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Thread: Canadian Election

  1. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by doulos View Post
    It will never happen, and nor should it. There is nothing feasible about the proposal for Alberta to separate. If the concerns of a separatist are focused on getting product out of their landlocked country and feeling stymied as part of Canada, how do they think that's going to get any better if they actually separate. It's absurd. Or maybe they think they will get some sort of sweet deal if they join the USA...lol.

    EDIT: Just wanted to add that there already is an Alberta Independence Party who ran candidates in this year's Provincial Election. There was also Derek Fildebrandt's Freedom Conservative Party, which was similar in many ways. The former recieved 0.71% of the popular vote, and the latter 0.52% of the popular vote. To put that into perspective, even that hated Alberta Green party got 0.41% of the popular vote. They are just not a factor at all.
    Does Eastern Canada rely on Western Canada for any resources? That would need to be clearly determine if the Western Provinces were to separate.

    And I think the only way to make it happen is if BC is on board.
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  2. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hooker View Post
    I agree, I don't think it will ever happen. Nor would I like it to.
    Their point being that they are being "fleeced" on transfer payments, forced into a carbon tax to heat their homes, their Beef industry is under attack under the guise of climate change, their forest industry is being troubled by the infestation from BC, etc...How much worse does it have to get?
    All their complaints are falling on deaf ears. Ontario has their head in the ground and Quebec has made it abundantly clear that they don't want "dirty Alberta oil"...but keep the $ coming.
    Well since most of those concerns are based on faulty reasoning or outright lies, maybe they should take a look in the mirror and see why their complaints fall on deaf ears.

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    Quote Originally Posted by PenguinHunter View Post
    Does Eastern Canada rely on Western Canada for any resources? That would need to be clearly determine if the Western Provinces were to separate.

    And I think the only way to make it happen is if BC is on board.
    Much of BC is sick and tired of Alberta's whining as well.

  3. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by doulos View Post
    Well since most of those concerns are based on faulty reasoning or outright lies, maybe they should take a look in the mirror and see why their complaints fall on deaf ears.

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    Much of BC is sick and tired of Alberta's whining as well.
    Not sure what you mean by those concerns?
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  4. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by PenguinHunter View Post
    Not sure what you mean by those concerns?
    Was a reply to someone else. Sorry, I fixed the post.

  5. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by doulos View Post
    Well since most of those concerns are based on faulty reasoning or outright lies, maybe they should take a look in the mirror and see why their complaints fall on deaf ears.

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    Much of BC is sick and tired of Alberta's whining as well.
    Don't worry, much of left leaning Alberta are sick of the whining, faux anger, and 'whoa is us attitude' of the small c and big C conservatives. The willful ignorance and delusional finger pointing has been going on for decades but will slowly die out with baby-boomers.

  6. #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by lobo1969 View Post
    Don't worry, much of left leaning Alberta are sick of the whining, faux anger, and 'whoa is us attitude' of the small c and big C conservatives. The willful ignorance and delusional finger pointing has been going on for decades but will slowly die out with baby-boomers.
    I'm not convinced it will, but I guess we will see.

  7. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by doulos View Post
    It will never happen, and nor should it. There is nothing feasible about the proposal for Alberta to separate. If the concerns of a separatist are focused on getting product out of their landlocked country and feeling stymied as part of Canada, how do they think that's going to get any better if they actually separate. It's absurd. Or maybe they think they will get some sort of sweet deal if they join the USA...lol.
    Whats absurd is that you think a land mass the size of Canada is functionally being governed correctly and that it would be worse with separation. It doesn't really have anything to do with landlocked resources. It's about the fact that Manitoba west and Ontario east are simply different countries, with different people, cultures, and interests. There's a reason a landmass the size of Europe has 44 countries. The US should split as well.

    It wont happen, so the point is mute, but to pretend like things would be worse if it did happen is the only truly absurd thing in this thread.

  8. #68
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    Quote Originally Posted by doulos View Post
    Much of BC is sick and tired of Alberta's whining as well.
    Well. By population maybe, because it's only the little pocket called Vancouver.

  9. #69
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    Quote Originally Posted by rataylor22 View Post
    Whats absurd is that you think a land mass the size of Canada is functionally being governed correctly and that it would be worse with separation. It doesn't really have anything to do with landlocked resources. It's about the fact that Manitoba west and Ontario east are simply different countries, with different people, cultures, and interests. There's a reason a landmass the size of Europe has 44 countries. The US should split as well.

