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Thread: 1 year yahoo commissioner seeks advice/help!!!

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    Default 1 year yahoo commissioner seeks advice/help!!!

    Hey guys I have been a commissioner in a 1 year yahoo league now for 5 years and last year ran into a problem that never occured before so I am reaching out for advice here.

    Each roster has 2 centers, 4 wings, 3 defensemen and 2 goalies with 3 bench players.

    Toward the end of last season 2 teams (who know each other) started leaving their defensemen postions empty at the end of the week,while dropping dmen in order to pick up forwards that would give them an edge in categories they were trailing in. Obviously forwards get more points than dmen, so they did very well when they started doing this. (one of the teams won the league and one came from last and made the playoffs).

    Since the start of this season happened so fast I rushed into getting the league set up and wrote on the message board 3 days before the draft that each team must keep 3 dmen on their rosters at all times.

    Now, you can imagine the flack I got from the 2 owners. They say they would have drafted a lot different if they knew this rule change sooner. And this rule change restricts them from making the moves they want to make as an active owner. And there isnt anyway that I know of that I can penalizethem for doing this.

    I just am looking for any feedback or if anyone else ever ran into this problem. It really annoys me because these two owners are good friends of mine. Thanks in advance.
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    My first question is why did you feel the need to make a rule? I don't see anything wrong with what they're doing as it's a strategy, and a smart one at that. Anyone can attempt the same strategy, and if they have the starting slots open and available moves (are there max moves a week?) then let them. Depending on your categories, some dropped D could be valuable so it can be a risk as well.

    I'd be pissed off if you created the rule without discussing it with the rest of the league first, and especially only three days before the draft. It's best to give plenty of time (offseason or previous season) for everyone to prepare for it.

    My advice to you - get rid of the rule and put it to a vote to implement next season, and have a significant majority (at least 75%) to make it pass.
    Last edited by horrorfan; January 24, 2013 at 4:45 PM.
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    IMO, a good set of established rules is the key to any good fantasy hockey league.

    1. If you really want teams to roster players, set a "Games Played Maximum" for each position. Typically, that maximum matches the NHL teams schedule, so 48 this year. horrorfan (above) does this in his Roto league and it is an excellent way to get people to balance their team naturally.

    2. If you are adamant about such a rule, it should definitely be set a week+ before draft day. I actually run my friends & family pool with a similar rule where each team's bench must be 3F,1D,1G. I want to make it simple for the lesser hockey fans and also give them the fun & flexibility of inserting different players nightly, if they wish. I also require that forwards can only be dropped for forwards, D for D, G for G. It makes it very, very easy to track transactions.

    However, I do make a point to:
    i) Remind everybody each year, a couple weeks prior to the draft that they will be drafting 9F,4D,2G + 3F,1D,1G (bench). I input rosters after our live draft and I do email a GM if they violate these moves.
    ii) At the live draft, I again remind everybody of those positions.



    In this case, if you did declare the defensemen rule pre-draft, then I think you can hold them to it. However, if you declared the rule post-draft - then you have to let it go for the entire year. Rules shall not be changed after a draft & during the year.
    Last edited by Pengwin7; January 24, 2013 at 4:52 PM.

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    I'm in full agreement with Horrorfan on this one. Rescind the rule change, have a discussion and vote, then go with the majority. In a league that has the same core group of owners, be it one year or keeper, all changes to rules, scoring, etc should be discussed fully with the group and well in advance to allow them to adapt strategies.

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    I'll echo horrorfan to a point and ask why is the rule necessary? It seems to me that the 2 guys carrying minimal D-men are trying a different strategy and the results appear to show it works. Guys try different strategies all the time: goalies early in the draft, goalies late, premium D-men, goon players etc. etc. etc. Personally I think its up to each individual owner to try and decide which strategy they think will work. I don't see what this rule does for the league.

    If you had tried to implement the rule after the draft I would say you have no leg to stand on but given that you gave them 3 days I think this is reasonable for them to realize they need to draft 3 D and adjust accordingly. As an aside did all managers confirm they were aware of this rule?? If they weren't then your case is weaker.

    I don't know if yahoo has anyway to penalize "illegal rosters" otherwise you may have to manually penalize them games (did you establish what the penalty is for an "illegal roster"? without that in place its hard to they knew the penalty in advance.)

