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Thread: Acquiring Matthews

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    Default Acquiring Matthews

    Im making an offer and the basis is:

    Ziba/Buchnevich/Tippett
    for Matthews/Arvidsson

    Cats are g, a, p, ppp, shp, pim, sog, +/-, and gwg- weekly hth with daily starts.

    I made this offer and I feel like he'll say no. That being said Im nervous the other way too. One of the more recent podcasts was suggesting that zib and buch's underlying metrics are already bordering on elite and that they project to be crazy good especially together. Ziba is price controlled af at 5.35 for 5 years and you gotta think Buch will take a deal near that because of internal cap considerations and what not. Meanwhile Matthews stands to maybe get McDavid money- warranted or not. As an aside Arvidsson has a great contract ofr cap leagues- so that counters it a bit.

    Its tough for me because Im leaftarded and I even thought about offering more than this- lol!!

    Is my offer close? Too much?? I cant even tell. Im contending- hes rebuilding- and before I get the obvious "why would a re-building team trade Matthews" question- its for the reasons I just traded- you get stellar cost controlled options and get to skip the anxiety of sweating out one of these new uber-deals that players are signing. I dont think Matthews production will be generational like McDavids but he might just get that money cause he plays in TO...

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    Default Re: Acquiring Matthews

    If you can pull this one off, you should be very pleased indeed. However, I have serious doubts it will be accepted due to the fact that is a HUGE win for you.

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    Default Re: Acquiring Matthews

    Do you play cap leagues AW? I normally dont- and thats why I would NOT have thought to make this offer. I wonder though if it ends up being all that much of a steal- Zibas contract is a thing of beauty- and I find Matthews impending contract terrifying- lol!! Im just asking because cap isnt my strong suit- maybe I am dreaming :P

    Talks have slowed to a trickle for the record so i think you and the other owner are in the same campe (maybe most owners- haha!)

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    Default Re: Acquiring Matthews

    Big contract or not. People will make space for elite players.
    That deal won't be accepted by a logical person even it's for Matthews alone (which I think u r better off trying. Still won't happen though)

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    Default Re: Acquiring Matthews

    Quote Originally Posted by Fighting_Emu View Post
    Im making an offer and the basis is:

    Ziba/Buchnevich/Tippett
    for Matthews/Arvidsson

    Cats are g, a, p, ppp, shp, pim, sog, +/-, and gwg- weekly hth with daily starts.

    I made this offer and I feel like he'll say no. That being said Im nervous the other way too. One of the more recent podcasts was suggesting that zib and buch's underlying metrics are already bordering on elite and that they project to be crazy good especially together. Ziba is price controlled af at 5.35 for 5 years and you gotta think Buch will take a deal near that because of internal cap considerations and what not. Meanwhile Matthews stands to maybe get McDavid money- warranted or not. As an aside Arvidsson has a great contract ofr cap leagues- so that counters it a bit.

    Its tough for me because Im leaftarded and I even thought about offering more than this- lol!!

    Is my offer close? Too much?? I cant even tell. Im contending- hes rebuilding- and before I get the obvious "why would a re-building team trade Matthews" question- its for the reasons I just traded- you get stellar cost controlled options and get to skip the anxiety of sweating out one of these new uber-deals that players are signing. I dont think Matthews production will be generational like McDavids but he might just get that money cause he plays in TO...
    There is no way anybody will accept this deal...even if its just Matthews those guys are just that ..guys...Matthews is a stud. as for a cap....superstars dont kill your cap, underproducing mid level players do
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    Default Re: Acquiring Matthews

    Quote Originally Posted by Fighting_Emu View Post
    Do you play cap leagues AW? I normally dont- and thats why I would NOT have thought to make this offer. I wonder though if it ends up being all that much of a steal- Zibas contract is a thing of beauty- and I find Matthews impending contract terrifying- lol!! Im just asking because cap isnt my strong suit- maybe I am dreaming :P

    Talks have slowed to a trickle for the record so i think you and the other owner are in the same campe (maybe most owners- haha!)
    My bad... didn't realize it was in the salary cap section.

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    The Great One

    Default Re: Acquiring Matthews

    Sounds like its still a dead fish deal

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    Default Re: Acquiring Matthews

    That's the type of offer that can turn certain ones off. Just telling u str8.
    Post his team.

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    Default Re: Acquiring Matthews

    Quote Originally Posted by Belexus75 View Post
    There is no way anybody will accept this deal...even if its just Matthews those guys are just that ..guys...Matthews is a stud. as for a cap....superstars dont kill your cap, underproducing mid level players do
    I hate that generalization- lol- its just dumb- lmao! My league has a specific number of players with a specific cap and until youve played in it or crunched the numbers its absolutely impossible to say that. Its just fortune cookie advice and boring. Draisaitl has been on the block with cricket sounds in this league.

    Im a huge matthews fan but any 10+ million dollar contract (and with the McDavid deal there is growing concern there may be more potential for that + than originally expected) in THIS format will absolutely dictate every other single decision you make on this roster. Also this offer was made after listening to the most recent PDOcast where Dinmitri was saying there is a lot to like about the underlying numbers and chemistry of Ziba and Buch. To call them "just guys" today is accurate today (and thats debatable imho)- but predicting where you can find the most monumentous gains in value is how you really get ahead in leagues. It doesnt take a doppler radar system to see Zibanejad is poised to take a pretty big step forward. Even if he just settled in at the 70 point range (and hes a relatively high volume shooter too)- thats ridiculous value at 5.35. Also as I previously speculated- Buchnevich might take a similar "low end price, long term deal"- and theyd both have the potential to massively outperform that.

