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Thread: Josh Gordon???

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    Default Re: Josh Gordon???

    he also has a dwi at issue as well. the eight game is prob a compromise on both parties given the unique nature of Gordon's situation (as compared to Welker's)
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    Default Re: Josh Gordon???

    Quote Originally Posted by Bomm Bastic View Post
    he also has a dwi at issue as well. the eight game is prob a compromise on both parties given the unique nature of Gordon's situation (as compared to Welker's)
    Could be, but the DWI hearing isn't until November.

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    Default Re: Josh Gordon???

    Quote Originally Posted by ross10019 View Post
    The “public policy” argument also works in his favor: The NFL suspended Gordon on August 27, 2014 and Wes Welker on September 3, 2014. That’s exactly one week apart from one another.

    It’s unimaginable for these two guys to be treated differently simply because they got high at different times. When the dust finally settles, the suspension dates (or when the appeals were finally decided) will be the deciding factor, not when they toked up.
    This statement from Hopkins makes no sense. When the suspension was handed down doesn't matter. It's when the failed test occurred (i.e., the "wrongful conduct", as it were) that is important and I think they occurred in different league years.

    But more importantly, it completely ignores the fact that Welker is a first time offender and Gordon is not. That's why their suspensions were so radically different to begin with.

    It's a good thing that the policy got revamped, but let's not forget that Josh Gordon is a dunce b/c he absolutely knew the rule, had a history to be concerned about and still got pinched. The fact that all he's done since is blame other people (i.e., the league, the arbitrator) for failing to exercise good judgment in his case is most disturbing. It's a joke really.

    I sincerely hope I'm wrong, but with that kind of attitude and regardless of what happens with his suspension time around, it wouldn't surprise me in the least to be revisiting this discussion about Gordon at some point in the future. He's apparently learned nothing, other than that he was wronged and somebody else screwed up.
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    Default Re: Josh Gordon???

    Quote Originally Posted by dejeanneret View Post
    This statement from Hopkins makes no sense. When the suspension was handed down doesn't matter. It's when the failed test occurred (i.e., the "wrongful conduct", as it were) that is important and I think they occurred in different league years.

    But more importantly, it completely ignores the fact that Welker is a first time offender and Gordon is not. That's why their suspensions were so radically different to begin with.

    It's a good thing that the policy got revamped, but let's not forget that Josh Gordon is a dunce b/c he absolutely knew the rule, had a history to be concerned about and still got pinched. The fact that all he's done since is blame other people (i.e., the league, the arbitrator) for failing to exercise good judgment in his case is most disturbing. It's a joke really.

    I sincerely hope I'm wrong, but with that kind of attitude and regardless of what happens with his suspension time around, it wouldn't surprise me in the least to be revisiting this discussion about Gordon at some point in the future. He's apparently learned nothing, other than that he was wronged and somebody else screwed up.
    Have to disagree with you here Mike.

    First off, if the rule changes and he is disciplined after the date of effectiveness of the rule change, to me that means the discipline should be based on the rule in effect. In his case, the rule in effect retroactive to March 2014 would be 50nml, and he was disciplined because he was at 16nml, so he effectively did not violate the policy in effect when he was disciplined and therefore should not be suspended at all, and no longer a repeat offender.

    That said, I agree this guy’s a dunce. He puts himself in situations that he shouldn’t. But he was at 16nml when the Olympic Anti Doping rule is 150nml, let’s not forget that. This guy wasn’t smoking giant doobies for weeks and weeks, he might have legitimately just had second hand ingestion (albeit, he shouldn’t be in any room where that shit is going on, given his history).

    So I could see him messing up again, this time he’ll end up at 51nml when the rule is 50, and blame everyone else again.

    But on this one, if they suspend him 8 games, I would bet big time that he immediately sues the NFL based on an argument that the new policy should apply to him even though the conduct in question occurred before the effectiveness of the rule change, and I bet he wins.

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    Default Re: Josh Gordon???

    Quote Originally Posted by ross10019 View Post
    Have to disagree with you here Mike.

    First off, if the rule changes and he is disciplined after the date of effectiveness of the rule change, to me that means the discipline should be based on the rule in effect. In his case, the rule in effect retroactive to March 2014 would be 50nml, and he was disciplined because he was at 16nml, so he effectively did not violate the policy in effect when he was disciplined and therefore should not be suspended at all, and no longer a repeat offender.

    That said, I agree this guy’s a dunce. He puts himself in situations that he shouldn’t. But he was at 16nml when the Olympic Anti Doping rule is 150nml, let’s not forget that. This guy wasn’t smoking giant doobies for weeks and weeks, he might have legitimately just had second hand ingestion (albeit, he shouldn’t be in any room where that shit is going on, given his history).

    So I could see him messing up again, this time he’ll end up at 51nml when the rule is 50, and blame everyone else again.

    But on this one, if they suspend him 8 games, I would bet big time that he immediately sues the NFL based on an argument that the new policy should apply to him even though the conduct in question occurred before the effectiveness of the rule change, and I bet he wins.
    Yeah, we're going to have to agree to disagree on this one, I think.

    In my view, he most certainly did violate the policy that was in place at the time. It said you can't have more than "X"nml and he had "X+1"nml or whatever. I could be wrong, but neither the "old" policy nor the "new" policy determine the length of the suspension by how far over the limit the test was. He was over the limit when tested. Case closed in my book, even if that turned out to be under the limit at time of sentencing so to speak (which, in reality, it wasn't -- it's just that the league is now changing the rules and retroactively applying them for some arbitrary reason).

