Pens going forward

[golfguy1672]

The only thing the penguins need to fix is to not finish 4th next year. They need to win their division. Finishing 4th/5th is Russian Roulette in the playoffs.

Frankly that roster with a healthy Crosby. Or even a 60 game season from Crosby would have won the division/conference/NHL(maybe??)

So if they can move Martin and use that money to keep the rest of the team complete, they will be fine. But if not, just stay healthy (easier said than done) and they will be good.

[KoHolga]

What about Joe Morrow? He almost made the team this year and had a kick @$$ year in junior (PPG numbers). I think he could make the team with another strong camp.

Yeah i dont know why he isnt getting more love.. I am a flyers fan and i still lvoe this kid... If you guys dont make room for him i think that is a big mistake... He will take Niskanen and do way more with it... this kid is a pure stud imo

[letangerang58]

why not? pens have more than enough offense, and they can easily sign a veteran forward to bring what staal does to the table defensively. wouldnt staal be the perfect defensively forward that trotz would love to have on his team? maybe staal + martin for weber?

Do they? Didn't they just lose a series because they didn't have enough scoring depth among other things. Having 3 scoring lines in the NHL is very important and without Staal the Pens 3rd line is neutered offensively. I don't think they Pens need Weber and I would rather see them go after Suter. He's a better fit in my opinion. A little better defensively and he's a left shot which would work well on top PP unit since Letang is a righty. And best of all he's a free agent so all you have to pay is cap space. If the Staal + Martin for Weber trade were to happen I think the Preds would have to trade someone back who could center the 3rd line.

[letangerang58]

The only thing the penguins need to fix is to not finish 4th next year. They need to win their division. Finishing 4th/5th is Russian Roulette in the playoffs.

Frankly that roster with a healthy Crosby. Or even a 60 game season from Crosby would have won the division/conference/NHL(maybe??)

So if they can move Martin and use that money to keep the rest of the team complete, they will be fine. But if not, just stay healthy (easier said than done) and they will be good.

I agree with you here. The most important thing for the Pens to do next year is not get matched up against the Flyers. They have our number. That is all it is. We could have crushed any other team in the league this season in the playoffs (well maybe not crushed).

Yeah i dont know why he isnt getting more love.. I am a flyers fan and i still lvoe this kid... If you guys dont make room for him i think that is a big mistake... He will take Niskanen and do way more with it... this kid is a pure stud imo

I think Morrow could join the Pens next season too but at this point its hard to say that he will given the Pens strategy for bringing along youth. But I could definitely see him forcing the Pens hand. He's going to be very good.

[Mr Zizzla]

What about Joe Morrow? He almost made the team this year and had a kick @$$ year in junior (PPG numbers). I think he could make the team with another strong camp.

I'm a HUGE Morrow fan and i thought he earned a spot out of camp but letting him gain more experience in junior and in the A will only do great things for him.
I'm thinking along the lines of the way St. Louis brought up Pietrangelo, maxing out his junior eligibility, playing in big time WJC games, getting bigger/stronger and developing man strength, that worked out well!

Edit: I also liked the way you laid out your initial post Guinnies_Moustache, very well done.

thanks.

It's high time therefore that PIT invests in building their D (and G), their F is already top notch. IMHO, Staal should not be traded, he is the best defensively aware C the Pens have (few mistakes this series notwithstanding, especially Couturier's OT goal in Game 1!)

Shero tried to invest HEAVILY in the D and it backfired with Martin and somewhat with Michalek.
Last season the D was stellar winning many 1 goal games down the stretch to make it to the playoffs with Crosby, Malkin, Kunitz and Staal for a lot of the season. MAF also sucked for a month and sat for another but it was the D (and a 25 game scoring streak) that carried the team.

Martin for some reason lost his groove in the system and often looked lost out there.
Michalek blocks a ton of shots but needs to bring some more to the table.

I would sign Cedrick Desjardins and see what he can do. He is a UFA and I think that he could do some damage in the NHL. He has shone almost everywhere he has played, look up his numbers.

