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Thread: [chatter] Sens/Avs deal centered around Duchene in works?

  1. #16
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    Default Re: [chatter] Sens/Avs deal centered around Duchene in works?

    I'm talking about his 82 game pace, he's on pace for 55 over 82 games. That's all that matters. If he missed games then you factor that into why he is on pace for 51 this year...

    I don't see how you can legitimately call 59 points last year a disappointment. He scored 30 goals. If you think that's disappointing, your valuations are way off.

    55 points is not worth $4 million. It's absolutely worth $5+ million. That's the going rate these days, minimum.

    2009-10: 55 points. A great rookie season.
    2010-11: 67 points. Good season.
    2011-12: 28 points. Bad season.
    2012-13: 43 points. Great season.
    2013-14: 70 points. Great season.
    2014-15: 55 points. Good season
    2015-16: 59 points. Great season - he scored 30 goals.
    2016-17: 36 points, on pace for 51. Good season on a terrible team.

    IMO, he's only had one bad season, four great seasons. Rest are good/expected.

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    Default Re: [chatter] Sens/Avs deal centered around Duchene in works?

    Quote Originally Posted by The Iron Sheik View Post
    I'm talking about his 82 game pace, he's on pace for 55 over 82 games. That's all that matters. If he missed games then you factor that into why he is on pace for 51 this year...

    I don't see how you can legitimately call 59 points last year a disappointment. He scored 30 goals. If you think that's disappointing, your valuations are way off.

    55 points is not worth $4 million. It's absolutely worth $5+ million. That's the going rate these days, minimum.

    2009-10: 55 points. A great rookie season.
    2010-11: 67 points. Good season.
    2011-12: 28 points. Bad season.
    2012-13: 43 points. Great season.
    2013-14: 70 points. Great season.
    2014-15: 55 points. Good season
    2015-16: 59 points. Great season - he scored 30 goals.
    2016-17: 36 points, on pace for 51. Good season on a terrible team.

    IMO, he's only had one bad season, four great seasons. Rest are good/expected.
    Can we put this in perspective? those three really good seasons were great for him. They are not great, in comparison to others in the same year, or historically great. they're really good seasons - FOR HIM. A 30 goal season is not by any standards a definable 'great' year. Maybe for that specific player - okay, granted that. Grabner is having a Great year... for him - but by no other measure can his season be defined as GREAT.

    Crosby is having a great year, Burns is having a great year - both within current hockey era standards qualify as historically great. Seguin is having a really good year.

    Make no mistake, Duchene is a clear upgrade at C over Brassard and arguably is a better Centre than Turris. It's a really solid addition if they pull it off and it definitely makes their top 6 much more threatening. I think the person that would benefit the most from Duchene would be Bobby Ryan - a real high tempo, fast C - might just re-energize him.

    But lets put context on Duchene's 'great' seasons and compare them solely to his own career and no other player... cuz I will never believe a 60pt season is a great season in any broader context
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  3. #18
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    Default Re: [chatter] Sens/Avs deal centered around Duchene in works?

    Wait? A $6-million player on pace for 51 points is a good season? a 55-point season is good? I guess we'll have to disagree on what is or isn't a good season.

    Writer of the weekly Top 10 column.

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    Default Re: [chatter] Sens/Avs deal centered around Duchene in works?

    That 30 goal season saw him shoot 15%, above his norm of 12%, so it's an outlier. 200 shots is solid though, so I say he's a 20-25 goal guy I think and 30-35 assists seems fair making him a 55 point guy who will give you seasons of 50 and 60, maybe 65 if he gets the bounces. That's valuable, and for a center, the $6 million price tag seems about right these days. Although I do think the listed price is too high.

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    Default Re: [chatter] Sens/Avs deal centered around Duchene in works?

    I don't think anyone is getting duchene for a 55 point season. They are absolutely thinking he can get back to 70ish IMO.

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    Default Re: [chatter] Sens/Avs deal centered around Duchene in works?

    Quote Originally Posted by lucafen4 View Post
    Can we put this in perspective? those three really good seasons were great for him. They are not great, in comparison to others in the same year, or historically great. they're really good seasons - FOR HIM. A 30 goal season is not by any standards a definable 'great' year. Maybe for that specific player - okay, granted that. Grabner is having a Great year... for him - but by no other measure can his season be defined as GREAT.

    Crosby is having a great year, Burns is having a great year - both within current hockey era standards qualify as historically great. Seguin is having a really good year.

    Make no mistake, Duchene is a clear upgrade at C over Brassard and arguably is a better Centre than Turris. It's a really solid addition if they pull it off and it definitely makes their top 6 much more threatening. I think the person that would benefit the most from Duchene would be Bobby Ryan - a real high tempo, fast C - might just re-energize him.

    But lets put context on Duchene's 'great' seasons and compare them solely to his own career and no other player... cuz I will never believe a 60pt season is a great season in any broader context
    He wouldn't play c on Ottawa. Like I just said.

    If you don't think 60 points is great nowadays then you just don't understand how to value players. 30 goals is a great year for any player in today's NHL. Without question.

    I'm not going to debate this further because it's hard to debate with people stuck in the past. Players don't score a lot these days guys

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    Default Re: [chatter] Sens/Avs deal centered around Duchene in works?

    I would be pissed if Ottawa did this deal

  8. #23
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    Default Re: [chatter] Sens/Avs deal centered around Duchene in works?

    Quote Originally Posted by The Iron Sheik View Post
    30 goals is a great year for any player in today's NHL. Without question.
    Problem is, he's done it once in eight seasons (and has only been above 25 twice). It's not like considered a goal scorer or has put up 25-plus goal seasons consistently.

    Writer of the weekly Top 10 column.

    12-team Keeper pool, straight points for forwards & dmen. Goalies get: 2 points per win, 3 per shutout, 1 point per assist & 1 point per shootout loss.

    League champ in 2013, 2015, 2018, 2020 and 2022.

    Top 8 forwards, 5 dmen and 2 goalies count.

    We keep 15 players (any position) plus two rookies.

    Forwards: Panarin, Ovechkin, Kopitar, Stamkos, Tuch, Rust, Marchessault, Pavelski, Miller, Bertuzzi, Stone, Kakko, Brown, Stankoven, Kovalenko
    Defence: Hedman, Fox, Matheson, Thrun, Jiricek
    Goalies: Kochetkov, Talbot, Vasilevskiy, Campbell, Schmid


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