    It wont happen, so the point is mute, but to pretend like things would be worse if it did happen is the only truly absurd thing in this thread.
    No country on the planet is being governed perfectly. But yes, it would be astronomically worse if separation happened in my opinion.

    Getting resources to port, or through pipelines is a large reason why many Albertans are upset, and is why I qualified my statement with "If the concerns of a separatist are focused on getting product out of their landlocked country and feeling stymied as part of Canada".

    If it's merely for reasons of cultural differences, or whatever reasons you seem to imply then I'm not sure what to say. I have a heck of a lot more in common with most Canadians than I think people would give credit for. Europe is a weird example because they have a population of 3/4 of a billion people. It's apple to oranges.

    Yes, being part of a huge landmass, with a relatively low population, has it's challenges. But thinking that just divvying everything up into little chunks would be better is an odd statement. I honestly have never heard someone say that before. Just the technical issues of borders, trade etc would be astronomically more difficult in a setup like that. You've maybe given more thought to those issues, but at first glance it seems crazy.

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    Quote Originally Posted by rataylor22 View Post
    Well. By population maybe, because it's only the little pocket called Vancouver.
    Sure, that metric works for "most"

  10. #70
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    Separation isnt going to happen so why waste your time arguing about it.
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  11. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by Axeman33 View Post
    Separation isnt going to happen so why waste your time arguing about it.
    I was interested in why he thought that. Still don't get it, but figured he might have more information. Wasn't arguing.

  12. #72
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    Quote Originally Posted by doulos View Post
    Getting resources to port, or through pipelines is a large reason why many Albertans are upset, and is why I qualified my statement with "If the concerns of a separatist are focused on getting product out of their landlocked country and feeling stymied as part of Canada".
    Just on this point. Would international access be easier/better? Arguably no. Would it be worse? Probably not TBH. It's impossible to get anything built now, so it would either remain just as hard, or get easier. Consider that when someone has something you need, you have to make concessions to get it. Then consider that if Alberta was separating, would they go alone or would Saskatchewan and Manitoba go with them? Then consider if Sask and Man go with Alberta, can BC survive as a province completely cut off from the rest of the country or would the begrudgingly have to go to to protect their own interests? And then what happens with the territories? And then, in a new "WestCan" does BC have the ability/jurisdiction to block coastal access the way they do now? Who knows. In the hypothetical scenario, lot of moving parts in that one depending on how it goes.

    Quote Originally Posted by doulos View Post
    If it's merely for reasons of cultural differences, or whatever reasons you seem to imply then I'm not sure what to say. I have a heck of a lot more in common with most Canadians than I think people would give credit for. Europe is a weird example because they have a population of 3/4 of a billion people. It's apple to oranges.
    Lots of people have lots in common with lots of people. That doesn't really make a country. Sweden, Finland, Norway all have lots in common with Canada too, and lets not pretend like population is the reason they are separate countries. It's not like Europe slowly became separate countries as population grew.

    Quote Originally Posted by doulos View Post
    Yes, being part of a huge landmass, with a relatively low population, has it's challenges. But thinking that just divvying everything up into little chunks would be better is an odd statement. I honestly have never heard someone say that before. Just the technical issues of borders, trade etc would be astronomically more difficult in a setup like that. You've maybe given more thought to those issues, but at first glance it seems crazy.
    Well, it certainly would make it worse for some provinces (hence transfer payments).

    Quote Originally Posted by doulos View Post
    Sure, that metric works for "most"
    2.4 MM population of VGA, 5.0 MM population of BC. Just missed on most.

  13. #73
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    But again, separation decidedly won't happen so yes it's all moot. A fun thought exercise more than a serious proposal.

  14. #74
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    Interesting thoughts, thanks. I honestly think things are not as bad as political talking heads would have us believe. Even just stating that it's "impossible to get anything built now" seems to be untrue, and mostly an exaggeration in my mind.

    I think Canada is an extremely diverse country filled with mostly wonderful people, and it just takes hard work to keep it all running - just like any good relationship.

    I still maintain that over 51% of BC is tired of Alberta's temper tantrums, but really, there is no way to know for sure. You are correct that much of it is Vancouver and Vancouver Island.

  15. #75
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    It is funny that Vancouver and the Island of all places think anywhere else goes overboard on so called "temper tantrums".

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