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Thread: [Rumor] Jimmy Vesey to go UFA, then sign with Leafs?

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    Default Re: [Rumor] Jimmy Vesey to go UFA, then sign with Leafs?

    It was pretty obvious long ago that Nashville was out.

    Very is going to the perfect situation in Toronto

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    Default Re: [Rumor] Jimmy Vesey to go UFA, then sign with Leafs?

    Quote Originally Posted by ericdaoust View Post
    Agreed, the problem is the rules allow players to do this.
    What would you like the NHL to change the rules to? Once you draft a player you hold his NHL rights forever?

    Nashville has had 4 years to sign Jimmy Vesey and they could not get a deal done. Any player who's drafted in the NHL entry draft becomes an NHL UFA after 4 years or less if they do not sign an NHL contract. Also, NHL teams already receive compensation if they don't sign a first round pick. Should teams get compensated for every draft pick that they do not sign?

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    Default Re: [Rumor] Jimmy Vesey to go UFA, then sign with Leafs?

    Stamkos is going to Toronto. Vesey is going to Toronto. Why is it anytime high end talent becomes available Toronto becomes the default destination?
    @SmittysRant

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    Default Re: [Rumor] Jimmy Vesey to go UFA, then sign with Leafs?

    Ya, there is no hostility on my part either, more confusion than anything.

    I completely get the whole idea of picking your team and good for him for doing it; that's his option and choice to make. It's just strange that he doesn't see the benefits of signing with Nashville out of the gate. I dont know, maybe he's getting bad advice somewhere.

    And it's not completely true that Nashville had four years to sign him. Yes, they have held his right after drafting him but his choice was to go to college and as long as he's playign hockey in the NCAA, Nashville cannot sign him. We all know that the CBA is different for US College students vs the players drafted out of the CHL. They can be signed and then go back to playing hockey. Vesey was obviously intent on his schooling and you sure cant fault a kid for that. It just sucks for Nashville, who were obviously invested in the kid.

    Either way, the Predators hold his rights until August 15th. After that, it's all in Vesey's hands.
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    Default Re: [Rumor] Jimmy Vesey to go UFA, then sign with Leafs?

    I wouldn’t say they invested anything more in him than the pick itself, and it was a 3rd rounder. It’s funny that 3rd rounder was originally Toronto’s anyways lol (part of the Bernier trade I think {Preds got it Via LAL}).

    There was only 1 forward in that round that is close to an NHL job and it’s Leipsic. I don’t think they were planning on drafting D, or a goalie that “early” in the draft.

    They took a shot at him, and I’m pretty sure it was known he was planning on staying in college for 4yrs, and it missed. Then they didn’t do enough to make him want to sign. It happens. It’s not like it was a guy they had in their minors playing for 3 yrs developing into this top 6 guy and he just says Nah he’s not signing with them. It was just a draft pick in my eyes. He didn’t even count on the 50man roster.
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    Default Re: [Rumor] Jimmy Vesey to go UFA, then sign with Leafs?

    Quote Originally Posted by chuckcouples View Post
    What would you like the NHL to change the rules to? Once you draft a player you hold his NHL rights forever?

    Nashville has had 4 years to sign Jimmy Vesey and they could not get a deal done. Any player who's drafted in the NHL entry draft becomes an NHL UFA after 4 years or less if they do not sign an NHL contract. Also, NHL teams already receive compensation if they don't sign a first round pick. Should teams get compensated for every draft pick that they do not sign?
    Yes. Yes they should.

    I think there should be a rule that if a player opts to do this, then the team that was shafted should receive a first round pick from the team that eventually signs said player. Similar to a compensation pick in baseball when a top player leaves for free agency. Because it's bullshit that teams get shafted like this. Nashville makes a great selection in 2012, showing faith in Vesey and his abilities and now they get diddly squat. And it'll make teams think really long and hard about whether or not it's worth signing these players in free agency, as Justin Schultz would be a good example of how it could blow up in your face.

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    Default Re: [Rumor] Jimmy Vesey to go UFA, then sign with Leafs?

    Quote Originally Posted by 2014olympicgold View Post
    I wouldn’t say they invested anything more in him than the pick itself, and it was a 3rd rounder. It’s funny that 3rd rounder was originally Toronto’s anyways lol (part of the Bernier trade I think {Preds got it Via LAL}).

    There was only 1 forward in that round that is close to an NHL job and it’s Leipsic. I don’t think they were planning on drafting D, or a goalie that “early” in the draft.

    They took a shot at him, and I’m pretty sure it was known he was planning on staying in college for 4yrs, and it missed. Then they didn’t do enough to make him want to sign. It happens. It’s not like it was a guy they had in their minors playing for 3 yrs developing into this top 6 guy and he just says Nah he’s not signing with them. It was just a draft pick in my eyes. He didn’t even count on the 50man roster.
    Sure they have. They brought him to every training camp since they drafted him. That costs money. They've invested time and money scouting him prior to the draft and then developing him at these training camps. Again, these things aren't free. There's so many things that one would never think of when it comes to these teams and their prospects, both in finances and even sometimes, emotionally.

    To say they haven't invested anything into Vesey more than just a pick is incorrect.
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    Default Re: [Rumor] Jimmy Vesey to go UFA, then sign with Leafs?

    Quote Originally Posted by 2014olympicgold View Post
    I wouldn’t say they invested anything more in him than the pick itself, and it was a 3rd rounder. It’s funny that 3rd rounder was originally Toronto’s anyways lol (part of the Bernier trade I think {Preds got it Via LAL}).

    There was only 1 forward in that round that is close to an NHL job and it’s Leipsic. I don’t think they were planning on drafting D, or a goalie that “early” in the draft.

