't keep them doesn't mean they should be given away for free...they still have value. The other managers are probably slightly annoyed because they would've given you assets or picks for them. kuch/hall for eichel/huberdeau is fine, but you shouldn't have added anything else...
    Yahoo League #1 - H2H Keep 21
    [F] Tkachuk, Barkov, A Svechnikov, Kaprizov, DeBrincat, Scheifele, RNH, Suzuki, Laine, Kakko, Cozens
    [D] Makar, Hughes, Nurse, Chabot, Byram
    [G] Hart, Shesterkin, Lehner, Helle

    Yahoo League #2 - H2H Keep 22
    [F] MacKinnon, Guentzel, DeBrincat, EP40, Gaudreau, Barzal, Hughes, Laine, Garland, Norris, Batherson, Farabee
    [D] Hedman, MacAvoy, Nurse, Chabot, Pionk, Byram
    [G] Nedeljkovic, Smith, Gustavsson, Murray

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