That is a VERY interesting idea and for the right price, that could prove to be a steal. Give CD some ok money and 20-25 games (if he plays well) and that could really keep Fleury focused.

i like this one.

Move TK, resign Niskanen, Staal and Sid. See about moving Matt Cooke. Sign a good goalie to backup MAF.

It'd be interesting to see what they could get from TK. He did have a strong second half after coming back from injury.

Cooke is a gem. I can't see him being moved.

why not? pens have more than enough offense, and they can easily sign a veteran forward to bring what staal does to the table defensively. wouldnt staal be the perfect defensively forward that trotz would love to have on his team? maybe staal + martin for weber?

Staal + Martin for Suter + Lindback? There are already too many shooters on the PP (even though they don't seem to score that often) and Weber would further clog that up.
Letang-Orpik, Suter-Depres, Michalek-Niskanen/Engelland
not too shabby, doubtful i know.

[Carcillo]

why not? pens have more than enough offense, and they can easily sign a veteran forward to bring what staal does to the table defensively. wouldnt staal be the perfect defensively forward that trotz would love to have on his team? maybe staal + martin for weber?

There is absolutely no way Nashville does that deal. No way. I love Staal and everything he brings to the table but Weber is worth way more than that.

I won't get too much into it, but as has been said I think that the Pens need a capable back-up goalie to push MAF. Should that goalie push hard enough to force a trade (think Vancouver here) then so be it, the more assets the better.

I would sign Cedrick Desjardins and see what he can do. He is a UFA and I think that he could do some damage in the NHL. He has shone almost everywhere he has played, look up his numbers.

There is a reason why Desjardins has been bouncing around and is still in the minors. There is no way Penguins can rely on him as their backup next year. Not with the way Flower played in these playoffs. Penguins will need a proven backup like Biron, Clemmensen, Hedberg. Not someone who's career minor leaguer at this point in his career.

Desjardins is worth of a gamble but only as a 3rd goalie going into the season.

I'm a HUGE Morrow fan and i thought he earned a spot out of camp but letting him gain more experience in junior and in the A will only do great things for him.
I'm thinking along the lines of the way St. Louis brought up Pietrangelo, maxing out his junior eligibility, playing in big time WJC games, getting bigger/stronger and developing man strength, that worked out well!

Yeah. No need to rush Morrow. First we need to bring up Despres, Strait and Bortuzzo. Despres has earned a roster spot IMO. Strait and Bortuzzo will lose their waiver exemption so they need to brought up or we'll risk losing them for free. Both are ready for NHL IMO. So Morrow will face a tough battle for roster spot and you can't rely too much on rookies on D. Morrow can use atleast a year in the AHL.

Staal + Martin for Suter + Lindback? There are already too many shooters on the PP (even though they don't seem to score that often) and Weber would further clog that up.
Letang-Orpik, Suter-Depres, Michalek-Niskanen/Engelland
not too shabby, doubtful i know.

Suter is UFA. No way Staal gets traded for him. Just sit and wait until he hits the free agency and then make your pitch to get him.

[Flyer Fan]

Well, at the risk of having my internet and cable service terminated by Comcast (and possibly being shipped off to a "re-education" camp), I can give you a Flyers fan's perspective on what the Pens need to do:

Not much.

I think the roster's well put together, two weeks ago it was considered the cup favorite, and all that's happened since then is that their goalie went through a bit of a slump, they ran into another one of the best built rosters, with one of the best coaches, and probably the one of the hottest powerplays in recent memory.

I think there were mistakes made that can be learned from: Blysma's focusing them on battling rather than playing, and allowing Laviolette to get the line match ups he wanted being the biggest ones, ...and the young players like Crosby, Letang,Malkin, and Neal just learning from the experience of how to better handle adversity, will make them better equipped to handle future playoffs/better players/better captains etc.

I think Fleury, despite his struggles in this particular series, is a proven commodity, an upgrade over Johsnon is a must, but prior to this season, Johnson was one of the better backups to have imho.

