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Thread: Am I crazy taking a goalie with my 2nd overall pick?

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    Default Am I crazy taking a goalie with my 2nd overall pick?

    Some context. Keeper league - We keep 5 and can never keep our 1st round pick (they re enter the draft - that's why Crosby, Ovechkin, Malkin, Stamkos are usually always available).

    Goalies are a premium in this league. Bobrovsky is available and finished as the 2nd overall goalie in our league last year just behind Vasy. Forwards available (assuming Ovechkin goes first) are Crosby, Stamkos Malkin. League settings and my keepers below.

    Assuming Ovi goes first.. do you take Bobrovsky and secure a goalie right away (I have none going in) or take Crosby?

    Keepers - Laine, Aho, Huberdeau, Kuznetsov, Hedman

    12 Teams - Yahoo H2H - Points

    Goals (G) 1
    Assists (A) 1
    Plus/Minus (+/-) 0.5
    Powerplay Goals (PPG) 1
    Powerplay Assists (PPA) 0.5
    Shorthanded Points (SHP) 1
    Game-Winning Goals (GWG) 1

    Goaltenders Stat Category Value
    Wins (W) 3
    Losses (L) -1
    Shutouts (SHO) 2

    C, C, LW, LW, RW, RW, D, D, D, Util, G, G, BN, BN, BN, BN

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    Default Re: Am I crazy taking a goalie with my 2nd overall pick?

    Goalies are voodoo, but with starting two goalies, I'd take Bobrovsky. Then you can hope to find a surprise goalie or mix and match starts with the other slot. The guys you list as other alternatives are undeniably good, but they're all past their peak seasons. If you said that McDavid, MacKinnon, etc. were the other choices, I'd go with the skater.

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    Default Re: Am I crazy taking a goalie with my 2nd overall pick?

    I mean.....if these are your keepers (Laine, Aho, Huberdeau, Kuznetsov, Hedman)....adding a Crosby should give you an amazing offense in a 12 team league.

    Is it a snake draft?

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    Default Re: Am I crazy taking a goalie with my 2nd overall pick?

    I went through this almost same question yesterday leading into my draft last evening with exception my pick was the 3rd pick and all my responses were a resounding NO. I was told to take one of the following skaters with the top 3 selections and I did just that. Kucherov, McDavid, or Mackinnon. I ended up with Nathan Mackinnon. I am going to give the exact same advice as I got yesterday as it led to me having my first ever draft and it was a very successful one.
    12 Team H2H League
    G: Braden Holtby-Was, Matt Murray- Pit, Devan Dubnyk- Min
    D: Victor Hedman- TB, Dougie Hamilton- Car, Josh Morrissey- Wpg, Charlie McAvoy- Bos, Rasmus Ristolainen- Buf
    W: Artemi Panarin- NYR, Vladimir Tarasenko- Stl, Viktor Arvidsson- Nsh, Ondrej Kase- Ana, Jesper Bratt- NJ
    C: Nathan MAckinnon- Col, William Karlsson- Veg, Matthew Barzal- NYI

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    Default Re: Am I crazy taking a goalie with my 2nd overall pick?

    It is a snake draft yep, that's really my issue haha. Crosby is a lock but a 40 win goalie would just blow it out of the park (even though goalies are unpredictable) - chances are by the time it gets back to me, I'll be looking at goalies like Lehner, Riitch, Dubnyk, Greiss. And I will need two of em

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    Default Re: Am I crazy taking a goalie with my 2nd overall pick?

    Quote Originally Posted by bluck View Post
    It is a snake draft yep, that's really my issue haha. Crosby is a lock but a 40 win goalie would just blow it out of the park (even though goalies are unpredictable) - chances are by the time it gets back to me, I'll be looking at goalies like Lehner, Riitch, Dubnyk, Greiss. And I will need two of em
    But what will the players look like coming back??? Just playing devil's advocate here.

    If you all keep 5 (x 12 = 60) + no 1st rounders are kept you're now looking at players in the 80s.

    Do you have an example of what last year looked like?

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    Default Re: Am I crazy taking a goalie with my 2nd overall pick?

    Quote Originally Posted by hockeyrobot View Post
    But what will the players look like coming back??? Just playing devil's advocate here.

    If you all keep 5 (x 12 = 60) + no 1st rounders are kept you're now looking at players in the 80s.

