[Trade] - Sale to the Red Sox

[2014olympicgold]

At 175.5mill in payroll they better hope Ortiz and his 16mill doesn’t come back (that’s over the 13 players they have right now on their MLB roster). They’d be at like 230+mill if he came back for the regular season, and have massive penalties now.

They’ll be the team to beat in the AL East likely I’m not denying that. But the notion of them being high end contenders every yr because of their pitching is locked up and you remove any worries isn’t guaranteed.

2010 Giants: Lincecum and Matt Cain. Locked up for yrs.
2011: Halladay, Lee, Hamels, people were saying 3-peats
2012 Reds: Bailey, Latos, Cueto.
2013 Minor, Medlen, Teheran
2014 Nats: Fister would make their rotation a super rotation for yrs.
2015 CWS: Sale and Quintana.

Obviously Boston has hitting. But pitchers are usually the guys who are great, then nowhere close to what you’re expecting. They get older, breakdown, fade, and lose mechanics. But the BRS could have a pitching staff that finishes 1-2-3 in Cy Young. But, Price was also supposed to be a Cy Young pitcher last yr.

They’ll likely make the playoffs, but I’m just pencilling them in, not penning them in.

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That Thornburg signing is really under the radar, and I think he will be a guy that really shows the media this year that he's worth paying attention to. Those last two innings are going to be locked down with him and Kimbrel.

Trade. They traded Shaw+Dubon+Josh Pennington for him

[Eskimo Brother]

Trade. They traded Shaw+Dubon+Josh Pennington for him

Sorry, meant to write acquisition and somehow signing came out. Thanks for the correction

Also out of the trade of Shaw, seems to mean their committing to a more fit Sandoval this coming year. Could be a bargain at the draft table.

[2014olympicgold]

Ya that was one of my question marks for the team on my first post. I think hitting he may be fine, nowhere near what his paycheque says he should be tho. But at 3B, I dunno. He was never a great defensively, he had a great arm, but with size and age his range dropped a lot. He was forced to rush throws and with his back issue made throwing even harder.

I really don’t know how Pablo will play. Dudes arm strength is really good. His arm accuracy….I dunno. Especially with Hanley at 1B. He’s good, but he’s not bailing you out every throw.

[blayze]

Looks like the Bluejays missed their window and will be mediocre for the next 10 years with Eddy leaving town.

You'd think Rogers would shell out to field a competitive team coming off a season where the Jays led the league in attendance.

[2014olympicgold]

Looks like the Bluejays missed their window and will be mediocre for the next 10 years with Eddy leaving town.

You'd think Rogers would shell out to field a competitive team coming off a season where the Jays led the league in attendance.

Martin – 20mill
Tulo – 20mill
Donaldson – 17mill
Estrada – 14.5mill
Liriano – 13.67mill
Happ – 13mill
Morales – 10mill

Right now the Jays are 7^th-ish in payroll (121mill over 12 players). They are in front of teams like the Mets, Nationals, Cards, Royals, Angels, and Cubs.

Last yr the Jays were 11^th in payroll. Saying Rogers isn’t opening their purse strings is a lazy excuse I think. The fact they have 20mill tied up in a catcher I think is something EVERYONE overlooks, and as good as Tulo is…20mill is a lot for him.

Toronto pays out a lot. And this trade doesn’t even involved cash considerations. This was 100% awesome drafting by the BRS (And the guy who drafted most of the red sox core, Toronto has now).

[lucafen4]

At 175.5mill in payroll they better hope Ortiz and his 16mill doesn’t come back (that’s over the 13 players they have right now on their MLB roster). They’d be at like 230+mill if he came back for the regular season, and have massive penalties now.

They’ll be the team to beat in the AL East likely I’m not denying that. But the notion of them being high end contenders every yr because of their pitching is locked up and you remove any worries isn’t guaranteed.

2010 Giants: Lincecum and Matt Cain. Locked up for yrs.
2011: Halladay, Lee, Hamels, people were saying 3-peats
2012 Reds: Bailey, Latos, Cueto.
2013 Minor, Medlen, Teheran
2014 Nats: Fister would make their rotation a super rotation for yrs.
2015 CWS: Sale and Quintana.

Obviously Boston has hitting. But pitchers are usually the guys who are great, then nowhere close to what you’re expecting. They get older, breakdown, fade, and lose mechanics. But the BRS could have a pitching staff that finishes 1-2-3 in Cy Young. But, Price was also supposed to be a Cy Young pitcher last yr.

They’ll likely make the playoffs, but I’m just pencilling them in, not penning them in.

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Trade. They traded Shaw+Dubon+Josh Pennington for him

No, they don't want a 41 year old DH back who just hit .315 38, 127 ... They'd be absolutely foolish to consider bringing him back at $16m. (enter sarcasm)

The team, city and fans love him. He would be welcomed back with open arms. If they have to pay a penalty due to cap overages, so be it, if it means a playoff run into the World Series sign him up.

Paying the luxury tax has never bothered Boston before, why would they care now? If he calls and says he wants to play one more year - Boston asks how much, writes it up and he's signed same day.

[Axeman33]

I agree that you can't hand them anything at this point and that many teams look great on paper, only to fall short on the field.

All I was saying is that a very good team just got better, which is never a good thing for other teams in the division. 7

Replacing Ortiz will be tough but they had a pretty solid lineup even without Papi. I am not crowning anyone at this time, but that lineup, on paper, looks very good and will be tough.

