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Thread: Pavalec Experiment Over Yet?

  1. #31
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    Default Re: Pavalec Experiment Over Yet?

    Quote Originally Posted by BreadManPanarin View Post
    Yeah, I feel you man. I admitted as much when I said "the third and probably most influential being that I own Hellebuyck". That being said, there's no way anyone can convince me that Pavelec is a better goalie than Hellebuyck in the here and now, unless the stats start to reflect it. I'm just too much of a stubborn stat-head. lol

    If Pavelec keeps getting leash and brings his GAA and Save % down to be a better level than Hellebuyck was able to manage so far this year, then I will surrender the point. Until then, I believe that the goalie who gives up less goals and saves a higher percent of shots always gives the team its best chance to win. I'm not saying I am right, and this isn't a point of argument. Just expressing my opinion.

    You're looking at very small sample sizes and finding marginal differences between them. The Jets probably just want to see if maybe Pavelec would get hot and/or if some rest would do good for Hellebuyck. Maybe they should have done the change before Hellebuyck became waiver eligible so that they could have sent him down for a while to see how Pavelec fares but I doubt they keep Hellebuyck stapled to the bench for months anyways, so no harm done.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jouko-Pouko View Post
    The Jets probably just want to see if maybe Pavelec would get hot and/or if some rest would do good for Hellebuyck.
    Yup. Makes perfect sense. At the risk of repeating myself ad nauseam, I can't fault them one single bit for checking to see if Pavelec could get hot and be a difference maker. I just think that after 4 mediocre performances it is time to sprinkle some Helly in and see if the 6 game benching lit a fire under him.

    Edit: just saw that Helly is confirmed starter for tonight in Chicago. Glad to see the Jets agree it is time to get him back in there, and hope he can answer the bell.

  3. #33
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    Nice game for Helly last night. 3 goals allowed, but that is understandable considering he faced 41 shots on the road from a tough team.

    Hopefully he can put Pavelec in a back seat role and leave him there for a while.

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    Default Re: Pavalec Experiment Over Yet?

    Quote Originally Posted by BreadManPanarin View Post
    Nice game for Helly last night. 3 goals allowed, but that is understandable considering he faced 41 shots on the road from a tough team.

    Hopefully he can put Pavelec in a back seat role and leave him there for a while.
    I'd have to think they still hope to obtain something for Pavelec prior to the deadline. Now that they've made to move to bring him up, I'd expect them to continue with the pretense that he's a viable NHL goalie that other teams should look to acquire. Provided he doesn't become an embarrassment, of course.

    I also think they may have decided that it was too much, too soon for Helle.

    I guess what I'm saying is that I would lower your expectations to a 50-50 split until Pavelec gets moved, assuming that even happens.


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    Quote Originally Posted by Instant Karma View Post
    I guess what I'm saying is that I would lower your expectations to a 50-50 split until Pavelec gets moved, assuming that even happens.
    I can live with 50/50... as long as we don't see Pavelec in 4 straight outings again!

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    Default Re: Pavalec Experiment Over Yet?

    Quote Originally Posted by BreadManPanarin View Post
    I can live with 50/50... as long as we don't see Pavelec in 4 straight outings again!
    I think it's clear that things weren't going to plan for Hellboy and they were looking to give him some kind of respite.


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  7. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by Instant Karma View Post
    I think it's clear that things weren't going to plan for Hellboy and they were looking to give him some kind of respite.
    Agreed. He had a decent 16-13-1 record and .913 Save % for the season (and had just come off a shutout) going into those two games where he gave up 3 goals early and got pulled in each. They probably just wanted to reboot him and get him back on track. Hopefully mission accomplished.


  8. #38
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    Default Re: Pavalec Experiment Over Yet?

    Quote Originally Posted by BreadManPanarin View Post
    Agreed. He had a decent 16-13-1 record and .913 Save % for the season (and had just come off a shutout) going into those two games where he gave up 3 goals early and got pulled in each. They probably just wanted to reboot him and get him back on track. Hopefully mission accomplished.

    Helle has Blues and Stars coming out of the break. Hope he doesn't get shafted due to the tougher matchups. Avs are after that so that's always a nice matchup

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    Karma pretty much nailed it. They hope to get something for Pavelec at the deadline. It was a low risk (he really couldn't be worse than Helle/Hutch had been) and potential reward (pavelec plays great and they decide to run with him or better yet raise his trade value) situation. Unfortunately he played just as you would expect. Pretty Meh. If I'm the Jets I send Hutchinson down and 1A/1B Pavelec and Hellebucyk for a few weeks and hope Pavelec can put together a few respectable starts and then get a draft pick for him. That's why he is up.
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    Default Re: Pavalec Experiment Over Yet?

    Quote Originally Posted by tweetdrivr View Post
    Karma pretty much nailed it. They hope to get something for Pavelec at the deadline. It was a low risk (he really couldn't be worse than Helle/Hutch had been) and potential reward (pavelec plays great and they decide to run with him or better yet raise his trade value) situation. Unfortunately he played just as you would expect. Pretty Meh. If I'm the Jets I send Hutchinson down and 1A/1B Pavelec and Hellebucyk for a few weeks and hope Pavelec can put together a few respectable starts and then get a draft pick for him. That's why he is up.
    I agree with this synopsis...
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  11. #41
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    Default Re: Pavalec Experiment Over Yet?