    All in all I'd also scrap the rule for this season. Have a discussion in the offseason about why you think the rule is necessary (I assume you want 36 D-man active, makes D more valuable, something like this) and what the penalty will be for an "illegal roster" and whose obligation it is to report an "illegal roster". Then I'd put it to a league wide vote requiring 2/3's to carry.
    12 team H-2-H 1 year league, daily roster changes, 3 goalie start minimum/week
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    G, A, P, +/-, PIM, PPP, SHP, GWG, Hits, W, SV%, GAA
    C: Malkin, Backstrom, Stepan, Ribeiro, Legwand
    LW: Vanek, Moulson, Carter, Rinaldo
    RW: Kessel, Vrbata, Seguin, Cammalleri, Zuccarello
    D: Green, Gudas, Zidlicky
    G: Lehtonen, Halak, Lack

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    The reason I made this rule is because if I didnt then everyone would draft dmen in the last few rounds and kind of makes for a boring draft. Thats why cbs is a great site because you can set up seperate cats. for dmen. But, it comes with a site fee. I understand what you are saying horrorfan, but its kind of a loophole that I wanted to shut, thats all.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pengwin7 View Post
    IMO, a good set of established rules is the key to any good fantasy hockey league.

    1. If you really want teams to roster players, set a "Games Played Maximum". horrorfan (above) does this in his Roto league and it is an excellent way to get people to balance their team naturally.

    2. If you are adamant about such a rule, it should definitely be set a week+ before draft day. I actually run my friends & family pool with a similar rule where each team's bench must be 3F,1D,1G. I want to make it simple for the lesser hockey fans and also give them the fun & flexibility of inserting different players nightly, if they wish.

    However, I do make a point to:
    i) Remind everybody each year, a couple weeks prior to the draft that they will be drafting 9F,4D,2G + 3F,1D,1G (bench). I input rosters after our live draft and I do email a GM if they violate these moves.
    ii) At the live draft, I again remind everybody of those positions.



    In this case, if you did declare the defensemen rule pre-draft, then I think you can hold them to it. However, if you declared the rule post-draft - then you have to let it go for the entire year. Rules shall not be changed after a draft & during the year.
    Being a H2H league (mentioning playoffs cleared this up), I don't think max games is possible. Rather you can restrict the number of moves per week.

    I still insist that even pre-draft, three days is not enough time to institute a rule like this. And I don't like making a big rule change like this without discussing it with everyone beforehand. Even if I, the commissioner, want a rule but the majority of the league doesn't, I wouldn't make it.
    Yahoo Baseball, One-year, 20 teams, Rotisserie (click below to show settings)
     
    Midsummer Classic:
    C,1B,2B,3B,SS,3OF,Util/2SP,2RP,3P,5BN,2DL,1NA * R,HR,RBI,SB,AVG,OPS/W,SV,HLD,K,ERA,WHIP * Max games/innings=162/1250

    Baseball is Life:
    C,1B,2B,3B,SS,IF,3OF,2Util/4SP,3RP,2P,4BN,3DL * R,HR,RBI,SB,AVG,OPS/W,SV,HLD,K,ERA,WHIP * Max games/innings=162/1475

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    Quote Originally Posted by horrorfan View Post
    Being a H2H league (mentioning playoffs cleared this up), I don't think max games is possible. Rather you can restrict the number of moves per week.

    I still insist that even pre-draft, three days is not enough time to institute a rule like this. And I don't like making a big rule change like this without discussing it with everyone beforehand. Even if I, the commissioner, want a rule but the majority of the league doesn't, I wouldn't make it.

    Ah good catch on the likely H2H.
    I agree on the transactions per week. I like 2, which is what hf does.


    As for "the rule".
    It's fuzzy. Technically, I think if it is up on the official league website 3 days in advance, it should hold.
    Is it cool? Maybe not.
    Did the other owners see it? Maybe, maybe not.
    Did they not know about it or are they just pretending to have not seen it to use their strategy again? Who knows.

    In Yahoo!, I know that threads (by default) will be emailed to teams when posted. And all teams should be held to reading any commissioner's note.
    But officially, depending on how the rule was communicated & posted, I'd say if the rule was posted & in full view prior to the draft... it has to hold.

    [We also have to note that while it doesn't seem fair to the TWO owners, the rule may have seemed official to other league members. And thus, not implementing the rule is not fair to the OTHER owners. Two sides of the coin.]
    Last edited by Pengwin7; January 24, 2013 at 5:06 PM.

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    Looks like a damned if you do and damned if you don't. If you rescind the rule you could have 10 managers telling you they drafted 3 D-men knowing they had to have them. If you don't obviously you've gotten at least 2 managers who are mad at you for restricting their strategy.

