Disclaimer of Interest?

[Call of Doughty]

Dear Bettman and Fehr,

Disclaimer this!!!!!

[Loch]

Section 14 of the NHL class action suit is quite interesting. Asking for all standard player contracts to be void and unenforcable.

Holy cow. The chaos that would ensue.

Sounds like someone is eager to reach an agreement and resolve this unrest...

Seriously Bettman and Fehr, the competetion is to see who has the biggest dick, not who is the biggest dick.

[GrinningBuddha]

Here is the NBA lockout timeline from 2011 once the PA went the decertification route:

November 14, 2011:
After spending the weekend mulling the NBA's offer, players arrived in New York City and delivered a resounding but risky response to one more ultimatum from NBA Commissioner David Stern: See you in court.

The players' association rejected the league's latest proposal for a new labor deal and began disbanding, paving the way for a lawsuit that throws the season in jeopardy.
By filing a disclaimer of interest, the union ended its role as a collective-bargaining agent and NBPA executive director Billy Hunter became the executive director of a "trade association". Outside counsel Jeffrey Kessler and attorney David Boies -- who, ironically, represented NFL owners when they thwarted the football players' decertification push last spring -- will become the key figures from the players' side, taking over for Hunter and NBPA president Derek Fisher.

November 15, 2011:
The locked-out players, including Carmelo Anthony and Kevin Durant, file class-action antitrust lawsuits against the league in northern California and in Minneapolis. Boies said the NBA lockout violates antitrust laws by refusing to allow players to work.

November 17, 2011:
Stern and the team owners conduct a conference call to discuss and update each other on the failed negotiations and resulting upcoming litigation being pursued now by the players.

November 21, 2011:
Boies and the players withdraw the California lawsuit to focus on the complaint filed in Minnesota.

November 23, 2011:
Talks aimed at ending the NBA lockout have resumed, two people with knowledge of the situation said Wednesday, with a quick settlement necessary to start the season by Christmas.

November 25-26, 2011:
NBA owners and players reached a tentative agreement early Saturday to end the 149-day lockout.


As you can see, it took 12 days to reach a tentative agreement, even after the players filed anti-trust lawsuits. This doesn't signal the end of the season, it signals the culmination of this year's CBA negoations. The season may still be cancelled, but I'm more than 50% confident we still see games this year, even if the lawsuits start.

[DuklaNation]

^^^ The part of that timeline I dont quite understand is at the beginning the union leadership disclaims its interest in the union. Then the players file suit. Then they negotiate more. Who is negotiating? If its the same union leadership, the disclaimer is null & void and any antitrust lawsuit would be thrown out.

[ericdaoust]

^^^ The part of that timeline I dont quite understand is at the beginning the union leadership disclaims its interest in the union. Then the players file suit. Then they negotiate more. Who is negotiating? If its the same union leadership, the disclaimer is null & void and any antitrust lawsuit would be thrown out.

I believe the union leaders are not official leaders anymore but can still negotiate on their behalf in an unofficial way. It's a wink wink kind of thing. Then they re-assemble the union and sign the CBA.

[arctic_rogue]

Do they have any meetings planned over the next couple of days? Or are they taking another break?

[doulos]

We ... are never ever ever .... getting back together!

[Carcillo]

Do they have any meetings planned over the next couple of days? Or are they taking another break?

I think Steve Fehr and Bill Daly continue to keep "touching base" with each other like they've done throughout these negotiations. Whatever that means. Less touching, more talking, please.

[SPOILER]

Less touching, more talking, please.

Thats a statement you don't here very often!!

[MXHockey]

Let both sides take this into a legal battle as far as it can go, even if it takes a year or two to settle it. Let every possible argument and negotiation tactic be exhausted. Perhaps then the league, the players, and the fans will never see this again. And the league will finally improve its business model.


Even if they settle this and get a partial season this year, another lockout will loom at the end of the next CBA. The NHL business model is broken. The only way to fix it is contraction, or all 30 owners having a more equal share of league profits.


An owner in Philly or Boston reaps a decent profit. An owner (business person or the NHL) in Phoenix needs the city to bail them out every year on an arena deal. Owners in Nashville, St. Louis, Tampa, Dallas, Florida, Columbus, Long Island, and Carolina historically lose money. Teams like Anaheim, New Jersey, Buffalo, and San Jose scrape by. When you can buy tickets in the Southern US markets for less than 30 bucks, and games still don't sell out, there's a big business problem. Expansion to the Souther US was 10-15 years ago and all those teams lose money. In some cases it will take 30 more years of financial loss until these teams get a foothold in these cities and become mainstream.


Kids in the US grow up playing basketball, baseball, and football. Sports that are culturally established and very cheap to play compared to hockey, where equipment and costs of ice time are out of reach for most US families. Three quarters of the league's teams are in the US, yet over three quarters of the league's players are made up of non-American players. Not the end of the world, but a fact that makes it even more difficult to establish an NHL market as mainstream. The economics of hockey at the grassroots level will always be an enormous hill to climb in making the sport mainstream in the States.


I do admire the players battle, especially holding strong and not getting bullied into a deal by the owners, and making a deal where they essentially get walked on. In saying that, you will find very few leagues in the world where a professional sport's league is made up of foreign players, yet nets those players million dollar salaries. The major American sport leagues are mainly made up of American players. European Football leagues are mainly made up of domestic players in their respective countries. Aussie League Football, all Aussie players. Domestic players are the status quo nationally in many successful sports leagues. The NHL is an exception. Mostly Canadians and Europeans playing in US markets. Markets where half of the American teams lose or barely make money.


The players need to concede on some issues, and move on before this gets really bad for them. The longer the lockout goes, the worse it gets for them short and long term.