Luca's Ultimate H2H (or not?) Tiered Hockey Pool - A collaborative approach.

[lucafen4]

The title basically says it all. I'm looking to start up/create a tiered hockey pool. Logistics still being worked out, but for those interested in joining, I'd love some input. For year one to sort out tiers, I want to randomly place all teams into 2 leagues - 12-14 teams each. This would be a one year pool.

The top half teams in each pool at seasons end (Reg Season) Would move to Tier 1, the bottom half teams in both pools would move to tier 2. Each successive season the top 2 teams of tier 2 would join tier 1 and bottom two teams of tier 1 would be relegated & move to tier 2.

The leagues will operate independently from one another.

When I say collaborative, I mean collaborative. There are some great minds on Dobber, so I ask for your input. I have a couple different ideas in terms of H2H format rattling around my always spinning brain.

Host on Fantrax
Idea 1 - K.I.S.S. - straight points - 1 g 1 a - 2w 1so
Idea 2 - Weighted points system 2g 2a PPP1 GWG 1 SHP1 - 2w 3SO
Idea 3 - Deep stat H2H - G/A/PPP/H/BLK/FOW/FO%/+/-/PIM/ATOI-SH - W/L/SV/GAA/SVPCT/GA
Idea 4 - scrap H2H - and use Idea 1 or 2 as a totals - eliminating bench spots - your full roster is active roster and most points wins.

I prefer pay leagues and would want to set this at $30 - $40 -- each league pays out as its own pool.

[PenguinHunter]

Awesome idea. Now the big question I ask for you is your target crowd. Where are you looking for the 24-28 managers? Are you wanting to make it so that your co-worker who is a partial hockey fan can participate and have fun? Or are you more interested in die-hard fantasy hockey players.

If you are looking to attract co-workers and friends that are not experience fantasy players I would suggest Idea 1 or Idea 4. If you keep it simple then it is easier for anyone to be more competitive. Especially if you take out the H2H and just make it a season long points total then more people can enjoy playing.

If you are looking for hardcore players then I think you want to go with Idea 3 or some combination of those stats and really make managers own their way into Tier 1.

[lucafen4]

Awesome idea. Now the big question I ask for you is your target crowd. Where are you looking for the 24-28 managers? Are you wanting to make it so that your co-worker who is a partial hockey fan can participate and have fun? Or are you more interested in die-hard fantasy hockey players.

If you are looking to attract co-workers and friends that are not experience fantasy players I would suggest Idea 1 or Idea 4. If you keep it simple then it is easier for anyone to be more competitive. Especially if you take out the H2H and just make it a season long points total then more people can enjoy playing.

If you are looking for hardcore players then I think you want to go with Idea 3 or some combination of those stats and really make managers own their way into Tier 1.

Personally, the more competitive the better... so hardcores are welcome... That said, everyone's already in some form of hardcore pool and may want a competitive, lower maintenance pool.

I am allowing majority rule on which type of scoring system gets used.

[lucafen4]

I would love people to chime in with any thoughts/comments you got.

[4T2]

I don?t have time to add much at the moment, but I like the idea and would love to be a part of it.

Like the H2H with deep stats myself. I don?t have time to join a new league but I see the potential in this and would probably leave my oldest league (that isn?t very competitive, I?ve won the last 3 years and 6 of the 9 I?ve been in it) for it.

I?ll chime in next week when I had more time but I think you?ve got a solid idea on your hands.

[lucafen4]

bump... votes appreciated

[ltcompton]

Here are my thoughts:

#1 As someone who is a diehard myself, set-up #3 definitely has the most appeal. It allows for a league that not just stuffed full of scoring all-stars and allows for defensive role players (PKers & Shutdown defencemen) and presuming this is a capped league (which it should be) it will also require cap management skills.

#2 The league should not be more than 24 teams (and you should also limit a team to 50 contracts) - The team limit is so that there is enough slack in the league, player-wise for teams to always be able to field a full roster. I'm in a 31 team league and due to varying levels of success drafting and trading, a handful of teams never have enough players available to them to field a full roster (20 players). the 50 contract limit is so that no small handful of GMs that have no real jobs and live on HFboards can hoard all of the best prospects consistently. The final reason for 24 teams is that you will find that attracting and maintaining a league of 24 high quality, dedicated GMs is not an easy task, I've seen it done a few times but not very often. Also, there are a pretty large number of guys that float around Dobber and HFboards that are what I would call draft addicts; guys that join a league with no intention of ever actually participating in the league but love drafting teams and ultimately invent a reason to drop out soon after they draft.

