[TRADE] Karlsson to Sharks

[fungchen3]

I honestly don't think the franchise can survive. I'd love to see them rebuild and contend again, but it doesn't look like that's a concern (for ownership, of course the coaches and players want to win).

A move to Quebec perhaps? Keep the team in Canada, if there was a need to relocate.

[lukepicmo]

A move to Quebec perhaps? Keep the team in Canada, if there was a need to relocate.

I don't understand this sentiment. The issue is mismanagement, not the fan base. Ten years of incompetence, losing all of our star players along the way. Move 'em to Quebec, you'll still have an owner who will not pay to ensure that the team is competitive.

Please, don't use the playoff attendance card next - it demonstrates a weak understanding of the problem. The issue is much more complicated than a lack of will to support one's team (ie. Phoenix payroll system). It wasn't long ago that we had one of the highest, most consistent attendance records in the league.

[agentzero]

it's funny, Melnyk says he doesn't want a large payroll because the team is losing money... then he goes and trades two of their most marketable assets for peanuts and unmarketable returns. He may have cut salary, but he cut sat &merchandise sales by a much larger percentage. I'm now left wondering how large the losses will be by year end - not to mention... will the lead the NHL in lowest attendance?

I don't understand this sentiment. The issue is mismanagement, not the fan base. Ten years of incompetence, losing all of our star players along the way. Move 'em to Quebec, you'll still have an owner who will not pay to ensure that the team is competitive.

Please, don't use the playoff attendance card next - it demonstrates a weak understanding of the problem. The issue is much more complicated than a lack of will to support one's team (ie. Phoenix payroll system). It wasn't long ago that we had one of the highest, most consistent attendance records in the league.

Melnyk wants mostly corporate support, the kind the Leafs and Habs get without blinking and without icing a competitive team in years. The kind that buys up advertising and box seats at exorbitant costs, pays for corporate appearances and events and saps up merchandise like it's going out of style to the tune of millions, without any regard for the product on the ice. Melnyk wants that but Ottawa isn't that kind of market, doesn't have that kind of fan base and doesn't have that type of business community. Melnyk wants what he can't have and that's the problem. This fan base doesn't act like a large market fan base and that's that. Attendance is the last problem. Recurring investors (boxes, season tickets, ads) is the first, and they don't pay the same dollar that other Canadian franchise locations do.

[blayze]

Melnyk wants mostly corporate support, the kind the Leafs and Habs get without blinking and without icing a competitive team in years. The kind that buys up advertising and box seats at exorbitant costs, pays for corporate appearances and events and saps up merchandise like it's going out of style to the tune of millions, without any regard for the product on the ice. Melnyk wants that but Ottawa isn't that kind of market, doesn't have that kind of fan base and doesn't have that type of business community. Melnyk wants what he can't have and that's the problem. This fan base doesn't act like a large market fan base and that's that. Attendance is the last problem. Recurring investors (boxes, season tickets, ads) is the first, and they don't pay the same dollar that other Canadian franchise locations do.

If he wants that he can pay up 10x for the Leafs what he paid for the Sens

[agentzero]

If he wants that he can pay up 10x for the Leafs what he paid for the Sens

Exactly, but he's bad at business, so he won't.

[als_revenge]

Was listening to the Ottawa pre-game show on my way to hockey tonight. Something caught my attention. They were playing this game where a question was asked and three panelists had to give an answer. One question that popped up was whether or not Karlsson would re-sign with the Sharks before UFA. One guy said yes. But two (including Bruch Garrioch) both said no because Karlsson only wants to play in Tampa Bay.

[rataylor22]

LOL, sort of like judging an actual trade versus all of those hypothetical offers we think they should have got, but have no way of knowing if they actually got? That kind of hindsight analysis? Maybe, just maybe, this was the best offer they got. But no, that offer I dreamed up one night was much better, they're idiots for not taking that.

Uh, k? Please quote tweet the post where I said anything about another hypothetical offer they might have received and didn?t take?

Holy are you a sensitive little cupcake. I bet you would be sick in a 2013 fantasy hockey league run today.

[rataylor22]

They didn't want any of those guys because then they would have to pay them. I honestly believe it to the bone that they didn't start the conversation with anyone that would cost them more than a couple Mil, max. This is the return Melnyk wanted and I am dead serious when I say this. He wants to shed payroll completely.

