Mats Sundin, Dobber, and Humble Pie?

[Dobber]

I\'m not eating humble pie yet, but I have certainly scooped a big piece onto my fork and have it right in front of my mouth.

Mats Sundin\'s recent press release explaining his stance on not waiving his NTC is convincing. The Toronto media - to a man (and woman) - accepting it as fact, is even more convincing. Interviews with Richard Peddie and listening to what he has to say - well, that\'s even got me swung on my stubborn stance.

The downside of being a stubborn know-it-all who likes to rub it in when he is right, is that I have to be even more humble when I am wrong. My stubbornness will not allow me to admit that I am wrong until 3:01 tomorrow, but it looks grim.

Now, onto Sundin\'s character - he is a good man and a great athlete. I don\'t understand his unwillingness to waive his NTC. If he did so, he would be out of Toronto for March and April and he will be back in May. Everyone knows that a major trade never results in a Cup, so Sundin would be back in the shitty traffic of Toronto by the middle of May, ready to re-sign with the team. So essentially, all he would be doing would be accepting a two-month vacation - look at it like that, instead of waiving a NTC. Not only that, but the team that he re-signs with for next year would be a better one thanks to his allowing them to trade him.

But let\'s not get down on him for not waiving it. If your best friend got hammered and threw up on your couch it would annoy you, yes, but would you hate him for it? Never forgive him? C\'mon. The move, Leaf fans, would not be very nice on his part, but let\'s not forget what he has done for this team.

I\'ll be back here tomorrow - to either brag like crazy or eat crow.

B)

[Mr.Coffee]

Hey Dobbs,In case you found that gambling web-site,and you end up homeless tomorrow!hmy:

You can sleep on my couch,till you get on your feet!

I\'ll have plenty of Red-Stripe in the fridge!:laugh:


Smog.B)

[Puckhead]

I share Dobbers views on mixed feelings. As a Leaf fan, I wanted him to agree to waive the NTC, in order to start the inevitable rebuilding plan a big step in the right direction, but I feel he is arguably the best Leaf in the storied history of this franchise. The problem with this team does not rest on Sundin\'s shoulders, but that is how many so-called Leaf fans will choose to see it. He will be blamed for the team doing so poorly, this year, and also, the team not having won anything while he has been here. This guy is a special player, a clutch performer, who has become the franchise all time leader, with little to nothing in the way of linemates or skilled players around him. He is the picture of consistancy, has proven he is extremely durable, and never once complained about the state of the Maple Leafs. How many of the skilled, so called superstars around the league would have stuck it out, and honoured their contract with so little to work with. Whenever the subject of Mats comes up, people choose to compare him to the other captains who are putting op big numbers, and winning Stanely Cups, but when you take a step back and examine the situation...they have a supporting cast!!! Look back at Sundin\'s time as a Leaf, and look at his linemates...

Hoglund, Modin, Roberts, Tucker, Renberg, Berezin, Antropov, Ponikarovsky, Blake...none of these guys can be considered a 1st liner, and I would go as far as to say maybe not even a 2nd liner. He did have Mogilny for a little while, but injuries to AlMo didn\'t allow them to enjoy any real chemistry.

The obvious problem with the Buds is the ineptness of the Management team upstairs. They felt the need to give him the no trade clause, and now he is condemned for choosing to use it. We hate it when players in sports try to renegotiate a contract they agreed in order to get more money, and now we hate Mats for honouring his???

While I am torn on a selfish level, I respect him, and his decision, the fact is, while moving him would have helped the team, it wouldn\'t fix the problems, which on this team, are all over the place.

Puck.

[GSP]

You guys are missing the real reason why these Leaf players are unwilling to waive their NTC\'s.

These guys are afraid to waive their no trades and be exposed as below average players (or competitors) on any kind of playoff-bound team.

Which explains why McCabe is the only one willing to waive. He\'s already been exposed.

[mxpxillini35]

Puckhead wrote:

I share Dobbers views on mixed feelings. As a Leaf fan, I wanted him to agree to waive the NTC, in order to start the inevitable rebuilding plan a big step in the right direction, but I feel he is arguably the best Leaf in the storied history of this franchise. The problem with this team does not rest on Sundin\'s shoulders, but that is how many so-called Leaf fans will choose to see it. He will be blamed for the team doing so poorly, this year, and also, the team not having won anything while he has been here.

Ok...first off, let me say...I respect Sundin\'s decision to not waive his NTC. However...let me play devil\'s advocate or sorts.

Let\'s say you worked for a business selling widgets. You were a simple salesperson taking incoming and making some outgoing phone calls for sales. If your bosses screwed up marketing so people didn\'t know what widgets were...would it be your fault if you fell short of your goals every month or year? No. If your bosses screwed up ordering parts to make the widgets so it decreased supply and didn\'t always have enough to sell, would it be your fault? No.

Now...if you had someone call you over the phone and want 1 million widgets, and you check, and you have 1.2 million available (which is more than average) and you choose not to sell them because you\'re supposed to be on lunch at the time, would that be your fault? Yes.

I think the Leafs management has royally screwed up the short and mid-range future of the franchise, however, I think Sundin should realize he has the ability to make a huge step with a rebuilding fan, and he would become part of the problem if he doesn\'t help.

Now of course, my thinking is that he\'s retiring at the end of this season and he wants to go out a Leaf. That would make the most sense.

