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Thread: Hendricks beats GSP! Well, not officially

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    Default Hendricks beats GSP! Well, not officially

    I am Canadian and love GSP as much as anyone, but Hendricks was robbed tonight. This is either a case of the champion winning a decision based in the fact that he is "The Champion", or another example of why a 10-point-must scoring system doesn't work in MMA. Shameful...

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    Default Re: Hendricks beats GSP! Well, not officially

    I for one will never watch UFC again.
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    Default Re: Hendricks beats GSP! Well, not officially

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    Default Re: Hendricks beats GSP! Well, not officially

    You can argue the 10 pt system is flawed, but under the current way the UFC scores fights GSP won rounds 3 and 5. Hendricks 2 and 4. Nobody seems to be arguing that. Round 1 was a toss up. I scored it for GSP at the time of the fight. Watched it again today and it was super close.
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    Default Re: Hendricks beats GSP! Well, not officially

    As a GSP fan even I have to admit the result was embarrassing - but the UFC has nothing to do with it. The judges are appointed and governed by the state athletic commission.

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    Default Re: Hendricks beats GSP! Well, not officially

    I don't blame the judges. Round by round it could've been 48-47 either way. Round 1 was the only round that didn't have a clear winner.

    It's the way fights are scored. Same way boxing is scored.

    The only other alternative would be to NOT score it rd by rd, just pick a winner at the end.
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    Default Re: Hendricks beats GSP! Well, not officially

    I think that's the crux of the issue. It's not a street fight, or who looks beat up at the end. Whether that should be changed is a whole other issue.
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    Default Re: Hendricks beats GSP! Well, not officially

    Exactly.

    And if we are scoring it by damage and nothing else, it really puts the grapplers at a disadvantage.

    I think the fact that fights are scored the way they are is a result of making the sport more of a technical battle rather than a street fight - which is what the UFC has wanted all along.

    Dana can be a hypocrite sometimes when he comes out and says "GSP lost because he was more beat up" and then other times defends the legitimacy of all the other aspects on how fights are scored saying how the UFC is so much more than a street fight.

    This fight wasn't even about grappling though. Rounds 2 and 4 were Hendricks, 3 and 5 GSP's.

    If you would've stuck round 1 at the end of the fight the judges may have been swayed to Hendricks as a way to give him the benefit of the doubt for doing damage in other rounds. The fact that it was so close and round 1, they probably felt liek they should give the champ the benefit of the doubt as Hendricks should do more than what he did in round 1 to take the belt away.

    Tons of theories you can have on round 1 as to who won it, but really it's the only one that matters if you score fights under the current rules.

    I'm starting to question why more 10-10 rounds aren't giving as this easily would've been a candidate for a 10-10 round.
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    Default Re: Hendricks beats GSP! Well, not officially

    I think saying GSP lost is ignorant. I do however believe you have to "BEAT" the champ. I think he did more damage, but I also think if there was 5 more rounds Gsp would've beat him eventually. I watched the fight again today and I have to say they should've called it a draw based on the scoring system. That being said I also think the rounds GSP won were CLOSE, while the rounds Hendricks won were lop-sided. It's the sport and to be honest GSP has a much better attitude that the cocky challenger Hendricks. ALSO I think next time GSP comes in much heavier and more prepared at Hendricks was 200+ pounds while GSP was a measily 180-185 tops in comparison.
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    Default Re: Hendricks beats GSP! Well, not officially

    http://www.mmatko.com/did-johny-hend...go-in-round-1/

    Another interesting aspect to the debate around the fight. Thought I'd post the video.
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    Default Re: Hendricks beats GSP! Well, not officially

    This is right out of the "Unified Rules of MMA - Judging Criteria Amended July 2012."

    "Effective striking” is judged by determining the impact of legal strikes landed by a contestant and the number of such legal strikes. Heavier strikes that have a visible impact on the opponent will be given more weight than the number of strikes landed. These assessments include causing an opponent to appear stunned from a legal blow, causing the opponent to stagger, appearance of a cut or bruise from a legal strike and causing the opponent to show pain. Cumulative impact on a fighter will also be weighed. If neither fighter shows an advantage in impact of strikes, the number of strikes will determine the most effective striker.
    So, using this criteria, GSP being battered and bruised HAS to be taken into consideration. Also, to say that this is the only scoring system other than to pick a winner, simply isn't true. There is another system that is more complicated, but it would solve issues like this.