They?d have to pay Merkley one year sooner than a 2019 first round pick.

Having more time to digest the trade, 2 additional thoughts:

1) I honestly feel not getting back an impact player is egregious. You could argue Meier or Merkley 1 for 1 would have been a better return.

2) The eastern conference condition clearly shows Ottawa was unwilling to trade Karlsson to the Eastern Conference, which means they willingly cut their trading pool from 31 to 15 teams before they had a single trade conversation. That?s a relegation-level offense.

[2014olympicgold]

I think the best quote last night was Dorion being asked what he's optimistic about for this upcoming season, and he paused for like 3s and said "we're a team".

https://twitter.com/twitter/statuses...08877121613824

[als_revenge]

They?d have to pay Merkley one year sooner than a 2019 first round pick.

Having more time to digest the trade, 2 additional thoughts:

1) I honestly feel not getting back an impact player is egregious. You could argue Meier or Merkley 1 for 1 would have been a better return.

2) The eastern conference condition clearly shows Ottawa was unwilling to trade Karlsson to the Eastern Conference, which means they willingly cut their trading pool from 31 to 15 teams before they had a single trade conversation. That?s a relegation-level offense.

Or maybe it just shows that Dorion didn't want to get embarrassed by the same GM in such a short period?

[lukepicmo]

Or maybe it just shows that Dorion didn't want to get embarrassed by the same GM in such a short period?

Ooops! Dealing your generational talent for a pittance to the GM that just made you look like I clown is grounds for embarrassment. The conditional pick just etches that joke into history.

For those who have yet to see this gem: https://www.thescore.com/nhl/news/1608436

[2014olympicgold]

Ooops! Dealing your generational talent for a pittance to the GM that just made you look like I clown is grounds for embarrassment. The conditional pick just etches that joke into history.

For those who have yet to see this gem: https://www.thescore.com/nhl/news/1608436

That was what I posted like 3 posts above.

The conditional pick 100% was he didn't want him in the east. I think it's too old school thinking to not trade to a rival now. I get why a GM like Dorion wouldn't, as he's likely gone by the time the pieces in the trade hit the NHL, but if you can take assets from your rival, why wouldn't you? Trade to a rival, let them be good as your bad, and when they finally become bad, you're on the upswing, flawed thinking a bit, but to completely say "I don't want Karlsson playing us 8/82 games a yr" is dumb to me.

[lukepicmo]

That was what I posted like 3 posts above.

The conditional pick 100% was he didn't want him in the east. I think it's too old school thinking to not trade to a rival now. I get why a GM like Dorion wouldn't, as he's likely gone by the time the pieces in the trade hit the NHL, but if you can take assets from your rival, why wouldn't you? Trade to a rival, let them be good as your bad, and when they finally become bad, you're on the upswing, flawed thinking a bit, but to completely say "I don't want Karlsson playing us 8/82 games a yr" is dumb to me.

Sorry, I looked prior to posting, but somehow skimmed over your post.

Agree 100%. It's as if he thinks that we will forget this major goof if Karlsson isn't visiting town. The Hoffman flip was, of course, the precursor to this condition. My point was merely that dealing with the same trade partner, and then reminding the fan base of being screwed by that partner via said condition, is debasing for the entire organization. We can't lose sight of the fact that this isn't about any of the mechanics of the trade (ie. the result on the ice) - this is about the fact that the team has gone nuclear in its PR.

As a Sens fan, I no longer care about the on-ice product. It was a foregone conclusion that the team would be terrible, even prior to Karlsson leaving. I am concerned with the club losing the PR battle, and the fans losing their team. You cannot expect a fan base to support a Senators franchise which has become the poster boy for toxicity and bad management.

[kevinsrangers]

My favourite part is why does Ottawa care if they send him back east. LOL

ha, my thoughts exactly.

[Savvy1982]

My favourite part is why does Ottawa care if they send him back east. LOL

Maybe they think they?ll be competitive at some point while Karlsson is still playing?

If so that?s adorable!

Look at you Melnyk! Thinking your team will be something other than a joke at some point in the next decade! That?s so cute!