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Thread: Dare I deal Mcdavid?

  1. #16
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    Default Re: Dare I deal Mcdavid?

    go get Luongo or Lehner for a much cheaper price. Keep McDavid and shore up your Goaltending. when you're near the top and making a run, it's who you have that got you there - don't rip off the head of the monster and expect the same result.
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    Default Re: Dare I deal Mcdavid?

    Yup keep McJesus. Unless there is a large over payment in return. Maybe look at dealing Marchand, Krug or Klingy ...pkg deal with Rinne for a better goalie.
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    Default Re: Dare I deal Mcdavid?

    go after a Talbot or someone along those lines, Holtby price never worth it for most part and dealing McJesus you do not want to do.
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    Default Re: Dare I deal Mcdavid?

    This also has to be considered - Holtby gets rested towards the end of the year. He has played less this season than in years past but I could still see Grubauer getting more time than usual. He is a very capable back-up, so Trotz doesn't hesitate to use him when he feels resting Holtby is the best thing to do.
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    Default Re: Dare I deal Mcdavid?

    Quote Originally Posted by als_revenge View Post
    I'm somewhat surprised at how many people are basically telling you to play to lose this year. so that maybe one other year you win. boogles my mind, really.

    I owned McDavid in two keepers. traded him last year in both. And won a championship in both. No regrets here.
    That's great for you, but perhaps you have a better supporting cast than he does. McDavid is by far his best keeper and looking at his situation, it may be completely different from yours.

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    Default Re: Dare I deal Mcdavid?

    Quote Originally Posted by islefan31 View Post
    That's great for you, but perhaps you have a better supporting cast than he does. McDavid is by far his best keeper and looking at his situation, it may be completely different from yours.
    Just to add to that, in a H2H playoff...I'll take the scoring over a goalie any day. Goalies are way to unpredictable and there's more chance of B2B games that they will miss or get saddled against a really good team.

    10 team H2H !Y League (4 keepers - at least 1 must be a D-man OR Goalie)
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  7. #22
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    Default Re: Dare I deal Mcdavid?

    There are packages out there that warrant McDavid. These are not them.

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  8. #23
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    Default Re: Dare I deal Mcdavid?

    Trust me I have tried to bolster my goaltending with offers including pkg deals mentioned like klingberg/rinne etc etc. All goalies mentioned above like talbot/lehner/luongo (tbh I don't consider luongo much of an improvement over rinne or greiss if at all..) are owned by playoff teams or teams fighting for the final spot so their owners aren't budging easily. 14 team league means goalies are scarce and I guess valued a lot more than in a 10 team league.


    Also, now that I have the time I'll explain my thinking on possibly trading mcd/vas for holtby/kuz/Hayes.
    This all started when a buddy who is out of the playoff race and I started chatting hockey and possible trades. i tried some offers on holtby but he wouldn't even listen to them.. till I half jokingly threw mcdavids name out knowing I prob couldn't ever pull the trigger on it..Then I started thinking about it and this is what I came up with.

    First I should clearly state that this is a h2h league for categories not points.
    We have Two C/ two lw/two rw/ 3/d 2/g 1/utl roster spots per day.

    - the obv-I secure one of the top two goalies in the league for playoffs and no brainer keeper going forward.

    Who will I keep out of the 3 I have now? The plan from start of season was I'd be keeping vas at end of the year... but now..hmmm not so much. I don't like any of my options of the 3 to keep but do I wanna go to draft hoping I can draft better? This has been plaguing my thoughts for over a month.

    - giving up Mcdavid but getting back kuz and Hayes combined I thought would make up for if not equal greater than mcd's G, A pts and +/- and sog cats. mcd prob does out scores them both combined for the ppp cat. Then there's the hits, and Fow cats. Mcdavid doesn't hit, kuz and Hayes don't much either. Mcdavid's fow's are pretty bad-I do understand he should get better at faceoffs over time but the two-kuz/Hayes are beating him in both those cats alone right now and combined they are far ahead.

    3. Hayes has some added value being c/rw eligible

    4. Kuz/Hayes are both young and can still improve. Kuz more so I think. Hayes is def more of a gamble. I'll state the obv b4 someone else does-yes I know Mcdavid will get even better too.

    5. Yes I think kuz/Hayes will make my 8 keepers am I wrong?

    my possible 8 keepers with mcd are:
    Mcd
    Marchand
    Trocheck
    Kane
    horvat
    carlson
    then I have some decisions to make for the last two between krug/saad/zib/stepan/rinne/vas/greiss

    keepers if I did the trade.
    Trocheck
    Marchand
    Kane
    Horvat
    Carlson
    Kuz
    Hayes
    Holtby

    or does Hayes not make the cut? He's ranked 24th using our cats as of right now fwiw.