    Do you have an example of what last year looked like?
    Ahh I see yep here is what the 1st couple rounds looked like

    Round 1

    1. Alex Ovechkin
    2. Sidney Crosby
    3. Evgeni Malkin
    4. Steven Stamkos
    5. Anze Kopitar
    6. Sergei Bobrovsky
    7. Dustin Byfuglien
    8. Tuukka Rask
    9. Clayton Keller
    10. Jonathan Quick
    11. Martin Jones
    12. Logan Couture

    Round 2

    1. Dubnyk
    2. Barkov
    3. Backstrom
    4. Allen
    5. Bergeron
    6. Radulov
    7. Bishop
    8. E. Kane
    9. W. Karlsson
    10. Marchessault
    11. Ghost
    12. Dubois

    Round 3
    1. Seth Jones
    2. Huberdeau
    3. Monahan
    4. Letang
    5. Carlson
    6. Pacioretty
    7. Skinner
    8. Varlamov
    9. Dumba
    10. Reilly Smith
    11. Courturier
    12. Schenn

    An example of how goalies did last year with our scoring
    1. Vasy - 119
    2. Bobrovsky - 105
    3. Fleury - 100
    4. Jones - 95
    5. Andersen - 94
    6. Price - 89
    7. Holtby - 83
    8. Hellebuyck - 83
    9. Murray - 81
    10. Bishop - 80
    11. Rinne - 79
    12. Binnington - 77
    13. Rask - 76
    14. Rittch - 74
    15. Keumper - 71
    16. Dubnyk - 69
    17. Greiss 65
    18. Halak - 65
    19. Markstrom - 63
    20. Mrazak - 63

    Forwards
    1. Kucherov - 179
    2. McDavid - 149.50
    3. Marchand - 145.50
    4. Point - 140
    5. MacKinnon - 139.50
    6. Kane - 137.50
    7. Stamkos - 137.50
    8. Drai - 136.50
    9. Crosby - 134.50
    10. Guadreau - 132.50
    11. Marner - 125
    12. Barkov - 122.50
    13. Rantanen - 122
    14. Aho - 121
    15. Ovechkin - 120.50
    16. Tavares - 120
    17. Lindholm - 119.50
    18. Bergeron- 118.50
    19. Burns - 118
    20. Scheifele - 114

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    Default Re: Am I crazy taking a goalie with my 2nd overall pick?

    With that scoring example, I want to know what goalies are unavaialable to be drafted. If you can get a slightly lesser goalie in round 2, that may be more worthwhile, as they are keepable.

    Since this is a keep 6, with 1st round talent always going back in, taking a goalie 1st isn't a problem, if you can load up your keepers as skaters.
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    Default Re: Am I crazy taking a goalie with my 2nd overall pick?

    Quote Originally Posted by RedRocker View Post
    I went through this almost same question yesterday leading into my draft last evening with exception my pick was the 3rd pick and all my responses were a resounding NO. I was told to take one of the following skaters with the top 3 selections and I did just that. Kucherov, McDavid, or Mackinnon. I ended up with Nathan Mackinnon. I am going to give the exact same advice as I got yesterday as it led to me having my first ever draft and it was a very successful one.
    The key difference is that yours was a initial dynasty draft and this is an established keeper with 6 players. Note the lack of Kucherov, MacKinnon, and Mcdavid among the draftable options in round 1, so the quality of what's available is very watered down versus your situation.
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    Default Re: Am I crazy taking a goalie with my 2nd overall pick?

    Quote Originally Posted by stevegamer View Post
    With that scoring example, I want to know what goalies are unavaialable to be drafted. If you can get a slightly lesser goalie in round 2, that may be more worthwhile, as they are keepable.

    Since this is a keep 6, with 1st round talent always going back in, taking a goalie 1st isn't a problem, if you can load up your keepers as skaters.
    We haven't submitted our final keepers yet but based on the last few years I can all but guarantee that the top 13 goalies on that list will not be available by my second pick. With starting 2 goalies and 12 teams, thats 24 goalies and you can see the massive drop off after #13. That's why people see them as a premium. We also have moves limited to 45 for the year (including playoffs) so this makes it very hard to even stream goalies. Just a side note we keep 5 players, not 6.