    Is this worth Matthews in a cap league? I would suspect it depends on his true upside and what he signs for. If he takes any type of a discount then owners are absolutely laughing. Ive had this debate many times on here- lol! If you want to base every decision on cookie cutter logic- thats your perogative. I ask the question every time and there are times that this baseline stuff does not apply. I think this is one of those times. It rubs me the wrong way when people say things so definitively- Ive won leagues on the backs of worse gambles than this one. My best, most profitable moves almost always come on the heels of a divisive dobber forums post- lol!! and in this case it would be thye choice to HOLD Ziba and Buchnevich...

    We'll see

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    Default Re: Acquiring Matthews

    Emu Dibs has been the year for 6 years. His high is 51pts. This year he might barely hit 50 again. What in that makes u think he ever hits 70 let alone more then once? Same with Buch. What will make them elite? That's what I'm looking at if u approach me about Matthews even in a 14 team salary cap league.
    I also think Leafs will be lucky to get Matthews to sign in the 10m range.
    I say he wants 12m.

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    Default Re: Acquiring Matthews

    McD got 12.5m after putting up 100pts and winning the Hart at 20. AM is not going to break 80pts this year, nor is he in the MVP running. I don't see how the argument can be made as of yet he can get McD money. 40 goal rookie season - be damned. I'm not even sure we can predict his salary off of Eichel's this summer. I mean, Eichel - right or wrong has a slight label attached as a spoiled brat. -- see controversial comments surrounding now fired head coach..

    If his #1 goal is to win.. I can actually see a shorter 8mil/season 4-5 years.
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    Default Re: Acquiring Matthews

    Quote Originally Posted by The Black Panther View Post
    Emu Dibs has been the year for 6 years. His high is 51pts. This year he might barely hit 50 again. What in that makes u think he ever hits 70 let alone more then once? Same with Buch. What will make them elite? That's what I'm looking at if u approach me about Matthews even in a 14 team salary cap league.
    I also think Leafs will be lucky to get Matthews to sign in the 10m range.
    I say he wants 12m.
    So do ywe just pencil him in as a 50 point player because he's had a tumultuous career? I think that's foolish myself. Not saying your foolish but if the suggestion is that a guy whose clearly primed to be a high end producer should be re-written as a 50 point player because of two separate injury setbacks than Im politely declining that advice.

    Buchnevich is in his second year- why would we be putting any ceiling on him yet?

    In any case I had decided to take arvidsson out of the equation and make the pitch anyways despite the incredulity of this thread and unfortunately Matthews had been dealt already...Werenski, Kyle Connor, Bjorkstarnd and Heiskanen For Matthers, Iafallo and Frk.

  13. #13
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    Default Re: Acquiring Matthews

    Quote Originally Posted by lucafen4 View Post
    McD got 12.5m after putting up 100pts and winning the Hart at 20. AM is not going to break 80pts this year, nor is he in the MVP running. I don't see how the argument can be made as of yet he can get McD money. 40 goal rookie season - be damned. I'm not even sure we can predict his salary off of Eichel's this summer. I mean, Eichel - right or wrong has a slight label attached as a spoiled brat. -- see controversial comments surrounding now fired head coach..

    If his #1 goal is to win.. I can actually see a shorter 8mil/season 4-5 years.
    That's a huge IF. IF he doesn't decide that- they'll back up the Brinks truck. This is the hockey center of the universe and hes their saviour. You think Toronto can let him walk?? Hes got a blank cheque my friend- a blank cheque...

  14. #14
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    Default Re: Acquiring Matthews

    Quote Originally Posted by The Black Panther View Post
    Emu Dibs has been the year for 6 years. His high is 51pts. This year he might barely hit 50 again. What in that makes u think he ever hits 70 let alone more then once? Same with Buch. What will make them elite? That's what I'm looking at if u approach me about Matthews even in a 14 team salary cap league.
    I also think Leafs will be lucky to get Matthews to sign in the 10m range.
    I say he wants 12m.
    And saying "for 6 years" is such hyperbolic nonsense- cmon man!! No one expected 1a production until last year when he was de-railed by injury. Now its happened again. Im not writing a guy off who checks every box for impending elite level production because of two separate injuries- its kind of a wacky suggestion- no offense. Im not sure that's even the majority vote and if it is Im a little sad for the majority- haha!

    https://hockeypdocast.com/

    Episode 216: underlying numbers are not HARD evidence- but geez- even the overlying analytics are screaming breakout candidate. If you've got time give this a listen and then decide if you want to re-think your plans about ziba and buch...

  15. #15
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    Default Re: Acquiring Matthews

    I actually like Busch. But it's a huge IF that he becomes elite. He has the tools but was never considered a sure thing like the scouts feel about the Werenskis Connors etc. I still believe he'll be a good player(Still has major issues with consistancy) and if NYR rip it a part even more opportunity.
    For Zibs track record speaks volumes when including him in any trade for apretty guarantees stud like Matthews. I'm not taking IFs for him.

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