[blayze]

Martin – 20mill
Tulo – 20mill
Donaldson – 17mill
Estrada – 14.5mill
Liriano – 13.67mill
Happ – 13mill
Morales – 10mill

Right now the Jays are 7^th-ish in payroll (121mill over 12 players). They are in front of teams like the Mets, Nationals, Cards, Royals, Angels, and Cubs.

Last yr the Jays were 11^th in payroll. Saying Rogers isn’t opening their purse strings is a lazy excuse I think. The fact they have 20mill tied up in a catcher I think is something EVERYONE overlooks, and as good as Tulo is…20mill is a lot for him.

Toronto pays out a lot. And this trade doesn’t even involved cash considerations. This was 100% awesome drafting by the BRS (And the guy who drafted most of the red sox core, Toronto has now).

I'm referring to Eddy... not Sales.

And they may be 7th-ish in payroll, but they were #1 in attendance and I'd bet they are among the highest in gross revenue across all sales channels. They have more money at their disposal than the majority of the other teams.

This is simply what happens when a sports-club is owned by a short-term profit focused corporation instead of passionate high-net-worth individual(s).

[2014olympicgold]

No, they don't want a 41 year old DH back who just hit .315 38, 127 ... They'd be absolutely foolish to consider bringing him back at $16m. (enter sarcasm)

The team, city and fans love him. He would be welcomed back with open arms. If they have to pay a penalty due to cap overages, so be it, if it means a playoff run into the World Series sign him up.

Paying the luxury tax has never bothered Boston before, why would they care now? If he calls and says he wants to play one more year - Boston asks how much, writes it up and he's signed same day.

1, Ortiz had his club option extended as a nice gesture by the Red Sox knowing he was retiring. They wouldn’t “Sign” him, they would be forced to pay him I do believe.
2, read up on how much the new luxury tax penalties hurt you now with the new CBA. Going multiple yrs in a row over it screws you over. Boston would have to rid themselves of a contract to make Ortiz work, and teams would ask for a prospect attached to the pay dump trade.

Yes they wouldn’t say no, but 1 more yr of a 40 yr old DH, having Many/Moreland sit because the other can’t DH now, trading away another prospect isn’t ideal. If I was the GM I’d say behind closed doors no, but to save face to the Boston community I wouldn’t publically say “Stay away Ortiz”.

I'm referring to Eddy... not Sales.

And they may be 7th-ish in payroll, but they were #1 in attendance and I'd bet they are among the highest in gross revenue across all sales channels. They have more money at their disposal than the majority of the other teams.

This is simply what happens when a sports-club is owned by a short-term profit focused corporation instead of passionate high-net-worth individual(s).

Attendance isn’t the only thing that runs profit, and yes they do have more money than the majority of teams (thus top 10 in payroll). But to constantly go with “Rogers sucks because they won’t pay” is lazy because they are in the top 25 percentile.

Yankees, Boston, Cubs, and Dodgers will always be at the top of the payroll. Always. Tigers are 3^rd right now and they can’t afford to keep their players. San Fran is now 4^th with top end signings. Rangers are up there because of the Fielder contract I do believe (paying someone who isn’t playing {but not really paying him}). Rangers are paying like 20+mill to players not on the team (Fielder, Hamilton, Holland).

I personally think short term focus on profit is something the Tigers have done. They had a good team with good attendance and money coming in based on team success and spent. Players regressed, team started to lose, people stopped watching. Now they’re screwed.

I do understand that when owned by a company they see the team as a profit generator (why else would they be involved anyways) and a person with a lot of money sees it as a chance to win the ship. I’m not disagreeing with you that Rogers won’t ever say “here’s a blank cheque, do what you want”, but they have been surprisingly generous over the last 2-3yrs when it comes to signing players (Martin, Donaldson), and taking on contracts via trade (Liriano, Tulo).

[Run!]

Looks like the Bluejays missed their window and will be mediocre for the next 10 years with Eddy leaving town.

You'd think Rogers would shell out to field a competitive team coming off a season where the Jays led the league in attendance.

I think Sale will not perform well in Boston. He's already shown he has a lack of control and that market could prove difficult for someone with his temperament.

Besides, this is the type of comment I'd expect from a Canucks fan :-)




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Looks like the Bluejays missed their window and will be mediocre for the next 10 years with Eddy leaving town.

You'd think Rogers would shell out to field a competitive team coming off a season where the Jays led the league in attendance.

I think Sale will not perform well in Boston. He's already shown he has a lack of control and that market could prove difficult for someone with his temperament.

Besides, this is the type of comment I'd expect from a Canucks fan :-)

[TheWhale]

Shout out to OG for listing some of the $ amounts attached to players on the Jays current roster. Sure doesn't look like we need more 30 year olds making $20M on this roster imo. I absolutely cannot stand hearing fans think they are owed a big FA splash for attending games. Fans attended games and we're rewarded with playoff ball. The organization owes you nothing more.

Besides, how many big FA's are there that this team should really go after? They already offered way more than anyone else will for EE. They have supposedly made a 4 year $60mil offer for Fowler. But as you can see with the examples above, you can offer all you want but the player has to be willing to come to Toronto at that price as well.

Just because you have the money doesn't mean you should spend it foolishly. Let this front office build the Jays from the farm up. This way, down the road, they too can make a splash and acquiring some all Stars through trade in the off season.

[2014olympicgold]

Also, when I say signing Donaldson, I mean resigning. He’s at like 17mill/yr