[Cage Match Tournament] #1 Ovechkin vs. #2 Crosby

[hockeyrobot]

For all those fantasy doctors out there saying that he is more prone to having a career ending concussion are wrong, once fully recovered from a concussion you are no more likely to suffer another concussion than someone who has never had a concussion before.

Im pretty sure that the majority of concussion info is more speculative than actual proof so aren't you being a "fantasy doctor" as well by saying what you just said?

I have a history of concussions and I can personally tell you that I still feel it when I get bumped in men's league hockey.

There is no definitive proof that Crosby specifically had a concussion........ There is actually no definitive proof that he experienced a concussion or substantial head injury from the MRI and CAT scans that he underwent. As far as predicting his future, you can only look at the neck injury, any discussion of a concussion is effectively null.

I just don't get it. There is also no proof that he didn't! How do we know that the neck injury wasn't occurring at the same time as a concussion? I'd be getting into major conspiracy theory here but how do we even know that they are telling the truth about the neck injury? Seriously...how did it take them over a year to realize what was going on with his neck? And if they knew and were just keeping it from the public.....WHY?

[SeaDawg]

I think the poll numbers speak for themselves.

As I already mentioned, I think the poll numbers show how fickle people are. I really do believe that if Crosby was still out with the injury, the poll would be in Ovechkin's favor (or at the very least this would be a closer battle).

[hockeyrobot]

As I already mentioned, I think the poll numbers show how fickle people are. I really do believe that if Crosby was still out with the injury, the poll would be in Ovechkin's favor (or at the very least this would be a closer battle).

Agree 100%.

[Big Ev]

As I already mentioned, I think the poll numbers show how fickle people are. I really do believe that if Crosby was still out with the injury, the poll would be in Ovechkin's favor (or at the very least this would be a closer battle).

If the poll were Crosby vs Malkin and you picked Malkin, then I would call you fickle for the exact same "what have you done for me lately" bias. It works both ways. Malkin is "one hit away" from blowing out his knees for good (not that I believe that, it's just the same ignorant argument that people like to make for guys who have concussions).

People might have a case for Ovechkin if he actually was doing anything these last 2 seasons.

[hockeyrobot]

If the poll were Crosby vs Malkin and you picked Malkin, then I would call you fickle for the exact same "what have you done for me lately" bias. It works both ways. Malkin is "one hit away" from blowing out his knees for good (not that I believe that, it's just the same ignorant argument that people like to make for guys who have concussions).

How is it ignoranttttttttttt!?! This isn't Colby Armstrong we're talking about. It's the face of the entire game. There is proof that they're clearly taking every single precaution necessary with Sidney.

I picked Malkin to win the Art Ross in the Dobber Panel Predictions (as did most of the columnists).

[27Blue]

who cares... the masses have spoken. lets move on to the next round so malkin can reign supreme...

[SeaDawg]

If the poll were Crosby vs Malkin and you picked Malkin, then I would call you fickle for the exact same "what have you done for me lately" bias. It works both ways. Malkin is "one hit away" from blowing out his knees for good (not that I believe that, it's just the same ignorant argument that people like to make for guys who have concussions).

People might have a case for Ovechkin if he actually was doing anything these last 2 seasons.

there is a big difference between a knee injury and a concussion. Some players have had career-ending knee injuries, but not as many who have had career-ending concussions. Also, the medical community knows a lot more about knee injuries, how to fix them, how to prevent them, and how to rehab them, than the do about concussions. As I already said, concussions are still a mystery. No one know exactly the best way to treat them, how to prevent them, or the impact they have on the brain, both in the short and long-term.

[Ross The Boss Palmer]

there is a big difference between a knee injury and a concussion. Some players have had career-ending knee injuries, but not as many who have had career-ending concussions. Also, the medical community knows a lot more about knee injuries, how to fix them, how to prevent them, and how to rehab them, than the do about concussions. As I already said, concussions are still a mystery. No one know exactly the best way to treat them, how to prevent them, or the impact they have on the brain, both in the short and long-term.

The great news is that other the past 10 years, there have been amazing leaps and bounds in understanding the mechanisms at work in our brains. We are just scratching the surface, but things are picking up.

If anyone wants to research a cool topic (at least in my opinion), look up brain derived neurotrophic factor, or BDNF. It has been proven over the past few years that BDNF is responsible for neurogenesis (brain cell growth). Essentially, this means that our brains are not stagnant but plastic (meaning new stem cells in the brain are made every day), and the best way to have these stem cells become full fledge neurons and part of our brain circuitry is exercise. Exercise is also the best way to increase the amount of BDNF that your body produces, so it works two-fold.