    Besides, even if GSP did win 1, 3 and 5, this fight is the poster child for why a 10 point must system doesn't work in MMA. It's better suited for boxing for several reasons. First of all, boxing has really just one thing to take into consideration and that is "landed punches". Secondly, most boxing matches are longer than MMA fights. If you lose 1 round in a 12 round boxing match, there is a lot of opportunity to make it up. If you lose a round in a 3 round MMA match, you are in trouble. In MMA, judges have to take grappling, striking, aggression and octagon control into consideration when judging. If one fighter has 17 landed strikes and 1 takedown in a round, and the opponent has 19 landed strikes and no takedowns, who wins the round?

    As well, as made glaringly obvious in this fight, to barely win a round is JUST as important as winning a round in dominant fashion. Hendricks dominated in rounds 2 and 4, and BARELY lost round one. These are the first round stats: GSP 26 landed strikes with 19 considered significant and 1 takedown. Hendricks landed 27 strikes with 18 considered significant and 1 takedown. Sorry, but Dana White is right. The system is broken.

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    Default Re: Hendricks beats GSP! Well, not officially

    I saw the whole fight and I had rounds 1-3 and 5 in GSP's favour. I agree with Rylant about Hendrix's domination in rounds 2 and 4 but there's a bunch of other things to consider. First of all, I was out of my seat when when I saw the non-called tap-out on the choke hold! The commentators said GSP ''lost his hold'' but he actually let go at that point after Hendrix taps his back. Right there, the match is over, but alas, it continued; did the judges see that and did it weigh in their final decision? Another point to consider is GSP slipped and go pounded in round 4 while he was on the ground. Had St-Pierre not have had that bad luck, I'm not sure he would have lost that round (we will never know). My point with that last example is that JH did not take the fight enough to GSP to warrant a win. On the other hand though, GSP did not perform like a champ. His blows were soft and his takedowns were limited.

    Overall, GSP's fights are not always exciting, but that's because the guy is technical. Call the system flawed if you wish, but he did nothing wrong here. He won the rounds he needed to and that was that. You can whine all you want at an NHL team that plays the trap on a given night while surrendering more shots and scoring chances than they generated, but if their first period goal earned them the win, that's all that matters.

    Hendrix deserves a rematch, no question.
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    Default Re: Hendricks beats GSP! Well, not officially

    You must have been watching a different fight than eveyrone else because in Hendrix rocked GSP with an uppercut resulting in round 2 resulting in a wobbly GSP for a good couple of minutes. The most decisive of the 5 rounds by far.

    I also saw that "phantom tap" at the start haha... I thought I was the only one! I'm sure there was no tap because GSP and his camp would've made a big deal about it after the match.

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    Default Re: Hendricks beats GSP! Well, not officially

    Well essentially, that was what I was saying. Hendrix got the most pounding done overall but in 2 rounds;the score card at the end is what counts. Since St-Pierre won 3 rounds (technically) out of 5, outlasted 2 torrid rounds of punishment and had a choke hold on Hendrix that got him to tap out, I feel the best decision here was to give the match to St-Pierre. However, Hendrix's assault clearly shows he can take it to GSP, hence the rematch that MUST be granted to him ASAP
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    Default Re: Hendricks beats GSP! Well, not officially

    I have watched it a couple of times, and I am pretty certain Hendricks didn't tap; a lot of the evidence suggests otherwise. First of all, it was far from definitive. It wasn't a deep guillotine. Hendricks had his right elbow and forearm on GSP's thigh in an attempt to defend the submission and sweep GSP. GSP was scrambling a bit to avoid the sweep, and I believe that his leg movement caused Hendricks' arm to move in what some consider to be a tapping motion. The tapping motion was also made AFTER GSP had released the submission attempt. Also, take into consideration that Hendricks is left-handed, and his left hand was resting on GSP's back; MOST people tap with their dominant hand subconsciously. His right hand was the correct hand to defend the submission, and that's what I think he was doing. Also, many professionals have weighed in on the subject, and I have yet to see one say that they thought Hendricks tapped. As well, GSP's camp would be up in arms about it if they thought Hendricks had tapped. I don't think it was a tap out.

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