Regardless there should be a suitable low priced veteran available through free agency.

I think the Crosby, Malkin, Staal combination up the middle the best combo in the league, and wouldn't consider touching it. Maybe adding an inexpensive veteran checking center (ala Talbot) who would be an upgrade as a third line winger for Staal, but could shift over and handle the shutdown role so Staal could move up to the wing a little more with the top two lines might get even more production out of Staal)

I do think, the Pens could benefit from an upgrade on the wing (as has been the case for years now), ...particularly because their centers are so strong, guys like Sullivan and Kunitz who are adequate top six wingers on most teams, on this particular with these centers, aren't quite up to snuff. The Flyers kind of went through that last year when they found out that having Giroux, Briere, Richards, and Carter also meant they had to come up with wingers with enough skill to play with them, which is why they paid a first rounder for Versteeg, because they needed someone better than Dan Carcillo and Andreas Nodl to play with Richards, ...I think the Pens are in the same boat, and even more so on account of Crosby and Malkin having the capability of playing at such a high level, ...at this point Neal seems to be the only winger truly capable of matching that.

(I know alot is being made of Giroux "outplaying" Crosby, but Giroux got a lot of help and support from his line mates; Jagr and Hartnell were both forces in this series, they created space, drew attention, turned over pucks, made great passes etc...., Crosby and MAlkin had guy like Kunitz, who I honestly don't remember noticing expect when he took a few awful penalties) and the fading Sullivan, who aren't bad players, they just don't give the big guns as much help as other teams top guys get from their line mates (Neal obviously being the exception)

But given Sullivan and Kunitz's cap hits, it might be hard for Shero to find an affordable upgrade

The bottom of the roster's solid, nice role players, inexpensive, etc. I think for his cap hit, and what he provides on and off the ice, Asham's worth bringing back as a fourth liner.


The Defense, I don't think is as bad some seem to think, I think the Flyers are a very deep, very fast team, that plays a very aggressive, and physical forechecking game that forces mistakes, and puts a lot of pressure on a defensive unit top to bottom.

Letang looked great, I think Niskanen did excellent, and is worth keeping. Orpik,Michalek and Martin might have looked a little slow at times, but again, i think that was more the opponent than the players.

I do think Martin has regressed for whatever reason from his days as a Devil, ...and given his cap hit, he's probably worth moving out(even if they have to pay someone to take his contract) in favor of a younger, cheaper, faster replacement, but that's more of a cap management move than a hockey move.

I thought Despres looked like he belongs, and maybe an upgrade over Lovejoy talent wise would have been a good depth move at the deadline.

But, to be honest, I'm kind of reaching for ways to improve what's already a dynamite team, ...there's really not a lot to be done, or can be done, just minor tweaks., I think the growth in the young players from having been through the experience can and will make more of an improvement than the roster tweaking will.

(This is of course, all totally off the record, and I'll deny every word of it, ...I am after all a Flyers fan So my for the record response is officially : Blow it up! Trade Crosby, trade Malkin, trade Neal, trade Letang, trade Staal, fire Blysma, fire Shero, sign Semin, trade for Nash, bring back Rico Fata)

[Carcillo]

Good post Flyer Fan.

Orpik,Michalek and Martin might have looked a little slow at times, but again, i think that was more the opponent than the players.

It's not about the matchup with these guys as all of them struggled all year long. Michalek and Martin were horrible until December, then improved a bit, were playing great hockey when the team was on a great run (from mid-January until two weeks before the playoffs started) but then regressed again. Especially Martin who was just plain bad the last few weeks of the season and the playoffs. Orpik was struggling basically all year.

[Mr Zizzla]

@Flyer Fan

Amazing analysis and you're right, if the Pens held on for game one or got a lucky OT winner, the series is different and the Pens (even if the series was set to go 7) would still be called the favourites.