    Htchinson has to go through waivers so he will stay up... Think we are in a win and you're in situation with the Jets right now

    - - - Updated - - -

    Htchinson has to go through waivers so he will stay up... Think we are in a win and you're in situation with the Jets right now
    Experience is the teacher of all things.


  12. #42
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    Default Re: Pavalec Experiment Over Yet?

    Quote Originally Posted by tweetdrivr View Post
    Karma pretty much nailed it. They hope to get something for Pavelec at the deadline. It was a low risk (he really couldn't be worse than Helle/Hutch had been) and potential reward (pavelec plays great and they decide to run with him or better yet raise his trade value) situation. Unfortunately he played just as you would expect. Pretty Meh. If I'm the Jets I send Hutchinson down and 1A/1B Pavelec and Hellebucyk for a few weeks and hope Pavelec can put together a few respectable starts and then get a draft pick for him. That's why he is up.
    I can't stop responding to this thread because I find the narrative that Hellebuyck had been consistently bad very annoying. Hellebuyck had not been bad, he had been inconsistent.

    Here's his 10 games before the 2 games that he pooped the bed and got benched:
    3-2 Loss to EDM - 3 Goals Allowed on 30 shots. .900 save %. Below average game.
    4-3 Shootout Win over FLA - 3 goals allowed on 44 shots / .932 save% / Very Strong Game - Helly won this one for them.
    4 - 1 Win over COL - 1 goal allowed on 28 shots / .964 save % / Very strong game, albeit against a weak opponent.
    1 - 4 Loss to Vancouver - 3 goals allowed on 23 shots / .870 save % / weak game, but they wouldn't have won unless he stole that game 1-0 or won it 2-1 in OT.
    3 - 1 win at CHI - 1 goal allowed on 34 shots / .971 save % / Very strong game - Helly won this one for them.
    2 - 6 loss vs NYI - 4 goals allowed on 15 shots / .733 save % / very weak game - showing his inconsistency.
    6 - 4 loss to TB - 4 goals allowed on 36 shots / .889 save % / weak game
    4 - 1 win at FLA - 1 goal allowed on 32 shots / .969 save % / Very strong game
    3 - 4 loss at BUF - 4 goals allowed on 36 shots / .889 save % / weak game
    2 - 0 win against CGY - 0 goals allowed on 28 shots / 1.0 save % / very strong game

    Then he pooped the bed twice and here we are. 6 games on the bench, and he wins his first game back in Chicago with 3 goals allowed on 41 shots, .927 save %. Very Strong Game.

    I guess my issue is that people are acting like he has been a bad goalie. No, he's been an inconsistent goalie. In his last 13 games he has had 6 very strong efforts where he had at least .927 save % and won the game. Then 4 weak games that were essentially on par with Pavelec's last two starts, and 3 absolute clunkers. Although who knows whether those two that he got pulled out of in the first period would have kept getting even uglier or if he would have composed himself and ended with 4 goals allowed on 30-40 shots to make it just a below average effort instead of a terrible one.

    I can accept a lot of what everyone has been saying, but I can't help getting frustrated by comments like:
    "he really couldn't be worse than Helle/Hutch had been" - he probably can't be as good as Helle has been either.
    "Maybe Hellebuyck is just not a real #1 goalie." - he's been a high end #1 goalie half the time lately. needs to get consistent.
    "Hellebuyck has been sub par most of the season" - He has switched off between great starts and poor starts for most of the season. He hasn't been sub-par on a consistent basis. Maybe this is just semantics...

    Again, I don't take issue with most of the points made in this thread. It just bothers me that it feels like people think Hellebuyck has been performing poorly on a consistent basis, when in fact he has been putting up very strong efforts half of the time and masking them in his overall numbers with poor efforts on other nights due to inconsistency. He is young, so he is still trying to figure out how to avoid the clunkers in between the great games. The only way he will become consistent is to keep getting out there and making mistakes and learning from them.

    /endrant.... sorry, couldn't help it. I'm sure I didn't change any minds, but at least I feel better now.

    If people just used the word "inconsistent" instead of "bad", then I don't think I could take any issue with any of the criticism. Guess I am just getting hung up on word choice.

  13. #43
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    Valid - I probably could have said Pavelec couldn't be more inconsistent the Helle/Hutch. But at the end of the day in hockey "good" means you consistently give your team a better then not chance of coming away with the 2 points. If you're inconsistent...well you're not good. And generally speaking that's bad.
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  14. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by tweetdrivr View Post
    Valid - I probably could have said Pavelec couldn't be more inconsistent the Helle/Hutch. But at the end of the day in hockey "good" means you consistently give you team a better then not chance of coming away with the 2 points. If you're inconsistent...well you're not good. And generally speaking that's bad.
    I can live with that clarification on what you meant by "bad".

  15. #45
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    Default Re: Pavalec Experiment Over Yet?

    Speaking for myself, I had been treating Hellebuyck as "Break Glass Only in Case of Fire" since somewhere around the holidays.

    Perhaps that was because I'm in first and fighting to remain there and I didn't want him jacking up the percentages that I was getting out of Jones, Andersen, and Saros.

    But I was only starting him when I felt it was absolutely necessary, which was not that often.


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