    All this being said.. I do get it for the most part..you just don't trade a player like Mcdavid. I am convinced not to do it.

    now lemme have it again ! Plz do point out some flaws in my thoughts

    - - - Updated - - -

    Trust me I have tried to bolster my goaltending with offers including pkg deals mentioned like klingberg/rinne etc etc. All goalies mentioned above like talbot/lehner/luongo (tbh I don't consider luongo much of an improvement over rinne or greiss if at all..) are owned by playoff teams or teams fighting for the final spot so their owners aren't budging easily. 14 team league means goalies are scarce and I guess valued a lot more than in a 10 team league.


    Also, now that I have the time I'll explain my thinking on possibly trading mcd/vas for holtby/kuz/Hayes.
    This all started when a buddy who is out of the playoff race and I started chatting hockey and possible trades. i tried some offers on holtby but he wouldn't even listen to them.. till I half jokingly threw mcdavids name out knowing I prob couldn't ever pull the trigger on it..Then I started thinking about it and this is what I came up with.

    First I should clearly state that this is a h2h league for categories not points.
    We have Two C/ two lw/two rw/ 3/d 2/g 1/utl roster spots per day.

    - the obv-I secure one of the top two goalies in the league for playoffs and no brainer keeper going forward.

    Who will I keep out of the 3 I have now? The plan from start of season was I'd be keeping vas at end of the year... but now..hmmm not so much. I don't like any of my options of the 3 to keep but do I wanna go to draft hoping I can draft better? This has been plaguing my thoughts for over a month.

    - giving up Mcdavid but getting back kuz and Hayes combined I thought would make up for if not equal greater than mcd's G, A pts and +/- and sog cats. mcd prob does out scores them both combined for the ppp cat. Then there's the hits, and Fow cats. Mcdavid doesn't hit, kuz and Hayes don't much either. Mcdavid's fow's are pretty bad-I do understand he should get better at faceoffs over time but the two-kuz/Hayes are beating him in both those cats alone right now and combined they are far ahead.

    3. Hayes has some added value being c/rw eligible

    4. Kuz/Hayes are both young and can still improve. Kuz more so I think. Hayes is def more of a gamble. I'll state the obv b4 someone else does-yes I know Mcdavid will get even better too.

    5. Yes I think kuz/Hayes will make my 8 keepers am I wrong?

    my possible 8 keepers with mcd are:
    Mcd
    Marchand
    Trocheck
    Kane
    horvat
    carlson
    then I have some decisions to make for the last two between krug/saad/zib/stepan/rinne/vas/greiss

    keepers if I did the trade.
    Trocheck
    Marchand
    Kane
    Horvat
    Carlson
    Kuz
    Hayes
    Holtby

    or does Hayes not make the cut? He's ranked 24th using our cats as of right now fwiw.

    All this being said.. I do get it for the most part..you just don't trade a player like Mcdavid. I am convinced not to do it.

    now lemme have it again ! Plz do point out some flaws in my thoughts
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    Default Re: Dare I deal Mcdavid?

    so your looking at McD/Krug/Greiss vs Kuz/Hayes/Holtby (at least that's what I would do in your situation A), as the other guys are all the same in both scenarios. That wouldn't be enough of an overall big picture upgrade for me. Holtby's a fantastic goalie to have, but the G position can be so volatile from year to year.

    my other thought is...your thinking of selling McDavid, the most valuable piece in any keeper league, what are other owners offering? I know you're thinking of going for the title this year, but if you're set on selling McDavid, you might be better off doing an auction in the summer and set yourself up for back-back-back-back titles.

    I get the feeling your doing most of the "work" in this trade negotiation, where I feel like the person acquiring McDavid should be the one doing most of the work. FWIW's, if I were in your shoes looking at that offer on the table, I'm clicking "decline". If I were the other guy, I'm clicking "accept" before the page finishes loading.

    - - - Updated - - -

    so your looking at McD/Krug/Greiss vs Kuz/Hayes/Holtby (at least that's what I would do in your situation A), as the other guys are all the same in both scenarios. That wouldn't be enough of an overall big picture upgrade for me. Holtby's a fantastic goalie to have, but the G position can be so volatile from year to year.

    my other thought is...your thinking of selling McDavid, the most valuable piece in any keeper league, what are other owners offering? I know you're thinking of going for the title this year, but if you're set on selling McDavid, you might be better off doing an auction in the summer and set yourself up for back-back-back-back titles.

