Fleury or Bad Defense?? Why Can't the Pens Win??

[Fast Tony DeNiro]

Sure they could do better, but they've only had 2 first round exits since 2008. That time frame includes a trip to the conference finals and 2 to the cup finals. If they go out early this year maybe I'll agree, but I think too much is being expected of them.

Sure, but since those back to back Cup Final appearances, they've made it past the second round once right? Even when they've won their first round matchup, they've never really seemed overly dominant doing so.

[Big Ev]

I see no other option. Malkin must be dealt. They need depth.

[mister_mcgoo]

I see no other option. Malkin must be dealt. They need depth.

for Karlsson & Spezza

[Big Ev]

for Karlsson & Spezza

Remove karlsson and you have a deal

[Loch]

for Karlsson & Spezza

pfft... as if Melnyk is going to spend that kind of money on one player.

[letangerang58]

Sure they could do better, but they've only had 2 first round exits since 2008. That time frame includes a trip to the conference finals and 2 to the cup finals. If they go out early this year maybe I'll agree, but I think too much is being expected of them.

And one of those exits was the year that Crosby got concussed and Malkin tore his ACL.

[letangerang58]

How about coaching? I think Bylsma lets things get too out of hand for us too often. He can't control the team in emotional games and I think to a degree he coaches the team into getting involved in those emotional games. I also think that his coaching style doesn't work for the post season either. His strategy is to control puck possession in the other teams attacking zone which sounds great on paper and works out pretty well in the regular season but when you get to the playoffs teams are just too good and want to win it too much for that to be an acceptable strategy anymore. You have to be able to play both sides of the puck and I don't think Bylsma is accomplishing that. I think he's a decent coach but one of those guys who wear out their welcome after a while.

I haven't watched any of the games in this series so this is all coming from what I've observed in past games.

[Fast Tony DeNiro]

I really feel like the Pens biggest problem comes from higher up than Bylsma....he may not be a great coach, maybe he even needs to go, but there's only so much you can do with a roster this shallow. The two years they went to the Final are the years when they actually had a productive bottom 6 and a steady bottom pairing. I suppose both Sid and Geno being on their ELC in 2008 and Geno still being so in 2009 helped, but other teams spend their money top-heavy as well and they've found success. The right players are out there, just for whatever reason the pieces never seem to fit right in Pittsburgh.

They'll get by Columbus this year, but I just can't see them as a legit contender. Boston is the class of the East, and I'd have both New York and Philly ahead of the Pens. Maybe even the Canadiens.

[letangerang58]

I really feel like the Pens biggest problem comes from higher up than Bylsma....he may not be a great coach, maybe he even needs to go, but there's only so much you can do with a roster this shallow. The two years they went to the Final are the years when they actually had a productive bottom 6 and a steady bottom pairing. I suppose both Sid and Geno being on their ELC in 2008 and Geno still being so in 2009 helped, but other teams spend their money top-heavy as well and they've found success. The right players are out there, just for whatever reason the pieces never seem to fit right in Pittsburgh.

They'll get by Columbus this year, but I just can't see them as a legit contender. Boston is the class of the East, and I'd have both New York and Philly ahead of the Pens. Maybe even the Canadiens.

I don't think Shero is the problem. His trades have been absolute money for the Pens. Goligoski for Neal + Niskanen, Ryan Whitney for Kunitz, picking up Dupuis in the Hossa trade, and Jokinen last year. I think what really killed the Pens depth was Staal leaving. Sutter is a very poor substitute for Staal. That's why I was really excited when I heard about the possibility of Kesler coming to PIT. I knew that it would be like bringing back Staal. I think the two things that the team needs to do in the off season is to find a new coach and improve their 3rd line center. That's easier said than done though. Their just aren't many two-way centermen available for a reasonable price.

[suvojitde]

I think all the factors mentioned in this thread contribute to some extent -
a) Shallow roster / lack of depth / over reliance on Sid and Geno
b) Bylsma getting outcoached in the post season
c) lack of a good defensive system - good puck moving D, yes, but no real solid D-men in their own zone
d) Injuries (but which team doesn't have them), and
e) Fleury's post season struggles

Maybe, a shake up is in order. Sid's not going anywhere, and I don't think they have plans of trading Geno (not that I think that trading Malkin is the solution either), but they have to do something about roster depth, especially goaltending and D. Problem is, they are already close to the cap max, and good D men don't grow on trees. Maybe some of the younger guys step up next season (Gibbons, Bennett, Maata) but they still need better goaltending (they need to look beyond Fleury) and possibly, a new coach. My concern with a new coach is, if he is too focused on defense (like Sutter is in LA OR Hunter was for Caps), then they may end up getting caught between 2 systems and regress instead of getting better. All that said, Lemieux and Shero are knowledgeable guys and I expect they will do something to address the obvious deficiencies.

[Jordyr77]

Personally I think Fleury is probably the most athletic goalie in the league and just as talented as your elite class of goalies. He's just been wildly inconsistent these last few years. I think that can change. He needs some good D and a nice stretch of play to get his confidence back. He's just as talented as any goalie out there. Ryan Miller sure is struggling right now, and everyone was saying to bring in Miller.

[Fast Tony DeNiro]

I don't think Shero is the problem. His trades have been absolute money for the Pens. Goligoski for Neal + Niskanen, Ryan Whitney for Kunitz, picking up Dupuis in the Hossa trade, and Jokinen last year. I think what really killed the Pens depth was Staal leaving. Sutter is a very poor substitute for Staal. That's why I was really excited when I heard about the possibility of Kesler coming to PIT. I knew that it would be like bringing back Staal. I think the two things that the team needs to do in the off season is to find a new coach and improve their 3rd line center. That's easier said than done though. Their just aren't many two-way centermen available for a reasonable price.

I agree Shero has done a good job filling out the top of his roster. That's supposed to be the hard part, but he's done very well with it. But putting together the bottom of that roster is his kryptonite. Sutter is a decent 3C, the Ducks won a Cup with Sami Pahlsson and that's pretty much who Sutter is. And adding Goc for the 4th line was a nice move, but then he got hurt. Those wings though, ew. Glass, Adams, and Megna are bad, Vitale is a decent player though.