Bishop almost a Flame

[gainerama]

There's a chance he could be moved before the season. TB might not be able to sign Kucherov until they find a magic way to free up some more cap room. Filippula seems a lot harder to dump so Bishop might get sacrificed.

[The Iron Sheik]

It would be bad asset management but it would not be dumb. Bishop is a better goaltender than Vasilevskyi right now and Tampa is a Cup contender. The dumb move would be to downgrade their goaltending when their Cup window is open.

The Cup final goalies were Martin Jones and Matt Murray. Pittsburgh won the Cup with their second worst goalie. It doesn't matter if the team in front is good. I don't think Tampa is a cup contender but they are the same with Vas back there.

as for Calgary, good on them because Bishop is not worth the money he's going to get or ask for.

[yougo]

It doesn't matter if the team in front is good.

LOL.

Ok Ev.

[Ingolo]

Seems like if there was interest from Calgary, but they didn't make the move, then Tampa knows what they want in return for Bishop and won't budge on the price. It makes sense for them. Bishop is a top-tier tender in the league, and they're poised to ride him and his consistency to another deep playoff run. Even if they trade him after they either win the cup or get eliminated, they can still definitely get a valuable asset. Plus, if they move a different player on a big contract and make one or two value signings or bring up some players on ELCs, it's not impossible to fit a new $6.5ish million contract for Bishop in next summer. A quality backup making 3.5 isn't unheard of, so Vas's extension isn't a guarantee that he's the only option for TB going forward.

[HRM Fantasy Fan]

Somehow this seems all so familiar!! Luongo was out the door, everyone agreed but it was Schneider who ended up going, I wouldn't count on Bishop leaving in fact I think it's likely he stays.

[Sulla]

or the fact he isn't the only big contract to move out... they have some bad contracts that other assets could be used to move them and free up the space

[The Iron Sheik]

LOL.

Ok Ev.

It really doesn't in today's NHL. It's a defensive game and goalies have massive equipment. The difference between Bishop and Vasilevsky in terms of winning a Cup is negligible.

Goaltending is the most overrated position today, no question.

[Sherpa]

It really doesn't in today's NHL. It's a defensive game and goalies have massive equipment. The difference between Bishop and Vasilevsky in terms of winning a Cup is negligible.

Goaltending is the most overrated position today, no question.

This hot take makes zero sense. Montreal circa 2014/2015 -> 2nd round of playoffs. Montreal circa 2015/2016 with no significant roster changes and a goalie injury -> lottery team.

Maybe it's an extreme example...but to suggest the position is overrated? That's just silly.

[TeamRamrod]

Somehow this seems all so familiar!! Luongo was out the door, everyone agreed but it was Schneider who ended up going, I wouldn't count on Bishop leaving in fact I think it's likely he stays.

Yes, this move caught most or all off guard. It was also an astoundingly idiotic trade. They painted themselves into a corner with Luongo and had to move him as well, then compound things with trading Kesler for nothing. Now with all of that said, I recall a rumor of Kesler sleeping with Schneider's wife and things blowing up internally in Vancouver, this nullifying any logic to movements from an outsiders perspective. I usually don't pay too much attention to those rumors, but it would explain a series of horrible transactions. I don't think there is the same problem in TB, so I think your right. Bishop plays the season as a member of the Lightning, albeit with less starts (not because he's a lesser goalie, or Vas is better, but because it increases the odds of him staying healthy through the playoffs). Personally, I think if he isn't injured in the last two playoffs, the Lightning would have won at least one of those cups.

[The Iron Sheik]

This hot take makes zero sense. Montreal circa 2014/2015 -> 2nd round of playoffs. Montreal circa 2015/2016 with no significant roster changes and a goalie injury -> lottery team.

Maybe it's an extreme example...but to suggest the position is overrated? That's just silly.

You completely missed my point. I'm saying it doesn't matter if your team is good. Montreals team was not. They had terrible forwards and average defense. Its an overrated position because the difference between the best and the worst goalies isn't that big today

[Sherpa]

You completely missed my point. I'm saying it doesn't matter if your team is good. Montreals team was not. They had terrible forwards and average defense. Its an overrated position because the difference between the best and the worst goalies isn't that big today

Ah...so you're saying the goaltending position is unaffected by the talent of the player playing in the crease itself. That makes sense.

Sigh.

I won't go further down this rabbit hole than I already have but I'll simply say that i agree with you on your point that defense is a team & systems concept made of multiple components. I'm simply trying to point out that the goalie is the primary component of that system. In the Habs case, the goalie's the primary, secondary and tertiary component. Without it, you lose.

[The Iron Sheik]

Ah...so you're saying the goaltending position is unaffected by the talent of the player playing in the crease itself. That makes sense.

Sigh.

I won't go further down this rabbit hole than I already have but I'll simply say that i agree with you on your point that defense is a team & systems concept made of multiple components. I'm simply trying to point out that the goalie is the primary component of that system. In the Habs case, the goalie's the primary, secondary and tertiary component. Without it, you lose.

again that is not relevant to what I'm talking about. It's their problem that the rest of their team is bad. I'm talking about good teams. What are you not understanding? I am saying look who won the cup this year. You don't need a superstar goalie (which Bishop is not) back there to win the Cup. A cup contender should be great regardless of who is in their net. If not, they aren't really a great team.

if tampa was a montreal who relied on their goalie to do everything, then it would be a different story. If they were, they wouldn't be cup contenders.

[rataylor22]

again that is not relevant to what I'm talking about. It's their problem that the rest of their team is bad. I'm talking about good teams. What are you not understanding? I am saying look who won the cup this year. You don't need a superstar goalie (which Bishop is not) back there to win the Cup. A cup contender should be great regardless of who is in their net. If not, they aren't really a great team.

if tampa was a montreal who relied on their goalie to do everything, then it would be a different story. If they were, they wouldn't be cup contenders.

You're implying there is one way to win a cup.

As always, that is false.

[The Iron Sheik]

You're implying there is one way to win a cup.

As always, that is false.

Where did I say that.

[Sherpa]

If you re-read what I wrote, you'll see that I'm not disputing your statement about team composition. The Habs relied solely on their superstar goalie to win with little quality talent in the rest of the roster. Habs were a bad team made plain by Price's injury.

My contention this whole time is that you're calling goalies irrelevant/overrated. I disagree with you wholeheartedly there. Teams need a strong performance from their goalie to win a two-month long playoff run. As in, you cannot succeed with average goaltending. A bad goalie performance psychologically submarines the whole team. Steve Mason ought to be able to confirm this to you.