Has Murray made Fleury expendable

[Loch]

I always figured that it would be another playoff implosion against the Islanders that finally ended Fleury's time with the Pens...

[Zorro]

I actually find it very funny that some people, even Flames fans, are saying that Fleury for a 2nd rounder is fair.. HaHa.. If that is all Calgary is offering for a starting goalie and a pretty good one at that, then you are going to be waiting a long time for something like that to happen..

Calgary is not in the position to win 2 or 3 rounds in the playoffs, so they might aswell wait on making a deal for that stud starter down the line..

[rataylor22]

I actually find it very funny that some people, even Flames fans, are saying that Fleury for a 2nd rounder is fair.. HaHa.. If that is all Calgary is offering for a starting goalie and a pretty good one at that, then you are going to be waiting a long time for something like that to happen..

Calgary is not in the position to win 2 or 3 rounds in the playoffs, so they might aswell wait on making a deal for that stud starter down the line..

Who said it's fair? If that's what market dictates, that's what market dictates. Fact of it is, Fleury is not Schneider, or Jones, or Andersen. He's on the way down, not on the way up. If Pittsburgh is hoping to get a Schneider-like return for Fleury, well then they're going to lose on of Fleury or Murray for nothing in an expansion draft.

Luongo was traded for Jacob Markstrom and Shawn Matthais. Not identical situations, but not totally dissimilar ones either. If you think it's going to be a big haul for Fleury, well, it just won't be.

[yougo]

Who said it's fair? If that's what market dictates, that's what market dictates. Fact of it is, Fleury is not Schneider, or Jones, or Andersen. He's on the way down, not on the way up. If Pittsburgh is hoping to get a Schneider-like return for Fleury, well then they're going to lose on of Fleury or Murray for nothing in an expansion draft.

Luongo was traded for Jacob Markstrom and Shawn Matthais. Not identical situations, but not totally dissimilar ones either. If you think it's going to be a big haul for Fleury, well, it just won't be.

You are right, Fleury is not Schneider,Jones or Andersen. Fleury has a better track record than them, has actually won something of worth in the NHL(Cup + another SC Final). And don't compare Luongo to Fleury, Luongo has an albatross of a contract. Fleury's contract isn't even close to be that bad.

Fleury had better numbers than Jones or Andersen this year, playing behind a much worse defensive corps also.

NB: I think Schneider is a top5 goalie in the NHL and Fleury a top10ish. But Schneider is not even close to have proven what Fleury does. I mean Fleury is a year older, but he's got more than the double total of wins and games played.

[rataylor22]

You are right, Fleury is not Schneider,Jones or Andersen. Fleury has a better track record than them, has actually won something of worth in the NHL(Cup + another SC Final). And don't compare Luongo to Fleury, Luongo has an albatross of a contract. Fleury's contract isn't even close to be that bad.

Fleury had better numbers than Jones or Andersen this year, playing behind a much worse defensive corps also.

NB: I think Schneider is a top5 goalie in the NHL and Fleury a top10ish. But Schneider is not even close to have proven what Fleury does. I mean Fleury is a year older, but he's got more than the double total of wins and games played.

Fleury is actually almost 2 years older, and Schneider wasn't traded this year. He was traded when he was 27. So that's 5 years difference by the time December rolls around next year. Same with Andersen. Age is key. Teams aren't overpaying for back 9 players anymore.

[Instant Karma]

What would we think are the chances that Calgary is on the list of teams that Fleury would accept a trade to?

[Yonald]

I would think that Fleury just wants to play somewhere. He still has good years left in him and if Calgary were an option I think he would go there.

[Axeman33]

What would we think are the chances that Calgary is on the list of teams that Fleury would accept a trade to?

If I had to guess, I'd say Montreal is the only Canadian city that he WOULD accept a trade to. That's probably because he knows the chances of that happening are slim to none.

[rataylor22]

What would we think are the chances that Calgary is on the list of teams that Fleury would accept a trade to?

If I had to guess, I'd say Montreal is the only Canadian city that he WOULD accept a trade to. That's probably because he knows the chances of that happening are slim to none.