Anyway, sorry to go on a tangent, but the new research on the mechanisms at work in our brains is bad ass.

[SeaDawg]

The great news is that other the past 10 years, there have been amazing leaps and bounds in understanding the mechanisms at work in our brains. We are just scratching the surface, but things are picking up.

If anyone wants to research a cool topic (at least in my opinion), look up brain derived neurotrophic factor, or BDNF. It has been proven over the past few years that BDNF is responsible for neurogenesis (brain cell growth). Essentially, this means that our brains are not stagnant but plastic (meaning new stem cells in the brain are made every day), and the best way to have these stem cells become full fledge neurons and part of our brain circuitry is exercise. Exercise is also the best way to increase the amount of BDNF that your body produces, so it works two-fold.

Anyway, sorry to go on a tangent, but the new research on the mechanisms at work in our brains is bad ass.

because you study neurology, you obviously have a much better understanding of the breakthroughs being made every day in that field. It is definitely exciting and there is hope not only for athletes, but also for people who get in car accidents, or fall off a ladder, or suffer any sort of serious brain injury.

All I'm saying is that even if great progress has been made recently, comparing the knowledge (and treatment) we have for knee injuries to brain injuries is an unfair comparison.

[Ross The Boss Palmer]

because you study neurology, you obviously have a much better understanding of the breakthroughs being made every day in that field. It is definitely exciting and there is hope not only for athletes, but also for people who get in car accidents, or fall off a ladder, or suffer any sort of serious brain injury.

All I'm saying is that even if great progress has been made recently, comparing the knowledge (and treatment) we have for knee injuries to brain injuries is an unfair comparison.

Agreed. I was not trying to apply BDNF to Crosby's situation, I just enjoy what I have been studying and fully agree that the knowledge pool on the brain and on concussions is lacking greatly (as you said in your post above). Scientists are discovering new things about the brain all the time, the question is how all these new discoveries link together. For the most part, the advancements have come from studying babies born with fetal alcohol syndrome, stroke victims, those with chronic depression, etc., things that have shown to have a much greater substantial affect on the make-up of a brain, and the nature of concussions makes it a very difficult to study and research because the changes would be much more subtle.

Comparing a knee injury to a concussion is unfair. From what I can tell, comparing a concussion case to another concussion case with the knowledge base available to medical professions is also unfair at this time. There are simply too many variables at play that we do not know enough about.

[SeaDawg]

From what I can tell, comparing a concussion case to another concussion case with the knowledge base available to medical professions is also unfair at this time. There are simply too many variables at play that we do not know enough about.

I could not agree more. This is an excellent point and why comparing Crosby (with or without a confirmed concussion history) to a player like Bergeron (who came back from a concussion history) or Lindros (who didn't) can't really be done.

All I am trying to argue is that there is a risk in taking him, especially over a (imo) stud like Ovechkin. The masses are obviously very willing to take the risk, based on this poll, but I think if we ran this poll a month ago the results would have been greatly different.

[blayze]

There is no definitive proof that Crosby specifically had a concussion........ There is actually no definitive proof that he experienced a concussion or substantial head injury from the MRI and CAT scans that he underwent. As far as predicting his future, you can only look at the neck injury, any discussion of a concussion is effectively null.

"Any discussion of a concussion is effectively null"??? I don't think I can give a serious response to that comment lol

If we go along with what you're saying, then really there's no definitive proof that anyone has ever had a concussion.

[Pengwin7]

(I'm not getting into the current debate. Just here to post my answer.)

Crosby for me.

Here is why:
Without a 1st round draft pick, the best that a fantasy GM could do with a team is... maybe 6th/12.
Now, consider you are told you can either add:
a) Crosby
b) Ovechkin

Option a) Case I: Healthy Crosby. You finish 1st.
Option a) Case II: Injured Crosby. You finish 6th.

Option b) Case I: The Ovechkin of Recent. You finish 2nd or 3rd.


I don't like finishing 2nd or 3rd.
Ovechkin hasn't shown anything recently that suggests he's ELITE.
My 1st round pick has to have the potential to WIN me a pool... and Ovechkin doesn't have that power anymore.

So the answer is Crosby.

[Atomic Wedgy]

Not sure what all the debate is here. For anyone claiming Crosby is better, I swear gaa this video makes your argument invalid:

http://bit.ly/H2QTBg

[Carcillo]

Sidney Crosby tied Alex Ovechkin in assists last night. Crosby has 27 assists in just 20 games. Ovechkin has 27 assists in 76 (!) games.