    Cheers!

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    Default Re: Am I crazy taking a goalie with my 2nd overall pick?

    I’d be happy taking Crosby and then getting like Dubnyk in the 2nd. Is Bishop there? Def forward though
    18 Team H2H Dynasty 9x4 cat. Roster 30 + 2 NA, 4 DL. 4C,4LW,4RW,6D,1G,11BN
    Scoring cats are G, A, +\-, PIM, PPP, SHP, FW, HIT, BLK
    W, GAA, SV%, SHO.
    C: Crosby, Horvat, , E. Lindholm (RW), Aho, W. Johnston (RW), Bjugstad,
    LW: Marchand, J. Benn, E. Kane, Fiala, Barbashev (C), Schwartz (C), Namestikov (C)
    RW: M. Tkachuk (LW), JT Miller (C), Batherson, Hyman (LW), Frederic (C), Palmieri
    D: J. Carlson, Josi, Doughty, Pietrangelo, Seider, Gudas, Ekman-Larsson,
    G: Vasilievkiy, Shesterkin, Husso
    NA: Mukhamadullin (D), I. Rosen (RW), D. .Levi (G)
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    Default Re: Am I crazy taking a goalie with my 2nd overall pick?

    What I'd want to know is the fpts of the top 20 goalies available, and the fantasy points of the top 25 skaters available. My guess is that Bob + about the 12th or 15th forward is going to net you more fantasy points than Crosby + the 12th or 15th goalie available. Points above replacement!
    Yahoo 12-team H2H partial keeper league (keep 7 vets + 3 prospects (p = skater <201 gp; goalie < 101gp))

    G,A,P,PIM,+/-,PPP,SOG,FW,hits, blocks, W,GAA,SV%,Saves
    Start 3/3/3/5/2

    C: Kopitar, P. Suter, Carlsson (p), Lundell (p), Norris
    LW: B. Tkachuk, Stutzle (c), Colton (c), Ehlers
    RW: Rantanen, Caufield (lw), Svechnikov (lw), Foegele (lw)
    D: Dahlin, Andersson, Chychrun, Montour, Sanheim, Matheson, Faber (p)
    G: Talbot, Forsberg, Daws (p), Wolf (p, NA)
    IR: Fantilli, Sergachev, Jeannot, Ingram
    NA: Levi

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    Default Re: Am I crazy taking a goalie with my 2nd overall pick?

    Quote Originally Posted by Locke View Post
    What I'd want to know is the fpts of the top 20 goalies available, and the fantasy points of the top 25 skaters available. My guess is that Bob + about the 12th or 15th forward is going to net you more fantasy points than Crosby + the 12th or 15th goalie available. Points above replacement!
    This actually is a great way to look at it I think! Next 5 forwards all finished around 112-115 points, I would certainly be able to grab someone in that range, well 2 players since i'd have my 3rd as well. So I if i go Goalie Fwd, Fwd, I should be okay.

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    Default Re: Am I crazy taking a goalie with my 2nd overall pick?

    I think you answered your question somewhat in your original post. You said that Goalies are at a premium in your league and the format. Right there to me sends off flashing lights and sirens and says pick one right when you can before they are gone.
    MD Rink Rats( 14 Team Keeper H2H Yahoo League)
    ​G,A,PIM, PPP, HIT, BLK/ W, GAA, SV%, SHO

    D: K. Yandle- Fla, J. Muzzin- Tor, S. Gostisbehere- Phi, R. Pulock-NYI, S. Girard- Col, T.J. Brodie- Cgy, B. Pesce- Car
    C: T. Seguin- Dal, M. Scheifele- Wpg, E. Pettersson- Van, D. Larkin- Det, D. Stepan- Ari
    RW: V. Tarasenko- Stl, P. Kessel- Ari, S. Reinhart- Buf(C), E. Lindhom- Cgy(C), T. Toffoli-LA, B. Connolly- Fla(LW), D. Kahun-Pit(LW)
    LW: T. Hall- NJ, A. DeBrincat- Chi(RW), J. Skinner- Buf(C), T. Tatar- Mon(RW), A. Iafallo- LA, J. Dickinson- Dal(C)
    G: S. Varlamov- NYI, J. Howard- Det, M. Smith- Edm, J. Saros- Nas, P. Francouz-Col

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