I doubt if Pittsburgh approaches him about a trade, regardless of his list, he would approve it.

[Moses]

*IF* you want to believe the narrative that the NHL will have an expansion draft in the next 12 months *AND* that teams will only allowed to protect one goalie *THEN* the goalie market is going to be flooded prior to the expansion draft with teams trying to retain some value for an asset before losing it for nothing.

[yougo]

Teams aren't overpaying for back 9 players anymore.

What? Mind if I disagree here ?

I get your point, but your undervaluing Fleury big time here (and perhaps I'm overvaluing him).

[rataylor22]

*IF* you want to believe the narrative that the NHL will have an expansion draft in the next 12 months *AND* that teams will only allowed to protect one goalie *THEN* the goalie market is going to be flooded prior to the expansion draft with teams trying to retain some value for an asset before losing it for nothing.

Sure qualifiers. Minus the and, because that part has already been established.

What? Mind if I disagree here ?

I get your point, but your undervaluing Fleury big time here (and perhaps I'm overvaluing him).

I'm not undervaluing Fleury at all. He's a top 10 NHL option. Let me refer to this post, where I said Fleury is very good.

So on one hand, Pittsburgh is great team so Fleury looks like a great goalie. On the other hand, all anyone can talk about all playoffs is Pittsburgh's D is so overmatched compared to the Rangers, Capitals, Lightning, that's their weakness. So which is it? It can't be both. Not to mention Pittsburgh's weakness on D has been mentioned forever. We're not talking about Fleury's win totals here, his actual numbers. Fleury is a top 10 goalie in this league at worst.

What I truly think is you're overvaluing is demand. What teams are looking for a MAF this season? Toronto, who aren't in a position to give up a lot, because he doesn't fit their window. Calgary, same thing. Dallas, who would be looking to salary dump a different goalie and therefore increase the return.It doesn't matter if Fleury is WORTH 1 or 2 elite pieces, what matters is what people will pay. It's kind've a reverse Stamkos effect. He's only worth 7-8 mil, but someone will pay 10, so he will probably get 10. Fleury might be worth 1 or 2 elite pieces, but if someone is only willing to pay an early 2nd, then that's what he will get.

[Rodgort]

I have not read through the 3 pages of this, but:

All I have to say is "Small Sample Size" and Murray is 21 so he may not be ready for a full NHL starter load, as well as NHL gm's aren't known to give such young players the starting gig in net.

So in summation: No. perhaps in 2-3 years.

[rataylor22]

I have not read through the 3 pages of this, but:

All I have to say is "Small Sample Size" and Murray is 21 so he may not be ready for a full NHL starter load, as well as NHL gm's aren't known to give such young players the starting gig in net.

So in summation: No. perhaps in 2-3 years.

Expansion draft. Pittsburgh and teams in similar situations don't have 2-3 years.

[yougo]

Sure qualifiers. Minus the and, because that part has already been established.



I'm not undervaluing Fleury at all. He's a top 10 NHL option. Let me refer to this post, where I said Fleury is very good.



What I truly think is you're overvaluing is demand. What teams are looking for a MAF this season? Toronto, who aren't in a position to give up a lot, because he doesn't fit their window. Calgary, same thing. Dallas, who would be looking to salary dump a different goalie and therefore increase the return.It doesn't matter if Fleury is WORTH 1 or 2 elite pieces, what matters is what people will pay. It's kind've a reverse Stamkos effect. He's only worth 7-8 mil, but someone will pay 10, so he will probably get 10. Fleury might be worth 1 or 2 elite pieces, but if someone is only willing to pay an early 2nd, then that's what he will get.

I think Calgary is a team that THINKS they can contend. I can see Dallas offering Nichushkin(clearly not working under Ruff) for Fleury, then find a way to dump a goalie(or two).
Thing is, there isn't a real prior to a Fleury trade. You stated Luongo before, but Luu's contract made him impossible to trade. While Schneider was 5 years younger when he was traded, he was also really unproven(his body of work suggested that it was a huge risk for the Devils to give up a top10 pick for him).
Anyway, this is moot, my point was basically that Fleury will net much more than 2nd rounder.