    I get the feeling your doing most of the "work" in this trade negotiation, where I feel like the person acquiring McDavid should be the one doing most of the work. FWIW's, if I were in your shoes looking at that offer on the table, I'm clicking "decline". If I were the other guy, I'm clicking "accept" before the page finishes loading.
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  10. #25
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    Default Re: Dare I deal Mcdavid?

    Quote Originally Posted by als_revenge View Post
    I'm somewhat surprised at how many people are basically telling you to play to lose this year. so that maybe one other year you win. boogles my mind, really.

    I owned McDavid in two keepers. traded him last year in both. And won a championship in both. No regrets here.

    I don't think that the advise given is to "play to lose this year". I think the sentiment is that:

    A) The original deal is not a good one for the overall make up of his keeper team moving forward.
    B) The is always another way to get from point A to point B
    C) If you are trading McDavid you should be asking for much more that what was offered.
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    Default Re: Dare I deal Mcdavid?

    Abovebelow - your breakdown isn't illogical but McDavid demands an illogical return. A return that you can't refuse no matter how badly you want to keep the best keeper available.

    Something like Holtby, Malkin, Kuz or karlsson. I know, it's crazy and illogical but I've seen people pay more. There is value to having the best option, some people will mortgage multiple seasons to acquire him. Only trade him to one of those people.

    If you're serious about trading him you should also let your entire league know. I can almost guarantee you'll get some way better offers than the one above.

    It's still a hard no on your offer and it's not even close for me.
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    Default Re: Dare I deal Mcdavid?

    Quote Originally Posted by MZac View Post
    I need two stand out stars and another piece before I even consider giving up McDavid. His price is ridiculously high because he is the best keeper available.

    I'd want Holtby and a karlsson/burns/Malkin/tarasenko/Mathews etc and another piece. And I'd only be sending back players that I'd have to drop.

    Again, I know it's a ridiculous price but u have the best player and if someone else wants him you make them pay. If they won't pay keep the best player.

    I don't do the original trade, not enough. I keep McDavid.

    - - - Updated - - -

    I need two stand out stars and another piece before I even consider giving up McDavid. His price is ridiculously high because he is the best keeper available.

    I'd want Holtby and a karlsson/burns/Malkin/tarasenko/Mathews etc and another piece. And I'd only be sending back players that I'd have to drop.

    Again, I know it's a ridiculous price but u have the best player and if someone else wants him you make them pay. If they won't pay keep the best player.

    I don't do the original trade, not enough. I keep McDavid.
    this makes sense to me.
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    Default Re: Dare I deal Mcdavid?

    Another scenario would be that you would have to get a ridiculous amount of draft picks on top of several above average players (also depends what your picks are worth and if you would be drafting keeper level players with those picks).

    - - - Updated - - -

    Another scenario would be that you would have to get a ridiculous amount of draft picks on top of several above average players (also depends what your picks are worth and if you would be drafting keeper level players with those picks).
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    G+A = 1pt, Dman G+A = 1.5pt, PPG =1pt, PPA = 0.5pt, SHG = 1pt, SHA = 0.5pt, ShootoutG = 0.25pt, GWG = 1pt, Hatty = 3pt, DMan Hatty = 5pt, +/- (For D only) = +/- 0.5pt, W = 2pt, L = -1pt, OTL = 1pt, ShootoutL = 0.5pt, SO = 1pt, S = 0.1pt, GA = -0.5pt, Goalie Goal = 5pt

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    Default Re: Dare I deal Mcdavid?

    Thx for the input guys. Much appreciated!
    Yahoo Keeper league. 14 teams h2h Cats. Start 2 C/lw/rw/3D/2G/1utl daily.
    Keep 8.
    Scoring Cats:G-A-Pts-ppp-gwg-(+/-) -sog-fw-hits-blk / W-L-Gaa-sv%-Sho.

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    Lindholm, pavelski, zucker, smith
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  15. #30
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    Default Re: Dare I deal Mcdavid?

    Keep MacDavid, he will be 1st for 10-15 years. Holtby is not slouch either. For me he is 1st G right now, but for how long, with G you never know.

    Yes there will be a Jones, Talbot, somewhere but there are also some Mason, Markstrom...
    1) 16 teams full keeper H2H. Start 9F, 4D, 1G, 2 Championships
    pts: (D : 7 pts G /5 pts A), (F : 5pts G /3 pts A), (G : 10 pts W / 5 pts SO), (D/F : 1 pt +/-, 0.5 pts PIM, 0.1 FOW, 0.2 Hits, 0.3 pts SOG, PP and SH).

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