#3 Rules are of the greatest importance: simple rules attract simple GMs, more complex rules and a higher degree of structure are essential for maintaining a high quality league. I have a few good examples of high quality league constitutions if you are interested.

#4 Money - Use league safe, have an assistant GM or two in case something happens to you such that you can't participate any more and have hard and fast deadlines for collection with removal from the league as your stick. No exceptions.

#5 Be a dictator. It's ok to be a benevolent dictator but don't make your league a democracy, I've seen so many pissing matches over the years when the commish sets out with good intentions to get buy-in on a rule change or some other sticy problem. It's ok to seek input in the form of polls etc.. but you had better be willing to make decisions by yourself and not look back

That's just a start but good luck

[lucafen4]

Here are my thoughts:

#1 As someone who is a diehard myself, set-up #3 definitely has the most appeal. It allows for a league that not just stuffed full of scoring all-stars and allows for defensive role players (PKers & Shutdown defencemen) and presuming this is a capped league (which it should be) it will also require cap management skills.

#2 The league should not be more than 24 teams (and you should also limit a team to 50 contracts) - The team limit is so that there is enough slack in the league, player-wise for teams to always be able to field a full roster. I'm in a 31 team league and due to varying levels of success drafting and trading, a handful of teams never have enough players available to them to field a full roster (20 players). the 50 contract limit is so that no small handful of GMs that have no real jobs and live on HFboards can hoard all of the best prospects consistently. The final reason for 24 teams is that you will find that attracting and maintaining a league of 24 high quality, dedicated GMs is not an easy task, I've seen it done a few times but not very often. Also, there are a pretty large number of guys that float around Dobber and HFboards that are what I would call draft addicts; guys that join a league with no intention of ever actually participating in the league but love drafting teams and ultimately invent a reason to drop out soon after they draft.

#3 Rules are of the greatest importance: simple rules attract simple GMs, more complex rules and a higher degree of structure are essential for maintaining a high quality league. I have a few good examples of high quality league constitutions if you are interested.

#4 Money - Use league safe, have an assistant GM or two in case something happens to you such that you can't participate any more and have hard and fast deadlines for collection with removal from the league as your stick. No exceptions.

#5 Be a dictator. It's ok to be a benevolent dictator but don't make your league a democracy, I've seen so many pissing matches over the years when the commish sets out with good intentions to get buy-in on a rule change or some other sticy problem. It's ok to seek input in the form of polls etc.. but you had better be willing to make decisions by yourself and not look back

That's just a start but good luck

thanks for the feedback... a couple replies for you

1. I don't think a cap is necessary as this would be a continual 1 year league. Every year a fresh draft. Comes down to drafting skills & WW management. I plan on having limited waiver moves per week and season .

2. It would be capped with 24-28 teams and a total of 27 roster spots (no minors). The teams will be randomly split into two completely separate leagues. Cross over would take place during the second season as GM's become ranked - top 6 from each league forming tier 1, bottom 6 of each league forming tier 2. How teams move up and down between tiers was mentioned in the OP.

3. Agree, rules are important, a lot of rules seem to apply more to keepers, but there will be rules to avoid dropping elite players & well, tanking just won't be a thing as it has no affect on draft position the following year. Most of my recruitment will be from here, I don't foresee pedigree of GM being an issue. As the years pass, there will be room to add even a third tier - newbies welcome and they work their way up the ladder. There will be a rule about being active.

4. I will be hosting on fantrax - online site treasurer in place. I will need a second Commish to oversee the second league DTD - will get there when closer to puck drop

5. I like to consider myself a people's dictator. I put a lot of things to vote, but it's a first past the post system, if there's a tie, the rule doesn't change. Every time you set up a new league, the end of the 1st season will require some tinkering. I expect that, having been running a real solid league for 4yrs now.

love the feedback/comments - keep it comin'

[Cpedersen84]

Don’t think you’ll have a tough time getting 28 guys from this forum. Sign me up!