    In any event, we'll see. I must admit, I'm bordering on being a bit biased here. The more time that passes, the more I find myself affirmatively hoping that Gordon gets as many of the 16 games as possible. And it's not a pot issue; I just don't like the "blame anyone but me" mentality, particularly when he knew full well both the potential ramifications and the millions upon millions of reasons he had to avoid them at all costs.
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    Default Re: Josh Gordon???

    Quote Originally Posted by dejeanneret View Post
    Yeah, we're going to have to agree to disagree on this one, I think.

    In my view, he most certainly did violate the policy that was in place at the time. It said you can't have more than "X"nml and he had "X+1"nml or whatever. I could be wrong, but neither the "old" policy nor the "new" policy determine the length of the suspension by how far over the limit the test was. He was over the limit when tested. Case closed in my book, even if that turned out to be under the limit at time of sentencing so to speak (which, in reality, it wasn't -- it's just that the league is now changing the rules and retroactively applying them for some arbitrary reason).

    In any event, we'll see. I must admit, I'm bordering on being a bit biased here. The more time that passes, the more I find myself affirmatively hoping that Gordon gets as many of the 16 games as possible. And it's not a pot issue; I just don't like the "blame anyone but me" mentality, particularly when he knew full well both the potential ramifications and the millions upon millions of reasons he had to avoid them at all costs.
    "Blame anyone but me mentality"? Dude get off your high horse and stop pretending you own some type of moral high ground. All he's publicly said since he got suspended is "I didn't smoke weed", which if you know absolutely ANYTHING is obviously true because it is impossible to test that low in your system if he actually had first-hand inhaled the drug. He didn't come out and say "it's my friends fault for smoking around me", he just said he didn't personally smoke anything.

    Get over yourself man, you're making yourself look like a petty, bitter, jealous person.

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    Default Re: Josh Gordon???

    Quote Originally Posted by rataylor22 View Post
    Get over yourself man, you're making yourself look like a petty, bitter, jealous person.
    A bit overstated, no?

    Gordon is an idiot for risking the privilege of playing in the NFL by hanging around stoners. And if his friends were indeed friends they would respect Gordon's situation and not put him at risk by exposing him to it in the first place. Whether or not it should be legal is irrelevant.
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    Default Re: Josh Gordon???

    Quote Originally Posted by rataylor22 View Post
    "Blame anyone but me mentality"? Dude get off your high horse and stop pretending you own some type of moral high ground. All he's publicly said since he got suspended is "I didn't smoke weed", which if you know absolutely ANYTHING is obviously true because it is impossible to test that low in your system if he actually had first-hand inhaled the drug. He didn't come out and say "it's my friends fault for smoking around me", he just said he didn't personally smoke anything.

    Get over yourself man, you're making yourself look like a petty, bitter, jealous person.
    I'm surprised that you reacted so angrily to my post. I'm not pretending to own any moral high ground here. And I can assure you that I'm not bitter towards Gordon nor am I jealous of him (why would I be?).

    But it's simply not true that the only thing Gordon has said is that he didn't smoke pot. That's my point actually. If he had just said that, then there's nothing to discuss. Instead:

    "I'd like to apologize to my teammates, coaches, the Cleveland Browns organization and our fans," Gordon said in a statement. "I am very disappointed that the NFL and its hearing office didn't exercise better discretion and judgment in my case."
    http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap300...ded-one-season

    https://www.nflplayers.com/Articles/...f-Josh-Gordon/

    In other words, he apologized to his team and fans because the league got it wrong. He did not, from what I've seen, apologize to those same people for having put himself in that situation to begin with. Big difference.
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    Default Re: Josh Gordon???

    Now reports are a 10 game suspension for Gordon under the new policy -- eligible to return Week 12.

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    Default Re: Josh Gordon???

    https://twitter.com/AdamSchefter/sta...37615796613120

    Now being told Josh Gordon will be suspended 10 games, which turns into 9 games starting now. So it’ll be 9 more of suspension, not eight.
    Apparently Welker will be eligible to return ASAP but is still doubtful for Sunday.
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    Default Re: Josh Gordon???

    Quote Originally Posted by dejeanneret View Post
    Now reports are a 10 game suspension for Gordon under the new policy -- eligible to return Week 12.

    http://www.cleveland.com/browns/inde...l#incart_river

    This still makes absolutely no sense. Assuming that last violation was in fact a violation (ie, they rule that since it occured before March 2014, it's a violation because at that time the rule was 15nml), then that would be his 3rd violation and based on this article he would get 4 games, not 10. I think it woulld be his 3rd violation, but something tells me it's actually his 2nd.

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    Default Re: Josh Gordon???

    Yeah, I noticed that too, Ross. Sources reporting that it's Gordon's 4th violation, but I actually don't know where they're getting that number from. Maybe they count failed tests in college too? Think he was suspended twice in college for failed drug tests as well.
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    Default Re: Josh Gordon???

    Quote Originally Posted by Bomm Bastic View Post
    he also has a dwi at issue as well. the eight game is prob a compromise on both parties given the unique nature of Gordon's situation (as compared to Welker's)
    Quote Originally Posted by ross10019 View Post
    Could be, but the DWI hearing isn't until November.
    Just saw the following update: Gordon pled guilty to the DWI charge and apparently no further NFL discipline will result from it. So it looks like he'll be back in Week 12.

    http://www.rotoworld.com/player/nfl/8282/josh-gordon

    Could see a nice boost in production for all relevant skill players on the Browns offense heading into the fantasy playoff run.
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    Default Re: Josh Gordon???

    League officially reduced Gordons suspension to 10 games. He’ll be eligible to be back in week 12 vs the Falcons
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