[mxpxillini35]

Dobber wrote:

I\'ll be back here tomorrow - to either brag like crazy or eat crow.

Hey...when you\'re right 52% of the time...

[Puckhead]

I don\'t think Mats will be back in a Leaf uniform next season. He may retire, which would atleast keep all the critics at bay, but I feel if he does return to play, it won\'t be with the Leafs. Not after they tried pushing him out in such a rushed situation. Dreger had a great article on TSN.ca about just that, and if that is in fact what happens, it would piss off those fans who feel okay with him staying put today.

[richardparknation]

Let\'s all just face the truth. Mats, like the rest of us, hates TO and wants to see them burn to the ground. He\'ll sign with OTT or MON next year =P

In all seriousness, Sundin is a great franchise player, and I would take his word. However, one has to take into consideration that Fletcher would have told him his role in rebuilding the Leafs.....

[Dobber]

I can\'t help but think (hope?) that if Fletcher comes to Sundin and says something like:
\"Mats, I know you said you won\'t waive your NTC, but Detroit just offered me Hudler, Kindl and a first for you and they said they would be willing to extend you for three years at $21 million. Will you please waive it? It would really turn this ship around! The fans would love you for it!\"
And he got on his knees and begged...that Mats would come around.

B)

[honduranhockey]

Why should he waive his NTC and go somewhere else?

He obviously loves the city and playing for this team. Would you want to leave the city you love, to go sleep on a guy\'s couch or live out of a suitcase for two months? You have to go in to a new team with a new system and new linemates, and by the time you\'re used to them the season\'s over - with no guarantee you\'ll win a Cup.

It\'s not his fault the team is bad. It\'s not his responsibility, or his job, to save management from their own bad decisions - and it\'s unfair for Leafs fans to ask him to do that. He shouldn\'t have to save this team off the ice - it\'s his job to do it on the ice. A job he\'s been doing incredibly well, and look at the grief he\'s being subjected to by not waiving his NTC.

The Leafs don\'t deserve a class act like that on their roster... and the fans are going to drive him out of town anyway in the summer with their reaction.

If you want to get mad about the state of your club, don\'t yell at Sundin - yell at management!

[richardparknation]

^I don\'t think anyone is saying he has to. It\'s more of a \"why not\" question.

I mean, it\'s basically a win/win situation. Sundin is going to resign in TO regardless, so logically, you\'d think that him going to improve the team next year would be a no-brainer.

Personally I love having him not waive it, because it just means the leafs are going to have to wait even longer before getting into the top 8.

[Puckhead]

The fact that he didn\'t waive it tells me he\'s not coming back regardless. He will retire, or move on to another team come July 1st. If he was planning to come back in the summer, I think he may have looked at the big picture, and leaned toward waiving it, but after seeing how the local media, and much of the fan base has tried sacrificing him to right the wrongs, that ironically Sundin has had to deal with from the day he got here, has finally taken its toll. He has dealt with nothing but grief since coming over from Quebec for Clark. He had to start behind the 8 Ball with Leafs fans, cause he was traded for a fan favorite. He never has gotten the respect he deserves, and he simply can\'t take anymore. Everyone has their breaking point, and I think he has hit the wall on this one. I for one, will miss what he brings on and off the ice, it may be a long while until we are graced with someone of his ilk in this town again. A blend of speed, skill, leadership, and unwavering loyalty to the blue and white.

Why is it that this team seems to always get it wrong? Regardless of the question being asked, or problem that needs to be addressed. Its almost as if the so called brass looks at the situation, figures out the right move, and decides to go the other way! They trade youth for guys on the obvious down side of their careers(Nolan). They overpay guys who would have otherwise had no better option, and then sell it to the fans, as we didn\'t want to lose him (Belfour), they keep the wrong goalie prospect in a disastrous trade (Pogge), they stay loyal to guys they should move, and they try to move guys they should be loyal to. I realize its not a scientific formula, there are always many variables to consider, and hindsight is always 20/20, but enough is enough, shouldn\'t they accidentally make a good move every once and a while. Instead they alienate their captain, and will in fact lose him for nothing...and once again, it won\'t ne managements fault, they will say he chose to stay and we had no choice. The fact of the matter is had the approached him in January, and not 10 days ago, they could have possibly signed him to an extension or possibly given him enough to time to fully consider his NTC and afford him the time he felt he needed to make the right choice.

[duducks]

There was an interview that I was listening to on the radio the other day, i think with Mats\' agent, but it might\'ve been Fletcher or even Sundin. Theres been so many discussions on Sundin, its hard to remember. Anyways they went on to say how Sundin had a covnersation with Börje Salming, and Sundin asked him for advice on the situation, and Salming said his big regret was not ending his career in Toronto.

Sounds to me like Sundin is looking to end his career this offseason.

[Dobber]

Mmmmmm, this humble pie is good!

Everyone - I am very sorry for arrogantly saying that Mats Sundin was playing a game and that he and Fletcher were putting on an Oscar winning performance.

I find it difficult to believe what a player, agent, coach or GM says (take Forsberg for example) so I tend to doubt their word until it is 100% over with.

So I was wrong. I\'m wrong 48% of the time.

B)

[ultrawhiteness]

don\'t be too hard on yourself! i find it astounding that he wasn\'t moved, and if i were a leaf fan i would be feeling very low today. not necessarily fletcher\'s fault, or sundin\'s fault, but a mess none the less