As you know, as well as most Penguins fans, the forecheck of the Flyers killed the Pens because they got it deep, made them turn and came in fast. Bylsma plays a system where the goal is to get the puck of out the D zone as fast as possible while using North-South passes to break out and into the O zone. I didn't see this happen at all. The Flyers forced them to play down low and work the corners and they were exposed.
It's clear that the team defense and Fleury really lost the series for them but Bylsma couldn't out coach Laviolette and counter their attack. I've never seen the Pens D and PK scramble around so much and leave so many players open.

Anyway, Martin has got to go and if he doesn't get traded (i think Shero could get something for him) then hopefully the CBA doesn't change too much, he can get buried and he will become the RICHEST MAN IN WILKES-BARRE SCRANTON!

[grindin griers]

As far as Martin goes, was he really that bad? What skill set is he supposed to bring to the table? I ask this because I know the Wild need a D-man and for some reason I get a feeling if they don't get one in FA they will trade for one, which possibly could be Martin. He is a MN native afterall

p.s. I am not one of those crazy MN fans that want all Minnesotans on their team.

[Carcillo]

Anyway, Martin has got to go and if he doesn't get traded (i think Shero could get something for him) then hopefully the CBA doesn't change too much, he can get buried and he will become the RICHEST MAN IN WILKES-BARRE SCRANTON!

That's not going to happen. Pittsburgh isn't an organisation who buries one-way contracts to minors - let alone a big contract like Martin's. Besides, Martin's NMC guarantees he stays in Pittsburgh if he doesn't get traded.

[Carcillo]

As far as Martin goes, was he really that bad? What skill set is he supposed to bring to the table? I ask this because I know the Wild need a D-man and for some reason I get a feeling if they don't get one in FA they will trade for one, which possibly could be Martin. He is a MN native afterall

p.s. I am not one of those crazy MN fans that want all Minnesotans on their team.

Last year Martin-Michalek pairing was great after a short transition period from the start of the season. Big reason why Penguins kept winning those low scoring games after Crosby and Malkin went down. They did great job in shutting down the opponents top guys. This year both struggled and that pairing was broken up early into the season. Martin was shaky most of the season and never seemed to be comfortable back there all year.

Martin is a solid, mobile puck-moving two-way D-men. He's been used in more of a shutdown role and sound positioning is his biggest strength. He can log big minutes. But he also makes stupid mistakes - too often this year. He's also soft as butter and can't really play on PP.

[grindin griers]

Last year Martin-Michalek pairing was great after a short transition period from the start of the season. Big reason why Penguins kept winning those low scoring games after Crosby and Malkin went down. They did great job in shutting down the opponents top guys. This year both struggled and that pairing was broken up early into the season. Martin was shaky most of the season and never seemed to be comfortable back there all year.

Martin is a solid, mobile puck-moving two-way D-men. He's been used in more of a shutdown role and sound positioning is his biggest strength. He can log big minutes. But he also makes stupid mistakes - too often this year. He's also soft as butter and can't really play on PP.

Interesting. Sounds like we have someone like that to a lesser extent in Gilbert. Wouldn't be bad having two but MN really needs someone that can play the PP and has a good shot. Thanks!

[Carcillo]

Interesting. Sounds like we have someone like that to a lesser extent in Gilbert. Wouldn't be bad having two but MN really needs someone that can play the PP and has a good shot. Thanks!

If you need a D-man who can shoot the puck, Paul Martin isn't the guy you want. He's got a weak-ass shot.

[Nehithaw]

The bottom of the roster's solid, nice role players, inexpensive, etc. I think for his cap hit, and what he provides on and off the ice, Asham's worth bringing back as a fourth liner.

Nice post Flyer Fan, this is what I agree with totally.

Asham has heart and is a great teammate.

I've always thought that the Pens organization has failed to protect their stars. Lemieux had no back-up, Malkin and Crosby never really had a capable back-up that would be there within seconds of being roughed up. Asham got my respect when our guy got angled into the boards and crushed by an oncoming Flyer (Schenn) and Asham rips right into him with a crosscheck as if to say "don't **** with my team and don't **** with my stars".

He may not be all that big but he does what he can to protect his teammates. That he can skate/play is a bonus.