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Thread: For those who say, "Crosby Is NOT a Diver"...

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    Default Re: For those who say, "Crosby Is NOT a Diver"...

    Quote Originally Posted by fungchen3 View Post
    I guess I did compare women to Crosby. That was pretty harsh. Outside of that, I don't think I've made any verbal attacks against women. You on the other hand (which is completely ironic lol) ...
    The only thing that's ironic here is your wife's tacit endorsement of sex discrimination.
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    Default Re: For those who say, "Crosby Is NOT a Diver"...

    Quote Originally Posted by blayze View Post

    Life is not perfect... there is racism and sexism everywhere unfortunately. You can't expect to change people overnight, there are deeply routed cultural, societal and habitual tendencies at play here that will probably never be unravelled even over centuries.

    Not to mention you guys completely hijacked the OP.
    Deeply-rooted tendencies change faster when people don't just accept them as common and therefore not to be challenged.

    Look at the progress that has been made against homophobia in professional sports in the past few years. We have gone from no one being willing to say anything on the subject at all to dozens of athletes, and entire teams stepping forward and saying that a gay athlete would be welcome on their team. "But it's sports! People should just expect homophobia!" Well sure, but expecting it doesn't have to equal accepting it.

    As for the thread being hijacked, I think that was a joint effort. Had fungchen cared about this thread he could have easily replied to mounD's first post with "I disagree, but let's discuss it elsewhere."

    And seriously, if I made a perfectly serious and important thread about the decline in PP1 slots available to D-men, and happened to throw in a bit of racism, or something else that you do think is offensive, would you keep quiet to preserve the purity of the thread?

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    Default Re: For those who say, "Crosby Is NOT a Diver"...

    Back to the main topic.... Who cares?

    I still don't see how this is "diving" when he came up from behind the referee and was aware it was the ref hitting him. Is he diving to get the ref thrown in the box? C'mon. Clearly it was a whistle that hit him, potentially in a tender area from his previous injury.

    Also, not talking about this play (as I stated my reasoning above), but why do people care so much about selling a penalty? I get detesting the severe ones (i.e. a guy hardly touching you and you fall), but people have such a freakout over a guy getting cross checked and falling, as if he didn't "resist it" enough. Who cares? It's part of the game. I'm not a diver in my men's league but I happily sell penalties; it's part of the game and makes a difference. There is a substantial difference between "making" a penalty, and getting one to be called. A crosscheck is a crosscheck, a slash is a slash, a hit to the head is a hit to the head. If the refs need to see some sort of player reaction to notice it and call it, so be it.

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    Default Re: For those who say, "Crosby Is NOT a Diver"...


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    Default Re: For those who say, "Crosby Is NOT a Diver"...

    Quote Originally Posted by mounD View Post
    The only thing that's ironic here is your wife's tacit endorsement of sex discrimination.
    I don't think that's fair mounD. I respect your opinions on this issue, and largely agree with them, but I have to take exception to this. You have the beliefs and feelings that you are expressing because of things you have learned through your experiences, your reading, and conversations you have had, correct? You didn't spring from the womb in full possession of the beliefs you hold today, correct? I am going to assume I am correct based on the fact that you use a lot of terminology and lines of rhetoric that are commonly used by feminist activists. So please, be careful about judging others who have not lived your life, studied what you have studied, or talked to who you have talked to for not believing exactly what you believe. I am sure it was a process for you to get where you are now.

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    Default Re: For those who say, "Crosby Is NOT a Diver"...

    Quote Originally Posted by blayze View Post
    I'm not sexist, nor am I defending Fungchen here... but this is a FANTASY HOCKEY FORUM. That doesn't make it right, but what did you guys expect? What you're doing is the equivalent of going to a playboy mansion party and then blasting everyone for objectifying women!

    Life is not perfect... there is racism and sexism everywhere unfortunately. You can't expect to change people overnight, there are deeply routed cultural, societal and habitual tendencies at play here that will probably never be unravelled even over centuries.

    Some times in life, you either have to accept things as they are, or you simply have to leave the environment. Forcefully shoving values down someone's throat (especially when you're in the lion's den) is not going to create any positive progress. There's a time and setting for that, and I don't think this is the appropriate place.

    Not to mention you guys completely hijacked the OP.
    Blayze, have you ever heard the expression- "everything before the word BUT is bull or a lie"? I heard that years ago and I have to say I agree. Watch for it. It's an interesting observation.

    Anyway, what I see from your statement that there are different rules on a FANTASY HOCKEY FORUM than elsewhere. You say that doesn't make it right but don't want anyone to speak up against it.

    You think people should "either have to accept things as they are, or you simply have to leave the environment." I will not do either.

    I see you saying because sexism and racism is deeply routed, we shouldn't say anything against it here. Why is a hockey forum any different than any other place in society. It's unfortunate that things derailed to the extreme but you seem to be saying it is preferable to shutup and accept the status quo than speak up.

    In my experience, silence never brought any form of change.
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    Default Re: For those who say, "Crosby Is NOT a Diver"...

    I think people on both sides of the issue have gone over-board, as issues as sensitive as this seem to lead. I am more concerned with the people that think that the issue should not have been mentioned in the first place.
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    Default Re: For those who say, "Crosby Is NOT a Diver"...