    They took a shot at him, and I’m pretty sure it was known he was planning on staying in college for 4yrs, and it missed. Then they didn’t do enough to make him want to sign. It happens. It’s not like it was a guy they had in their minors playing for 3 yrs developing into this top 6 guy and he just says Nah he’s not signing with them. It was just a draft pick in my eyes. He didn’t even count on the 50man roster.
    The issue I have is this part you don't know.

    I mean take it with a grain of salt, but I think the best evidence of whether or not they did everything to make him want to sign comes from Poile's statement, because that's really all we have to go on that's concrete. And based on his statement it sounds like they did everything they could to make him sign short of sexual favours.

    The biggest issue I have with these situations is we'll never really know how much tampering comes into play in these cases, which is why I think teams in this situation should be compensated. Vesey's dad works for Toronto right? If Vesey signs with Toronto as a free agent, is it too far to assume that maybe a guy talked to a guy, who talked to a guy, who talked to a guy, who talked to Vesey's dad and said hey I heard "x".

    Quote Originally Posted by Axeman33 View Post
    Sure they have. They brought him to every training camp since they drafted him. That costs money. They've invested time and money scouting him prior to the draft and then developing him at these training camps. Again, these things aren't free. There's so many things that one would never think of when it comes to these teams and their prospects, both in finances and even sometimes, emotionally.

    To say they haven't invested anything into Vesey more than just a pick is incorrect.
    Agreed. I think it's a bit short-sighted to say that all this costs them was a pick, because it cost a pick, 4 years of development, and it has an effect on the long-term plans set out by Poile and his team. The pick (and what stage of the draft it came from) doesn't matter after the draft, it's still a top prospect in your system walking out on the team. It's not like these guys operate in a vacuum. Management has to plan for the future and Vesey obviously was going to play a big role in it. Not to mention even in the near future. As Poile said some of his decisions at the deadline were made based on the assumption that Vesey was going to sign. We don't know whether or not Vesey's camp gave him any real reason to assume this, but again based on Poile's comments it sounds like he was really blindsided by this.

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    Default Re: [Rumor] Jimmy Vesey to go UFA, then sign with Leafs?

    Quote Originally Posted by bondon View Post
    And based on his statement it sounds like they did everything they could to make him sign short of sexual favours.
    So they didn't do everything they could.


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    Default Re: [Rumor] Jimmy Vesey to go UFA, then sign with Leafs?

    Well I guess I wasn’t thinking the big picture. I was thinking more if like Fiala left.

    And I can’t honestly find anything about Vesey even being one of the players at a Nashville Training camp, or being a cut player any yr. I always thought only signed players could attend the camp.
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    Default Re: [Rumor] Jimmy Vesey to go UFA, then sign with Leafs?

    Quote Originally Posted by Axeman33 View Post
    Sure they have. They brought him to every training camp since they drafted him. That costs money. They've invested time and money scouting him prior to the draft and then developing him at these training camps. Again, these things aren't free. There's so many things that one would never think of when it comes to these teams and their prospects, both in finances and even sometimes, emotionally.

    To say they haven't invested anything into Vesey more than just a pick is incorrect.
    actually the player has for his own travel and accommodation if he wants to attend an NHL camp.

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    Default Re: [Rumor] Jimmy Vesey to go UFA, then sign with Leafs?

    Quote Originally Posted by Big Ev View Post
    actually the player has for his own travel and accommodation if he wants to attend an NHL camp.
    Are you sure? I know college kids have certain "restrictions" when it comes to funding but I thought NHL teams cover the travel costs for players under their control in regards to things like training camps.
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    Default Re: [Rumor] Jimmy Vesey to go UFA, then sign with Leafs?

    Quote Originally Posted by Axeman33 View Post
    Are you sure? I know college kids have certain "restrictions" when it comes to funding but I thought NHL teams cover the travel costs for players under their control in regards to things like training camps.
    Yes, NCAA players lose their eligibility if the team pays them to attend camp. But regardless they still took four years to develop, mentor, and train him etc.

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    Default Re: [Rumor] Jimmy Vesey to go UFA, then sign with Leafs?

    Quote Originally Posted by chuckcouples View Post
    What would you like the NHL to change the rules to? Once you draft a player you hold his NHL rights forever?

    Nashville has had 4 years to sign Jimmy Vesey and they could not get a deal done. Any player who's drafted in the NHL entry draft becomes an NHL UFA after 4 years or less if they do not sign an NHL contract. Also, NHL teams already receive compensation if they don't sign a first round pick. Should teams get compensated for every draft pick that they do not sign?
    Yes. of course they should.

    Quote Originally Posted by Bomm Bastic View Post
    Stamkos is going to Toronto. Vesey is going to Toronto. Why is it anytime high end talent becomes available Toronto becomes the default destination?
    Because Toronto is the only team that exists and the center of the universe and every other team are just farm teams to develop superstar players to go to Toronto. Or something.

    Quote Originally Posted by bondon View Post
    Yes. Yes they should.

    I think there should be a rule that if a player opts to do this, then the team that was shafted should receive a first round pick from the team that eventually signs said player.
    I disagree with this. I think the current compensation model for losing a first round pick should be applied to every round.

    IE. If Calgary doesn't sign Jankowski this offseason, they get a 2nd round pick at the same spot of where they drafted him. That was 21st overall, so they would get the 51st overall pick in the 2017 draft. The draft round +1 system seems fine, it should just apply to every round.

    Although, I don't mind Bondon's suggestion that the pick would come from the team that eventually signs the player.

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    Default Re: [Rumor] Jimmy Vesey to go UFA, then sign with Leafs?

    Boston has some pretty strong ties to Harvard.

    One could argue they are for sure tampering.

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