    Having considered the otherside and Pengwin's comments about managers being responsible for updating themselves I'd be ok with the rule staying and then a full discussion and vote in the offseason. Also, in the offseason discuss a moves per week limit. 2 is the number we use as well and it seems to be a good number.
    12 team H-2-H 1 year league, daily roster changes, 3 goalie start minimum/week
    2xC, 2xRW, 2xLW, 4xD, 3xUtil, 2xG, 5 Bench
    G, A, P, +/-, PIM, PPP, SHP, GWG, Hits, W, SV%, GAA
    C: Malkin, Backstrom, Stepan, Ribeiro, Legwand
    LW: Vanek, Moulson, Carter, Rinaldo
    RW: Kessel, Vrbata, Seguin, Cammalleri, Zuccarello
    D: Green, Gudas, Zidlicky
    G: Lehtonen, Halak, Lack

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    Quote Originally Posted by LawMan View Post
    Looks like a damned if you do and damned if you don't. If you rescind the rule you could have 10 managers telling you they drafted 3 D-men knowing they had to have them. If you don't obviously you've gotten at least 2 managers who are mad at you for restricting their strategy.

    Having considered the otherside and Pengwin's comments about managers being responsible for updating themselves I'd be ok with the rule staying and then a full discussion and vote in the offseason. Also, in the offseason discuss a moves per week limit. 2 is the number we use as well and it seems to be a good number.
    Yeah that's a good point - other managers may have drafted a certain way because of the rule. Tough one. Another suggestion I have is to email the entire league and have a discussion about it now. It might clear things up on who knew and who didn't know when you instituted the rule. The most important thing for you is ensure the managers all understand where you are coming from and have an opportunity to give their thoughts. Perhaps a solution can come from this discussion.

    Good communication and trust is crucial to the success of a league. You don't want this to snowball and people leave the league because of it.
    Yahoo Baseball, One-year, 20 teams, Rotisserie (click below to show settings)
     
    Midsummer Classic:
    C,1B,2B,3B,SS,3OF,Util/2SP,2RP,3P,5BN,2DL,1NA * R,HR,RBI,SB,AVG,OPS/W,SV,HLD,K,ERA,WHIP * Max games/innings=162/1250

    Baseball is Life:
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    Quote Originally Posted by horrorfan View Post
    Yeah that's a good point - other managers may have drafted a certain way because of the rule. Tough one. Another suggestion I have is to email the entire league and have a discussion about it now. It might clear things up on who knew and who didn't know when you instituted the rule. The most important thing for you is ensure the managers all understand where you are coming from and have an opportunity to give their thoughts. Perhaps a solution can come from this discussion.

    Good communication and trust is crucial to the success of a league. You don't want this to snowball and people leave the league because of it.
    I think this is a good idea. Explain the whole story, figure out who knew what and try and clear this up as quickly as possible.
    12 team H-2-H 1 year league, daily roster changes, 3 goalie start minimum/week
    2xC, 2xRW, 2xLW, 4xD, 3xUtil, 2xG, 5 Bench
    G, A, P, +/-, PIM, PPP, SHP, GWG, Hits, W, SV%, GAA
    C: Malkin, Backstrom, Stepan, Ribeiro, Legwand
    LW: Vanek, Moulson, Carter, Rinaldo
    RW: Kessel, Vrbata, Seguin, Cammalleri, Zuccarello
    D: Green, Gudas, Zidlicky
    G: Lehtonen, Halak, Lack

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    To add to my last post - although you feel the need to put in this rule, you need to show that you are willing to listen. Nobody likes a dictator (not saying you are, but could appear that way), so as long as you are open to everyone's thoughts and perspectives then it will hopefully help in resolving the situation.
    Yahoo Baseball, One-year, 20 teams, Rotisserie (click below to show settings)
     
    Midsummer Classic:
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    Baseball is Life:
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    I think a discussion right away is in order, you didn't give enough time for the GMs to implement a strategy. I understand both sides of the argument. FYI, next year, if you want D to hold more water, you can add categories like PPP or a larger bench so they need to dress D to maximize the # of guys that dress each night.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Raistlin View Post
    FYI, next year, if you want D to hold more water, you can add categories like PPP or a larger bench so they need to dress D to maximize the # of guys that dress each night.
    Yep - another idea for discussion. My suggestion if you don't have it already is put forward the option of adding blocked shots. That'll make D important.
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    Midsummer Classic:
    C,1B,2B,3B,SS,3OF,Util/2SP,2RP,3P,5BN,2DL,1NA * R,HR,RBI,SB,AVG,OPS/W,SV,HLD,K,ERA,WHIP * Max games/innings=162/1250

    Baseball is Life:
    C,1B,2B,3B,SS,IF,3OF,2Util/4SP,3RP,2P,4BN,3DL * R,HR,RBI,SB,AVG,OPS/W,SV,HLD,K,ERA,WHIP * Max games/innings=162/1475

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    I routinely have played 3/4 (even 2/4) dmen spots in my regular league.

    It's just smart strategy.

    One way to mitigate it is weekly roster moves, instead of daily.
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