    Quote Originally Posted by Ed. View Post
    I don't think that's fair mounD. I respect your opinions on this issue, and largely agree with them, but I have to take exception to this. You have the beliefs and feelings that you are expressing because of things you have learned through your experiences, your reading, and conversations you have had, correct? You didn't spring from the womb in full possession of the beliefs you hold today, correct? I am going to assume I am correct based on the fact that you use a lot of terminology and lines of rhetoric that are commonly used by feminist activists. So please, be careful about judging others who have not lived your life, studied what you have studied, or talked to who you have talked to for not believing exactly what you believe. I am sure it was a process for you to get where you are now.
    I don't mean to discredit his wife; I just find it incredibly ironic that she would endorse Fungchen's statements that are explicitly anti-women. It's like how lots of people in America vote against their own interests without realizing it. A similar thing is happening here, and although I'm certain Fungchen and his wife are good people, they hold very misguided and backwards beliefs. I don't mean to dip into the ad hominen pool, but her beliefs are incredibly ironic. And sad.
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    Default Re: For those who say, "Crosby Is NOT a Diver"...

    Again, why are people surprised when misogyny and sports are involved?!?! Why are people preaching about womens rights on a fantasy hockey forum!?

    Are you guys/girls serious!?

    The overreaction about a simple stereotype is crazy. IT'S A SPORTS FORUM!!!!!!

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    Default Re: For those who say, "Crosby Is NOT a Diver"...

    Quote Originally Posted by Excelsior View Post
    You think people should "either have to accept things as they are, or you simply have to leave the environment." I will not do either.
    Or you can simply take it for what it was.....a joke...a stereotype....a tounge in cheek comment....and carry on with your day.

    I don't understand the reasoning for mounD to have to preach to all of us about feminism......on a fantasy hockey forum.

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    Default Re: For those who say, "Crosby Is NOT a Diver"...

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Guru View Post
    Again, why are people surprised when misogyny and sports are involved?!?! Why are people preaching about womens rights on a fantasy hockey forum!?

    Are you guys/girls serious!?

    The overreaction about a simple stereotype is crazy. IT'S A SPORTS FORUM!!!!!!
    Social justice means justice for all of society. Since this forum is technically part of society, analogous to a public forum for speech (aka town square), justice should be fought for and enforced here just as equally as anywhere else. Is this a less important place than most to fight for gender equality? Probably. Does that mean it's pointless to talk about it here? Certainly not, nothing could be further from the truth. We don't want to condone "centers of discrimination" just because it's less important, or more-entrenched, or whatever the case may be. Third wave feminism / social justice dictates that wherever society is present, equal justice and equal rights MUST be demanded. Otherwise, our erosion of these hateful stereotypes is lessened by allowing it to flourish in certain areas. Yes, this is a fantasy hockey forum. But does that mean we should shirk our responsibility to promote equality? Nope.
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    Default Re: For those who say, "Crosby Is NOT a Diver"...

    If I cared to read all of that I would have.

    I don't care to read about your feminist views. Sorry dude. I come on here to get my fantasy fix.

    I do appreciate your passion on the subject though.

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    Default Re: For those who say, "Crosby Is NOT a Diver"...

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Guru View Post
    Again, why are people surprised when misogyny and sports are involved?!?! Why are people preaching about womens rights on a fantasy hockey forum!?

    Are you guys/girls serious!?

    The overreaction about a simple stereotype is crazy. IT'S A SPORTS FORUM!!!!!!
    To me, "it's a sports forum" is not good enough reason to leave the issue alone. Better to try and change things for the better, regardless of the arena.
    GO WINGS!

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    Default Re: For those who say, "Crosby Is NOT a Diver"...

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Guru View Post
    Or you can simply take it for what it was.....a joke...a stereotype....a tounge in cheek comment....and carry on with your day.

    I don't understand the reasoning for mounD to have to preach to all of us about feminism......on a fantasy hockey forum.
    If those responsible for the gains of the American Civil Rights movement felt this way, they would've thrown up their hands and said:

    "Segregation in schools? Not a problem because it's just school, it's not REALLY society. Let's just leave it, quit overreacting people."

    Get it? The venue is irrelevant. The issues are important, and as long as they rear their ugly head in these forums, I'll be doing my duty to speak out against it.
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    Default Re: For those who say, "Crosby Is NOT a Diver"...

    Quote Originally Posted by mounD View Post
    I don't mean to discredit his wife; I just find it incredibly ironic that she would endorse Fungchen's statements that are explicitly anti-women. It's like how lots of people in America vote against their own interests without realizing it. A similar thing is happening here, and although I'm certain Fungchen and his wife are good people, they hold very misguided and backwards beliefs. I don't mean to dip into the ad hominen pool, but her beliefs are incredibly ironic. And sad.
    Maybe she doesn't want to stress over bullshit like that? Lunatic feminists get so worked up it probably takes years off their lives. Maybe she does care about equality but isn't stuck up like a lot of these types...ahem.

    Chill out dude. This is not a university, this is not the place to be having these discussions. I'd much rather see fungchen's posts than this nonsense.

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